xXInkedPhoenixX

Hi fishy friends just putting in an update since I haven't for a bit. So my first 2 generations of baby Otos have been coming along very nicely in the grow out tank. I've had no casualties to speak of there. They are so pretty to watch in the evenings or early mornings when they all surf the sides of the tank. Mid days they all kind of hide out- seeing only a half dozen or so move across the tank from time to time. I bought some plants attached to rocks for their bare bottom tank and have been regretting it because eventhough I dipped them, I now have detrius worms floating all over that tank- I've been battling them since I put the plants in there with no end in sight despite daily water changes. 😐 All of that and the plants died anyway. I gave the seller a bad review, that was a fun back and forth- first saying I dipped them too long if they all died but if I indeed did that then the worms should have also died yeah? Anyway, I don't like giving a bad review but the only warning was about potential snails....that aside... It should only be about another month before I can take both Gen1 and Gen2 to the LFS to trade them. Most of Gen1 is ready at about an inch but since they are now mixed I figure I'll just do it all at once. I have 6 of Gen3 left in a floating breeder (lost one unfortunately to unknown circumstances, looked beautifully healthy- hope it's not because of the detrius worms). The 6 of them (hopefully they all survive) will be going to a friend. I think the parent tank is taking a break from breeding. I'm guessing a combination of my disruption/redesign of their tank (no hitchhikers from the plants there- purchased from a different vendor) (which messed with water parameters that I'm still monitoring) AND I'm going to bet the tank temperature has something to do with it, as since we're going into hotter weather my A/C is on and instead of the balmy 77-78 degrees we are back in that time of year where it is 74-76 degrees. This is a hunch. I guess we'll see. No good pictures of the kids but I'll post a pic of the parent tank, you will see a marked difference- I've had a good amount of plant growth in just a couple of weeks which I'm very pleased with.

Hi Jeannie, welcome to the forum. Don't lose heart. When I started my 20 gallon tank, I ran it for a month before adding fish, also with FritzZyme. To be honest I couldn't tell you if it ever cycled but my water tests were good. I added my Harlequins AND my first Otos into my tank. Everything seemed to be going ok for the first few days then I started losing Otos. I lost all but 1 of my first batch, the LFS I got them from made it seem like it was all my fault (said I needed a heater, I was running low tech, and in the end it wasn't because I'm not running a heater). All of my Harlequins were fine. Then I got an Ich outbreak- likely caused by the dying Otos. I treated that- everybody still lived. Things evened out. I eventually got more Otos, quarantined, treated for Ich TOO, they all lived. Now I have a tank that's super happy, and my Otos breed, baffling me entirely. In the end I believe the Otos I got, as wildcaught otos very often can, died because they weren't fed or treated properly before they got to me- and though I did hours and hours of research and kinda knew that it didn't stop me from feeling bad and thinking I did something wrong. Alternate scenario. Later I started a 2nd 20 gallon, this time everything was right, even had an old filter to immediately cycle the tank from the tank above. I put a half dozen Black Neon Tetras in the tank. I found one dead the next day. What did I do?! I thought maybe I should have started with more since they're more comfortable and maybe they died of stress. Then I found another one dead. So I went back to the store and got more- because that was still my logic- there was nothing visually wrong with the dead or the live ones and otherwise acted normal. Well in the end after I added more to the tank more did die- and you know what? I finally discovered (because the little brats were doing it at night) were killing EACH OTHER. Apparently they offed everybody they didn't like because now I've been holding steady at 10 for a good while now- however I still see them picking on each other more than I'd like them to. Lesson? Maybe you are NOT doing anything at all wrong. The danios yes create ammonia but probably not a lot to be able to read on any tests because that's a decent sized tank (and what little ammonia they are producing could already be, being absorbed in the cycle, you don't want to see ammonia reading anyway really). Just keep going. Your tetra? I'm thinking something similar to my situation with my tetras. Maybe it was getting bullied, or maybe it just tried to hide and got stuck- accidently killed themselves. It does happen. It's disheartening- but we learn stuff from our mistakes- IF they even ARE mistakes. As a famous fish once said, "Just keep swimming" 🙂

@Gideyon yeah there really isn't much of a selection but they have the basics at least, java, swords, anubias. I can get the fancier plants from my other vendor. @GanonDwarf2 well that's the other option, lol, (pea puffer) I thought about that for a fat minute and would love to have one, but I really really really don't want anymore tanks. (shocking I know).

Most of the small snails start out like a speck of dirt so I don't think you'll ever spot the eggs so it will be an ongoing issue unless someone else here has experience. As I said most people I think give up and let them stay or do what I'm doing. The only non squishing way without endangering your other tank inhabitants is to trap them with food (like the romaine trick I've been told about). Personally, all my plants now get a 1:20 bleach to water solution dip- but people also swear by an alum dip (Aquarium Co-Op has a video on plant dipping- with Irene). I also found a seller that guarantees no snails- so from this point forward I only either buy from them, or buy the Top Fin plants they sell at the big chain pet stores- I've never had an issue with those.

I am hoping, like you it isn't, I had a fish with dropsy, in fact the one I use for my profile, my betta Kimono, no idea how he got it and though he got a little better with treatment he didn't make it. He was swollen on both sides but one more than the other and you could see (just barely) that all the scales on the main part of his body where "pineconing" meaning raised. Take a look at the fish from the top and see if it's just that side. My HOPE for you is that it's just an after effect of breeding/having babies and maybe in a day or three it'll be gone or less swollen at least. If there's no change it's a possibility. Hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Come up with a plan for treatment now just in case you have to.

Hi GanonDwarf, welcome to the forum. You will find there are a lot of people here that are very much in the pro-snail camp. I am in the pro-snail camp of the snails I can control breeding- like nerites and mystery snails. I've decided that for ME- eventhough I asked fellow forum members to convince me- not really into bladder, pond or prolific breeder snails. I also had some hitchhikers and have been doing DAILY culling (no other way to put it but daily squishing- I'm really not enjoying that part). You can also put a piece of romaine in the tank and apparently they gravitate towards it and you can remove that as they gather. You can also get yourself an Assasin snail who hunts and eats them. Now I know you said you're not fond of snails so that may not be an option but if they get ouf of control that's my plan- maybe you can ask your local fish store if you can "borrow" one, meaning buy it and return it to the store (not likely to get your money back). Honestly I thought it more humane to squish them than to have an assasin snail kill them- but that's just me. I have been putting some of them in my algae ridden bird bath, but I have nowhere else for them to go. Good luck.

BABIES!!!!!!!😍

One of my snails sits that way often, I worry about her sometimes but she seems to do fine and is my oldest and largest snail. My other female has a crack in her shell that seems healed and to be honest I'm not sure where she got it as I've had her since she was little and her shell was beautiful then. Mystery snail shells also get flaws when moved from tank to tank when there's a change in water parameters, one breeder on youtube doesn't like to move them for that reason alone.

I agree with @Isaac M, I was thinking about adding one to my new aquarium and potentially moving one of my 3 Mystery Snails and while "they" say it's unlikely it CAN happen. I like my Mytery Snails too much to risk them.

I had a 5 gallon that was running pre-pandemic. I started my 20H in Sept 2020, baby Otos appeared in March 2021. I too, started with an HOB and now run a sponge and an air driven corner filter. This month decided to do a complete overhaul so it no longer looks like the original tank design. I have an unknown number of Otos running about.

Pygmies are awful cute. You can do a mix of Cories and Otos tales have been told they do well together. I had an albino cory growing up and I loved the little thing. I have a soft spot for albino animals, they're not to everyone's taste- but often they are the last to be picked of of most animals (fish, snakes, rabbits, rats, hamsters on and on and on). The white of an albino cory looks great in my friend's tank, they stand out and move like a herd of tiny white horses in the sand

My friend has 10 albino corycats, they don't eat algae. They just eat food not caught by the tetras and she says they're pigs because she gives them more food on top of that. My Otos keep my tank sparkling. Especially now since I don't even know how many I actually have!

Short update. So Generation 1, of which there are 24 (or at least when I was able to record their numbers in the breeder and having had 1 pass in the sponge intake cover for the HOB (that issue now resolved with a bit of fishnet stocking as the BETTER pre-filter- go figure). Generation 2 joined them this week of which there are 29. Most of Gen1 is reaching about an inch or just under at 2 months and 1 day old (from the 1st one found). Most of Gen2 is under the half inch mark but because there ARE 29 they were mosh pitting quite a bit in there and I had some casualties likely because of it as nobody appears to be sick otherwise, they are all now 1 month and 2 days old (from the 1st one found). There are 6 of generation 3, 1 of which was found today past the translucent stage so that little one made it during my overhaul of the tank and escaped Rasbora mouths for at least 3-4 days. Their tank with the new light is now 80 to nearly 82 degrees during the peak of the day (no heater) and down to 77-78 at night. The dimmer switch I got for the light actually messes with the connection so I'm going full power on the light right now and since that might hel algae growth I'm going to go with it and see how the plants and animals do. I have been putting a large slice of cucumber on a veggie clip in both the parent tank and the Romper Room grow out. No takers in the parent tank that I've observed- but the cucumber in the grow out tank from yesterday had bits floating at the top leading me to believe they made a good dent in it last night. I did their daily water change today and put in a nice new chunk of cucumber and got a pic of a small gang chowing down about an hour after it was put in there. I'll include a couple pics.

@the other Irene Yes, I'd agree, it's been neat to raise them, I don't like the "giving away, selling, trading" part of the whole thing. I had that problem with I fostered shelter animals. Little crack in my heart every time. I've not seen Repashy in any of the stores I've been in, I'll have to look harder.

Honestly, just watch them. It's pretty obvious who is male and who is not after a while. I have 1 male and 2 females. He's constantly on them.

I've learned my lesson recently. I'm going bleach dip everything from now on. 🙃 Even then I might keep them in a tub of water for a bit.

Like the rest of us, we're just staying put a lot lately. 🙃 Better than mine, they're always attached to each other. Can't imagine they're getting much cleaning done that way.

Hi, both times I've had Ich in 2 different tanks there were Otos present and they all made it through. Sadly I cannot advise with Ich-X but I treated with full dose instructions the first time with heat and API Super Ick Cure and the second time NO heat and Seachem Paraguard (that time it was all Otos in my Q tank). I did see a thread within the last few days that said IchX cannot be used with Fritz water conditioner (due to some sulfur base) and that's what I use- but I have not seen any conflict with Prime. You may be able to find the answer on SeaChem's website or shoot them an email. They're usually pretty responsive.

@Gator frankly sometimes I wish we had a lot less technology. In order to avoid things like your phone debacle. I like organized chaos with an eye of the storm so to speak- I guess in this tank it's Buddha, for some reason I felt like he needed to be in there. Like my tanks my house is very much that style- but everyone who enters seems fascinated and loves it. I have a couple of bonsai. Teacher always said take the best of inspiration but never copy, they cannot speak but they tell you things. It's not just a bonsai philosophy. ...and thanks for that bit of FL history... 🙂

Oh and if you have any invertebrates remove them, treatment isn't great for them and they may not survive it. I raised my pH by adding some crushed coral to my tank, it took time to raise it, so it's not an instant cure but it's a good buffer. I started with a half cup in my substrate and added just little bits more to my tank until it was the right amount and my pH was steady. It's a bit easier if you can put it in an HOB or canister filter.

Hi there, if you want someone's direct attention here it's best to tag them by typing out the @ sign and then their screen name so they know you tagged them so in this case @Cory and hopefully he'll see my tag and look at your questions. In the meantime I found a helpful chart on a website with a list of medications that treat different kinds of fish illness, MAYBE, hopefully some are available in your area, so under that chart look at the medications listed for FUNGUS and for WHITESPOT. I would say if theres only one ich cure in Canada then it's the one you use! Malachite Green is very very common in that kind of medication, just be prepared for it to turn things green, it fades over time. As to your other medication, I'm hoping you can get one off this list. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwfishmeds.htm

I've had Ich in two different tanks at different times. The first time I used API Super Ick Cure and heat (84 degrees), daily water changes due to the heat raising ammonia from faster decay as well as speeding up the ich cycle so be aware of that. The 2nd time I treated with Seachem Paraguard and no heat. Both times I was succesful, both times I medicated until it was 7 days AFTER the LAST of the spots were seen. So there are many ways to see the light at the end of the icky tunnel. 🙂 Good luck!

I have heard good tale about Amanos doing a good job on hair algae but haven't gotten any yet. I had a problem for a bit with hair algae in my 20 gallon and I'm low tech with no ferts (well I put in some root tabs but have decided to stop doing that it gives me more problems than benefits). What helped for me was lowering the intensity of the light- I put a dimmer switch on my light- I could have programmed it but it's more a pain than I care to deal with). I still had my lights on from 8:45 to 6:30 at night and an hour of moonlight. My plants have all been fine and the hair algae went bye bye.

Thanks @Gator. I wanted when I orginally started the tank to have something zen in it- so I had a large temple (which could be seen near the beginning of this thread). I liked the look but because ultimately it took up a lot of real estate and the fish didn't use it I pulled it out when the Otos started breeding. I wanted to add more plants anyway so that gave me a good amount of space to work with but not a lot of room for any of my other zen statuary. So, when I saw the tiny Buddha I had to get him. He's grey, but so light he really is more white than anything, hoping he gets a nice patina on him with some green or brown (though the Otos are keeping the tank super clean so very little chance of that happening). I would like to see pictures of your tanks you start your own thread yet?

@Gator nope, the adult Otos will leave them alone, they should be fine. I've seen zero aggression from parent to baby either translucent or young juvenile. Speaking of which, I released Generation 2 into the general population of the 10 gallon grow out (see pic, empty large breeder). I've found 2 deceased in the last 2 days in the large breeder and I believe it's more from blunt force trauma than anything else- It was getting to be like a mosh pit in there. Hopefully there will be no more losses. @gardenman I did end up using a turkey baster to remove a couple of the smaller ones that I was concerned about being in gen pop. I was still nervous about using it but it does work. I've put a piece of cucumber in with a veggie clip both there and the parent tank, not too many takers so far but will repeat the process every 24hrs to see if I can develop a habit with them. I'm having issues with detrius worms due to some new plants- despite having dipped and quarantined them they are all over the 10 gallon grow out. I know they're not a "problem" per se but I'm pretty miffed about it. Had to take the sponge pre-filter off the HOB and modify a piece of fishnet stocking with a rubberband to better filter the tank and take most of those obnoxious worms with it but no baby Otos. I think it's a good thing that it's a bare bottom tank. Haven't seen momma fish up near her spot- granted I've uprooted the tank and rearranged stuff (not her spot though- in fact now it's more protected). Since I got more substrate I also decided to move pots again it was disrupted twice in 2 days (wood looking pot move to top of "pyramid"). I'm hoping she's goiing to take a break for a while- and if she gave up entirely I'd be ok with that too to be honest. It's been cool but I'm starting to get sad I have to give up my babies. This is one of many reasons I didn't want breeding fish