Reverse Respiration

[Bev C]

@clovenpine and @DebSills   so glad you are going to try this The Reverse Respiration has done wonders for me ,,, i had plants that i was going to trash and the Reverse Respiration helped my  all year algae problem allot  

the plants is slowly growing back in   but i have slow growing plants ,,,and the algae is not coming back  

you will still need to adjust light intensity and time  and adjust the fertilizer for you plants though 

Edited October 6, 2022 by Bev C

[DebSills]

Most of my plants were a bit too far gone for this process - I'm still working on my Anubias nana, because I don't want to let it go, but I'm going to probably end up losing more than half of the leaves to the BBA, its just too stuck on there...I was able to save some of my stems (of course I completely failed to take before/after pics 😖) I will definitely be using this process in the future (I got a black small trash can and a black towel for the top...worked really well!)

I still have a few plants to put back in my 29, so I'll try to post some after pics in the next day or two 🙂 

[PerceptivePesce]

I just put 2 types of Java fern, 2 types of bolbitis, and 1 anubias in a food grade bucket with club soda for a 12 hour soak.

Im a total newb with a 4 day old tank.  I added store bought enzymes and have been ghost feeding.  The water is remineralized rodi 4dGH & 4dKH.  I have easy green ferts to add.

Maybe I should have waited to order plants but I couldn't control myself. Pray for me and my plants!

[Guppysnail]

On 10/13/2022 at 9:36 PM, PerceptivePesce said:

I just put 2 types of Java fern, 2 types of bolbitis, and 1 anubias in a food grade bucket with club soda for a 12 hour soak.

Im a total newb with a 4 day old tank.  I added store bought enzymes and have been ghost feeding.  The water is remineralized rodi 4dGH & 4dKH.  I have easy green ferts to add.

Maybe I should have waited to order plants but I couldn't control myself. Pray for me and my plants!

Did you buy these at a pet store in plastic tubes by chance?  These three types are commonly sold this way with the roots in gel but the leaves are not in water. 
Either way these plants do great with seltzer. But if they were bought in plastic tubes those are safe. They are grown above water and not in contact with aquatic critters so contain no pests or algae. 
Thanks for giving it a try. I have tested on all three types during trials. They will be fine. Best of luck with your new tank. I hope you find great joy in it. 

[PerceptivePesce]

On 10/13/2022 at 9:32 PM, Guppysnail said:

Did you buy these at a pet store in plastic tubes by chance?  These three types are commonly sold this way with the roots in gel but the leaves are not in water. 
Either way these plants do great with seltzer. But if they were bought in plastic tubes those are safe. They are grown above water and not in contact with aquatic critters so contain no pests or algae. 
Thanks for giving it a try. I have tested on all three types during trials. They will be fine. Best of luck with your new tank. I hope you find great joy in it. 

Thanks for the positive vibes! 

I bought them from an online retailer.  They arrived in rockwool, in net pots, and individually sealed in a plastic sleeve/bag.  I removed the rockwool before soaking.

[Odd Duck]

On 10/13/2022 at 9:53 PM, PerceptivePesce said:

Thanks for the positive vibes! 

I bought them from an online retailer.  They arrived in rockwool, in net pots, and individually sealed in a plastic sleeve/bag.  I removed the rockwool before soaking.

Good you soaked them, then.  👍🏻

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Anybody try this on a Marimo Ball?

I'm guessing since it's actually not moss this might have an adverse effect?

(sorry if I missed someone's post if they have)

Edited October 14, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[Guppysnail]

On 10/14/2022 at 12:29 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Anybody try this on a Marimo Ball?

I'm guessing since it's actually not moss this might have an adverse effect?

(sorry if I missed someone's post if they have)

Yes. We tested it on Marimo and found it takes several extended repeats of RR to damage healthy algae in the marimo family. 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Ok, I'm doing this tonight before I get to bed! Here is my really sad "extra" 2.5 gallon plant tank. I would like to just treat the tank itself so I'm going to do that and use a little plastic wrap at the top (loosely) and throw a towel over it (which will just help the darkness). It has 2 Marimo (1 large and 1 small) a small species of Amazon, Guppy Grass,  Narrow Leaf Java and the sponge filter (which I plan to leave in here just for giggles).

[Guppysnail]

On 10/21/2022 at 2:18 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Ok, I'm doing this tonight before I get to bed! Here is my really sad "extra" 2.5 gallon plant tank. I would like to just treat the tank itself so I'm going to do that and use a little plastic wrap at the top (loosely) and throw a towel over it (which will just help the darkness). It has 2 Marimo (1 large and 1 small) a small species of Amazon, Guppy Grass,  Narrow Leaf Java and the sponge filter (which I plan to leave in here just for giggles).

Drain as much water as possible. Move your filter out as seltzer will suffocate and kill the beneficial bacteria. Good luck I can’t wait to see it. 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

@Guppysnail I actually don't mind sacrificing the BB on the filter to see how clean the filter gets. I always have more bb "infested" sponges in my other tanks. I just want a reset on this tank. There are no other living creatures in here. I'll drain the tank of course and get as much water out of everything I can. I have two 2 liter generic seltzer water bottles to fill the tank as well. 

[Guppysnail]

On 10/21/2022 at 2:28 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

@Guppysnail I actually don't mind sacrificing the BB on the filter to see how clean the filter gets. I always have more bb "infested" sponges in my other tanks. I just want a reset on this tank. There are no other living creatures in here. I'll drain the tank of course and get as much water out of everything I can. I have two 2 liter generic seltzer water bottles to fill the tank as well. 

RR kills the algae etc but does not remove it. It will not “clean” it only kill it. It will look very much the same only possibly different color algae. Over time in a cycled tank it disappears. It took about 1-2 weeks for it to disappear in tanks with no shrimp or snails to eat it for me. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Guppysnail

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

On 10/21/2022 at 12:10 PM, Guppysnail said:

It will not “clean” it only kill it.

Totally understood, the filter has algae growing on it as well, which is why I want to soak it too. 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Well, I did the experiment last night so I could wake up to finish the project today. As a background for a complete post I have a 2.5 gallon glass tank that holds some of my "extra" plants. A small Amazon, 2 Marimo moss balls- one small and one large (the larger I'm concerned about as it is my "Frankenball" just barely holding itself together), some baby Java plants and rhizones, Guppy Grass. I had a bit of a crazy growth of hair and green algaes and since it was on a lower shelf of a stand just never got up the gumption to clean it, just topped it off and put ACO Easy Green in it every week (the only tank I fertilize btw). Here is a reminder of what the tank looked like: 

Of course I had to pull a lot of dead leaves and plants when I drained the tank.The tank got drained and dried out a bit, I didn't wipe it too hard as I wanted to leave the algae for the experiment. Here is the emptied tank:

I decided to also soak the sponge filter, as it was also covered in algae and plant matter. I know that kills the BB but since this is only a plant tank and I have plenty of sponges laying around I wanted to see the outcome here. Sorry, I neglected to take a GOOD pic of it, but it was covered in gunk- you can kind of see that in the above picture and just barely tell below (because it was already squeezed out/rinsed). It definitely needed a squeezing out. I dried off the plants best I could too: 

Then I took the tank and its inhabitants to my dining room (where it is darkest and now that it was night even darker), where there was a waiting towel and my 2 bottles. I knew I probably didn't have enough (probably should have gotten 3 but I didn't know at the time I was doing the experiment in the tank itself) but I was going to cover what I could with this:

This brand was DEFINITELY fizzy enough- though I barely moved it from the kitchen to the dining room it wanted to pop right out of the bottle when I opened it and while pouring (I swear one of the lids already was domed from pressure). Then the tank got loosely covered in plastic wrap (because this tank has no lid) and then covered completely with a towel. The 12 hour timer was set on my phone.

********INTERMISSION*****************

My timer went off at a reasonable hour (read: after I got up and was able to have coffee, feed my tanks and cats, read for a bit and eat a freshly baked muffin). I had already started to set up the soak for the plants, handy portable battery and air pump assisting me along with a Rubbermaid tub (I wouldn't normally use my Rubbermaid- I mean c'mon this stuff is expensive but it was only for 30 mins and I wanted a  clear picture for the forum- everthing else I had wouldn't have worked). 

Plants came out and got put in the tub (Marimos got squeezed out before placed): 

The tank, as suspected didn't get enough seltzer water but you can kind of see the dividing line where the water did hit as compared with where it did not- the algae is much greener and more solid where it didn't: 

So it got scrubbed with super hot water while the plants got their water soak (tap with dechlorinator). Then it got set up with the SUPER clean sponge- I was impressed how much MORE gunk came out of the sponge even after having squeezed it out last night- it went on for days and days (ok not technically but it took a while). Any brown you see in the below pic is just the light- there is a totally black sponge there. It's pretty much clean as new. Took zero effort to clean the uptake tube as well- just my finger- no scrubbing. 

So then the tank got put back on its shelf with its (admittedly crappy- those are supposedly white bulbs) light. Got dechlorinated water and some ACO Easy Green. 

Plants got put back after trimming off more dead plant material I didn't see yesterday (I tied the Amazon with a  thread and used a bit of airline and airline suction cup to attach it to the wall lower so that it wasn't floating like before). The tank is clearly much cleaner than I could have gotten it if I'd just taken it and done it the old way. In the coming days I'm hoping to see improvement here- especially with my Marimo which have been suffering and have quite a bit of brown on them (they did even before the plant-pocolypse). (Oh and yes I did grab that floating brown bit of Java after I saw it in the pic)

Again this is a reminder of what it looked like and the after side by side:

This is an AWESOME experiment. Thank you to all who worked so hard on it. It's definitely NO JOKE and will likely work minor miracles in many peoples' tanks and have super cool applications elsewhere. Amazing really! We're all very lucky to have such a cool corner of the internet. 

Edited October 22, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX
Typos are lame

[Guppysnail]

@xXInkedPhoenixX that looks fabulous. The side by side before and after tank is such a stark contrast. Thank you for giving it a go and sharing your results. I’m glad you are pleased with it. 🤗

[PerceptivePesce]

I got a few more plants. 3 anubias and a buce.  I gave them the RR treatment at 1:30pm, so now I'll be here all night waiting for 1:30am. :D

[Guppysnail]

On 10/25/2022 at 12:10 AM, PerceptivePesce said:

I got a few more plants. 3 anubias and a buce.  I gave them the RR treatment at 1:30pm, so now I'll be here all night waiting for 1:30am. 😄

This does not help you now but myself and others have gone 18+ hours. Life happens and that’s another great thing about RR. The extra time on plants like anubias and buce does no harm. 

[A3M0N]

On 10/13/2022 at 9:32 PM, Guppysnail said:

They are grown above water and not in contact with aquatic critters so contain no pests or algae. 

Awesome! I came here to ask this question. I ordered some plants (happy birthday to me!) from a small farm that grows emersed and cuts to order and was wondering if they would need to get the RR treatment, or if it would do any good. 

[Guppysnail]

I still would. Snails, dragonfly/Damselfly larvae, planaria etc can still be on the roots. The risk is lower than submerged grown but since RR does not damage plants it is better to be safe than sorry. 
 

HAPPY  BIRTHDAY 🎂 🎉 

Edited November 1, 2022 by Guppysnail

[Solstice_Lacer]

Has anyone tried adding liquid co2 booster to the seltzer water? For maximum co2!

Edited November 2, 2022 by Solstice_Lacer
Specificity

[Guppysnail]

On 11/2/2022 at 5:58 PM, Solstice_Lacer said:

Has anyone tried adding liquid co2 booster to the seltzer water? For maximum co2!

No we have not the goal was to be as simple and cheap as possible while being completely chemical free. My understanding is most co2 boosters are not co2. Some I understand are even gluteraldehydes that damage plants and can harm pets as well as humans. 

[dasaltemelosguy]

On 11/2/2022 at 2:58 PM, Solstice_Lacer said:

Has anyone tried adding co2 booster to the seltzer water? For maximum co2!

That's a really interesting thought. If I were to venture a guess and it is a guess, seltzer is carbonated at 300%+ of the atmospheric CO2 pressure so I imagine a booster would be eclipsed by this if added to the mix.

One indicator might be the pH. There's enough CO2 in seltzer to drop the pH to only 3 so I imagine it what a booster could add would be relatively small comparatively.

I've personally tried and witnessed that milder carbonated beverages like Perrier simply did not work at all for Reverse Respiration. Perrier, I believe had a pH of about 6 which is a direct indicator of far less carbonation.

I don't have the data on hand, but I have seen that the CO2 saturation potential with a SodaStream and the like can exceed this and drop the Ph as low as 2.5. Since CO2 in water results in a mild acid, carbonic in this case, it's an indirect indicator of how much CO2 is in the solution. 

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by dasaltemelosguy
Dupe removed

[Solstice_Lacer]

How about this one: adding baking soda to the carbonated water ?

[Guppysnail]

On 11/3/2022 at 12:58 PM, Solstice_Lacer said:

How about this one: adding baking soda to the carbonated water ?

Help me out. I’m not sure what you are looking to accomplish by adding baking soda?  Something other than algae or pest removal?  Just RR is completely effective as is so I see no need to alter it.

Im not the water chemistry guru but adding baking soda raises ph from my understanding and would negate the ph shifting needed for egg and algae removal  

I know you are working on growing moss in sparkling water (looking forward to seeing your results) but for pest and algae removal RR is complete. 

[Solstice_Lacer]

On 11/3/2022 at 1:29 PM, Guppysnail said:

 

Im not the water chemistry guru but adding baking soda raises ph from my understanding and would negate the ph shifting needed for egg and algae removal  

I guess that makes sense. I'm just a curious mad scientist, and as noted, not all seltzer are equal in carbonation, so I wondered if there's easy ways to increase it. I guess just buying the bubbliest from the beginning is easiest.