Fastest way to seed beneficial bacteria using sponge filters

[Axolponics]

Hi all, I have a heavily planted 20 long currently stocked with a juvenile axolotl and some shrimp, many years established with one sponge filter. I've been cycling a new 40 breeder for the axolotl since it's growing fast. I've moved over some free-floating plants and other decor items such as rocks to the 40b, and added a second, brand-new sponge filter to the 20 long so it can get colonized with BB in the established tank. The 40b  has a small aquaponics-type setup (a small submersible pump running water across lava rock before falling back into the tank) but no filter on it at the moment. 

 

My question is this: the old sponge filter from the 20 long needs a good cleaning. Some folks online seem to believe it seeding the new tank with mulm water (the dirty water left after squeezing the sponge clean). If it works to establish a colony of BB more quickly, I can clean it back out before moving the axolotl, but if all it's doing is just dumping waste into the tank I'll pass on that. Has anyone here had any success seeding a new tank with mulm/squeezings from an old sponge filter? Another option would be to just go ahead and move over the axolotl to the new tank, and move the established filter along with it (leaving the new sponge filter in the 20 long). I plan to use the 20 long as a shrimp grow-out tank only, so I am sure the substrate and plants will handle the bioload of the shrimp just fine. I just was hoping to grow some bacterial colonies in the tank tank on the substrate and in the aquaponics rocks before moving over the axie, since just the established sponge filter alone might have a hard time keeping up with the bioload. 

 

I appreciate anyone's thoughts. I've already dumped in a bottle of Tetra SafeStart, as well. I added ammonia to the new tank and it's dropped some but not entirely. 

[Vanish]

I am certain it helps. When you squeeze out the old sponge filter into the new tank, some of the beneficial bacteria fall off the old sponge filter and will look for a new home in the new tank. The mulm is breaking down and will also supply the system with some of the ammonia it needs to promote additional bacteria growth.

[Odd Duck]

I completely believe in “squeezins” AKA “juice” from an old sponge filter seeding a new sponge filter and do that often when seeding a brand new filter if I don’t have time to run the new filter in an established tank for at least a few weeks.

Your other idea of moving the older filter along with the lotl is also good since the lotl is probably the bulk of your bioload.  I would make sure the old filter “leaked” a little mulm into the old tank as you lift it out if you have any doubts if the new filter is properly seeded or not.  Just shake the old sponge lightly and you should get enough “juice” to seed the new one.

What type sponge is it?  If they happen to each be a double sponge style, you can swap one of the new for one old and have a new sponge and an old in each rank instantly.  Each new sponge will seed and mature with time.

[Axolponics]

Thank you both very much, I did clean the filter last night and add just a bit of mulm water directly onto the auaponic grow media and today have 1ppm nitrites so it's working! I appreciate it! I never thought of the benefit of using the dual sponge type filter, but that is genius and I will be buying those in the future for sure! 

[Andy's Fish Den]

I have seeded many new tanks with what I call "sponge grunge" I have even set up a quick quarantine tank by putting in water, adding prime, put a new sponge filter and squeezing a sponge filter from an established tank into the new one. Acclimate fish and add. 

[Odd Duck]

On 10/1/2021 at 8:41 AM, Axolponics said:

Thank you both very much, I did clean the filter last night and add just a bit of mulm water directly onto the auaponic grow media and today have 1ppm nitrites so it's working! I appreciate it! I never thought of the benefit of using the dual sponge type filter, but that is genius and I will be buying those in the future for sure! 

I actually am switching from the double sponge style to the ACO coarse sponge since they don’t clog nearly as much and are a lot easier to clean.  I do wish that ACO would consider developing a double sponge style with their coarse sponges.  @Cory have you considered this?  It would make starting a new tank easier and quicker, more new tanks equals more fish, filter, food, accessories sales.  Win, win.

[Lockdown Livebearers]

I know it doesn’t help your situation, but this is why all of my tanks have 2 sponge filters in them.  I’m always ready for a new tank by just moving one of the ‘extra’ sponge filters to the new tank.

[Torrey]

On 10/1/2021 at 11:46 AM, Odd Duck said:

I actually am switching from the double sponge style to the ACO coarse sponge since they don’t clog nearly as much and are a lot easier to clean.  I do wish that ACO would consider developing a double sponge style with their coarse sponges.  @Cory have you considered this?  It would make starting a new tank easier and quicker, more new tanks equals more fish, filter, food, accessories sales.  Win, win.

I just run 2 sponges in almost every tank, and reap the rewards of both worlds🤷‍♂️

[Odd Duck]

On 10/1/2021 at 11:35 PM, Torrey said:

I just run 2 sponges in almost every tank, and reap the rewards of both worlds🤷‍♂️

I have double sponges in my big tanks, but not my small tanks.  I also have HOB’s packed and prefiltered with sponges in nearly every tank.  Big believer in sponge filters, here!  😆 

Edit to add that my sponges and HOB’s are pretty much all oversized for their respective tanks except the big tanks, which is why they’re doubled up.  Large ACO’s x 2 in my 75 G and 100 G tanks.  Both also have HOB’s sized for 75 G flow x 2 with large ACO prefilters packed with a roughly equal to a large sponge filter volume of 30 ppi sponge blocks.  So I only have around 320 gallons of sponge filtration in each of those tanks with the equivalent of 3 large sponges counting them as 40 gallons of filtration each (x 2) plus 2 more large sponges.  Plus heavily planted in the 100 and what I consider moderately planted in the 75.  🤷🏻‍♀️

Edited October 2, 2021 by Odd Duck

[ARMYVET]

On 10/1/2021 at 1:46 PM, Odd Duck said:

do wish that ACO would consider developing a double sponge style with their coarse sponges.

If you have the height in the tank....the Coop sponges can be stacked together into a single tower double sponge.

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 7:17 AM, ARMYVET said:

If you have the height in the tank....the Coop sponges can be stacked together into a single tower double sponge.

So you’re saying I should add more filtration to my super-redundancy of sponge?  😆 

I’ll have to check into how to do that.  Do I just pop off the base and then the inner cage bits snap together?  Seems like adding a powerhead to a stack would make for a super sponge!

[ARMYVET]

On 10/2/2021 at 8:25 AM, Odd Duck said:

So you’re saying I should add more filtration to my super-redundancy of sponge?  😆 

I’ll have to check into how to do that.  Do I just pop off the base and then the inner cage bits snap together?  Seems like adding a powerhead to a stack would make for a super sponge!

Take the top off of the first sponge ...the one the air stone attaches to and set aside.....on the second sponge remove the base keeping the 2 cages and sponge with top together.  Snap that assembly onto the the first sponge assembly with the base and wallah....double sponge using one airline.

If you have a really deep tank you can do this for however many sponges will fit stacked up.

yes if you needed a powerhead in your tank this would be a great way to do it.

Edited October 2, 2021 by ARMYVET

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 7:27 AM, ARMYVET said:

Take the top off of the first sponge ...the one the air stone attaches to and set aside.....on the second sponge remove the base keeping the 2 cages and sponge with top together.  Snap that assembly onto the the first sponge assembly with the base and wallah....double sponge using one airline.

And voila!  Brilliant design!  Nicely done, ACO!  With the right height tank this could go 3 or more, but do we know at what point air becomes not enough and a powerhead a necessity for full function?

Now I need to order more sponges to double up in all my big tanks.  I have plenty of air power to them since I needed larger air pumps for the depth, already have square footage made for them, so up is easy.

I only have a single nano in my 14 G cube since I didn’t want to go with the larger diameter of a “small”.  That tank is tall enough to do a double up on the tiny nano and it’s already hidden behind my tall wood centerpiece.  Then I’ll feel better about having an “undersized” back up sponge filter in there.

Since my air pumps are on battery UPS so I still have some filtration and surface agitation even during power outages, this gives me more filtration during any power outs.  This is part of why I have so much filter redundancy in my tanks, so my fishies are still covered even during power outages.

ACO, take my money!  😆 💵💰💸

[ARMYVET]

Good Job, I was going to photo it when I got home...you beat me to it!  

Now put a CoOp power head on the bad boy with the airline for air injection and it Tim the Tool Man you will be ARRR ARRR ARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 8:28 AM, ARMYVET said:

Good Job, I was going to photo it when I got home...you beat me to it!  

Now put a CoOp power head on the bad boy with the airline for air injection and it Tim the Tool Man you will be ARRR ARRR ARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Hah!  I’m better than Tim the Toolman ever thought about being!  I have actual skills.  I’m a woman on a mission to maximize fishy health with minimal effort on my part!  A woman with her own tools, brain, and a willingness to do short term work to make lazy fish viewing with no effort the end goal.  A woman with a husband with even more tools and mechanical skill.  Together, we can conquer the fish world!   Bwahahahahahaha!

Oh, wait, was that just my dream last night?

[ARMYVET]

On 10/2/2021 at 9:36 AM, Odd Duck said:

Hah!  I’m better than Tim the Toolman ever thought about being!  I have actual skills.  I’m a woman on a mission to maximize fishy health with minimal effort on my part!  A woman with her own tools, brain, and a willingness to do short term work to make lazy fish viewing with no effort the end goal.  A woman with a husband with even more tools and mechanical skill.  Together, we can conquer the fish world!   Bwahahahahahaha!

Oh, wait, was that just my dream last night?

😳😳Slowly steps backwards😳😳

On 10/2/2021 at 9:24 AM, Odd Duck said:

And voila!  Brilliant design!  Nicely done, ACO!  With the right height tank this could go 3 or more, but do we know at what point air becomes not enough and a powerhead a necessity for full function?

Now I need to order more sponges to double up in all my big tanks.  I have plenty of air power to them since I needed larger air pumps for the depth, already have square footage made for them, so up is easy.

I only have a single nano in my 14 G cube since I didn’t want to go with the larger diameter of a “small”.  That tank is tall enough to do a double up on the tiny nano and it’s already hidden behind my tall wood centerpiece.  Then I’ll feel better about having an “undersized” back up sponge filter in there.

Since my air pumps are on battery UPS so I still have some filtration and surface agitation even during power outages, this gives me more filtration during any power outs.  This is part of why I have so much filter redundancy in my tanks, so my fishies are still covered even during power outages.

ACO, take my money!  😆 💵💰💸

I know when @Cory explains how to set up the Sponge filters...he recommends to have the air stone as close to the top as possible.  I wonder if when stacked that would be the same recommendation or to place the air stone farther down? 

[Georgiapeach88]

Loving all these ideas as my 36 doesn’t have a lot of space to place more things stacking sponge filters is brilliant. My 29g totally has space for a stack and one more for extra seeding. 

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 8:39 AM, ARMYVET said:

I know when @Cory explains how to set up the Sponge filters...he recommends to have the air stone as close to the top as possible.  I wonder if when stacked that would be the same recommendation or to place the air stone farther down? 

I like your thinking!  Make it a bit more like the muck bucket effect so it will be more likely to pull water through all of the available sponge vs pulling more from the top and potentially less from the bottom?  A powerhead would make that a moot point, but I want to keep these sponges all air driven so the battery UPS will have enough juice to run for several hours if needed.  I’m sure there would be more potential for stray bubbles popping out through the top of the sponge vs the “chimney” part, but otherwise the top section of the sponge might be more likely to clog, and then you would be running on less total surface area.

[ARMYVET]

On 10/2/2021 at 9:53 AM, Odd Duck said:

I’m sure there would be more potential for stray bubbles popping out through the top of the sponge vs the “chimney” part, but otherwise the top section of the sponge might be more likely to clog, and then you would be running on less total surface area.

Before I actually watched Corys video I had the air stone put all the way to the bottom of the tower.  I adjusted the air volume until I had good flow with no air leakage.  The key was to get the air line straight. Not always easy but doable when you heat it a little to relax the curve.  

Another thought is to take 3/16 hard air line tubing to make a long straight pipe then add the stone to the bottom and connect to the lid.  This guarantees you centering the stone in the sponge filter and minimizing any stray bubbles while using the entire filter stack. 

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 8:58 AM, ARMYVET said:

Before I actually watched Corys video I had the air stone put all the way to the bottom of the tower.  I adjusted the air volume until I had good flow with no air leakage.  The key was to get the air line straight. Not always easy but doable when you heat it a little to relax the curve.  

Another thought is to take 3/16 hard air line tubing to make a long straight pipe then add the stone to the bottom and connect to the lid.  This guarantees you centering the stone in the sponge filter and minimizing any stray bubbles while using the entire filter stack. 

I’ve got rigid airline on hand already.  Might not be enough for all the stacks I plan to make, but I can get more today from my lfs so I have it when my other filters arrive.  Maybe they could create a “stack” or “second filter” kit.  Otherwise people will end up with extra bases and tops.  😆 

[ARMYVET]

 

On 10/2/2021 at 11:06 AM, Odd Duck said:

Maybe they could create a “stack” or “second filter” kit.  Otherwise people will end up with extra bases and tops.  😆 

That's not a half bad idea.  The components are already made....just need two center cores and a sponge for the kit.  Maybe Cory will read this and see if its possible.  Not sure how cost effective it would be would be the only drawback I would think.

[Torrey]

On 10/2/2021 at 9:06 AM, Odd Duck said:

I’ve got rigid airline on hand already.  Might not be enough for all the stacks I plan to make, but I can get more today from my lfs so I have it when my other filters arrive.  Maybe they could create a “stack” or “second filter” kit.  Otherwise people will end up with extra bases and tops.  😆 

I use those extra bases and tops for customizing fry and amphopod filtration. 😅

"Waste not, want not"

On 10/2/2021 at 5:32 AM, Odd Duck said:

I have double sponges in my big tanks, but not my small tanks.  I also have HOB’s packed and prefiltered with sponges in nearly every tank.  Big believer in sponge filters, here!  😆 

Edit to add that my sponges and HOB’s are pretty much all oversized for their respective tanks except the big tanks, which is why they’re doubled up.  Large ACO’s x 2 in my 75 G and 100 G tanks.  Both also have HOB’s sized for 75 G flow x 2 with large ACO prefilters packed with a roughly equal to a large sponge filter volume of 30 ppi sponge blocks.  So I only have around 320 gallons of sponge filtration in each of those tanks with the equivalent of 3 large sponges counting them as 40 gallons of filtration each (x 2) plus 2 more large sponges.  Plus heavily planted in the 100 and what I consider moderately planted in the 75.  🤷🏻‍♀️

@Odd Duck almost every tank I run, also has a UG filter. I am related to military folx, triple redundancy offsets Murphy's Law🤣

[Odd Duck]

On 10/2/2021 at 2:54 PM, Torrey said:

I use those extra bases and tops for customizing fry and amphopod filtration. 😅

"Waste not, want not"

@Odd Duck almost every tank I run, also has a UG filter. I am related to military folx, triple redundancy offsets Murphy's Law🤣

Tell me more about this customizing.  I like customizing.

 

I used to run UG’s in all my fresh tanks “back in the day”.  Sometimes powerheads on sponges.  Sometimes powerheads on UG’s. Biofiltration is where it’s at!

[ARMYVET]

On 10/2/2021 at 3:54 PM, Torrey said:

triple redundancy offsets Murphy's Law🤣

Wrong....so so so wrong...🤣

I am military folk and I swear the more backup systems I put into place I feel like im just daring "Murphy" to prove where I screwed up....put nothing in place and nothing ever seems to go wrong.  I still have some but nothing like I ever used to🙄

[Torrey]

On 10/2/2021 at 3:33 PM, ARMYVET said:

Wrong....so so so wrong...🤣

I am military folk and I swear the more backup systems I put into place I feel like im just daring "Murphy" to prove where I screwed up....put nothing in place and nothing ever seems to go wrong.  I still have some but nothing like I ever used to🙄

My partner (retired Navy) in VA used to joke that Murphy gave up by the time he got to back up plan K for my plan C, and if I had joined and gone into intel like they tried to recruit me, military intelligence would not be an oxymoron.... but no one would graduate boot camp under me either 🤣