Vienna Guppy display tank - looking for input on stocking (nano community) & aquascape

[PedroPete]

Hi everyone! I’m looking for some input for my next tank - specifically stocking and aquascape. 

Background:

I am American, I live in Barcelona, Spain, and I brought a pair of Vienna guppies back with me that I bought from 614 Aquatics while I was visiting my parents for the summer. The pair has had 16 babies so far, and while I am caring for them in simple breeding and rearing tanks, I want to be able to sit and enjoy these very special fish with a nice planted aquascape… so I bought a new tank that will allow me to observe from three sides, including my desk and a guest bed. 

Purpose of tank:

• Vienna guppy display & breeding
• Peaceful nature aquarium, deceptively simple, highlighting fish and - to a lesser extent - also my skills at aquascaping
• Nano community 

Specs: 

• 42L 35-cm cube tank (Urna Blau Cubic Aquascaping 42L) roughly 11 gallons
• Small sponge filter with USB pump - and probably a small HOB filter for additional filtration and water polishing
• Small heater
• Blau nano light - may swap out for something like a NICREW 30cm LED light

Stocking options:

• Start with a pair of VG but later up to 3-4 pairs
• Some breeding of Neocaridina shrimp down the line after tank matures (likely yellow or orange)
• My go to cleaning squad: 2 amano shrimp, a nerite snail, and probably ramshorn snails
• Kind of want to include a couple other fish… mainly a nice shoal of grayish nano fish and a group bottom dwellers. My options:

1. panda corys (I love them, have never kept them, and fear this footprint might not be right for them…I have looked into smaller corydoras species - like hastatus or habrosus, but feel like whenever I see them, they are schooling about midwater rather than hanging out on ground, which is more the look I want, I think? Although I’m a bit apprehensive if corys dig up plants - not sure?), 
2. either platinum or mottled gray medaka (which I already keep / breed in indoor/outdoor ponds, so I can easily add or remove as desired), 
3. Yunnanilus cruciatus,
4. Normani Lampeyes,
5. Black neon tetras
6. Oryzias woworae
7. White clouds

• Input welcome!!! (Non negotiable: VG. Top choice: panda corys.)

Aquascapes I am considering:
 
Option 1:  “Riverside” 

• Inspirations:

1. https://youtu.be/oHtACMTK0oY
2. https://youtu.be/AxPbDGFFoSk
3. https://youtu.be/pMyzCUBYUNY
4. https://youtu.be/Q0juwigB4vM

 Option 2: “Wabikusa Bouquet”

• inspirations: 

1. NATURE IN THE GLASS 'A bouquet of aquatic plants' | ADA
2. https://youtu.be/f3cHV6S0W9o
3. https://youtu.be/Is-lg6eoFJ0
4. https://youtu.be/7Qz6Z7GeMoo (but with tank filled completely)

Option 3: “Epiphyte island”

• Inspiration: MulMung’s albino full red guppy tank

Notes: 

• This tank will not be my main breeding colony of Vienna guppies. Of course, I want to encourage breeding, but I also have a 20-gallon pond tub for growing out and breeding. I’ll likely remove newborn fry from this tank and add to grow out tub. Eventually extra adults may be sold (yes, some fishkeepers in Spain know Aquarium Co-op!). Basically, breeding /overstocking isn’t a concern as it’s (a) my goal and (b) most VGs can stay in other tanks while this is mainly display. I do want a balance of VGs and another fish or two.
• I want to avoid too many distracting/busy branches and wood that a net may catch on (see above).

 
Alright, so given alllll that context, what insights and advice do y’all have in terms of aquascape and stocking? 😅😄

[Keeg]

If I had to choose one from your stocking options besides the VG and Panda Corys, I would pick the Yunnanilus cruciatus. They others a little bland form me. Out of all the scape options, I personally like Wabikusa Bouquet the most. But this is all subjective. While I enjoy the Wabikusa a lot, I also like anubias only scape with large leaves. 

Personally I would go for some Vals if you choose the riverside scape and a way to provide a medium current, like by adding a pump head to the sponge filter. That way you can get the look of a river flowing in the tank. 

If you go with the Wabikusa scape, I personally like pogostemon stellatus 'octopus' and a nice assortment of moss & anubias on top of a lava rock scape. 

I dont like the "epiphyte" scape all that much. When you let your plants grow to a giant ball, it takes away from the beauty of the wood. You can see how it slowly gets covered and forgotten with time. Not my liking, but some love it. 

For a stocking idea to consider, celestial pearl danios. Really pretty fish that would add to the VG's color. 

[PedroPete]

Thanks, @Keeg!  i appreciate you trying to balance your taste with what you think generally looks good. I love anubias, too, and use them in nearly all my tanks, so I wanted something quite different here. Really, the epiphyte scape is my least favorite option, too, as I have already used the layout at a tank I have at school (I'm a biology teacher). Great tips on other plants, too. Pogostemon stellatus octopus is quite rare here, but it'd be fun to incorporate it as a nod to the Co-op (with the VGs as the centerpiece).

Do you think 11 gallons (roughly) is  enough for 6-7 VG and 6-7 Panda Corys? 

I didn't go with CPDs, while I love them, because I wanted the main colorful star of the tank to be the vienna guppies. I had considered them, though, especially with the riverside look. (This is also why I'm considering more 'bland' looking tank mates.)

Thanks again for the ideas! Let's count that as 1 vote for the wabikusa scape 🙂

[PedroPete]

Just curious, what other perspectives do people have on stocking an 11 gallon planted tank?

Options:

1. 6 vienna guppies + 6 panda corys
2. 6 vienna guppies + 6 panda corys + 6 norman lampeyes
3. 6 vienna guppies + 6 norman lampeyes + some neocaridina shrimp

Clean up crew: 1-2 amano shrimp, 1 nerite snail

I'm thinking of upping filtration to nano canister filter instead of HOB + sponge.

[Odd Duck]

I have no recommendations but instead a question.

Pardon my guppy ignorance, but what is the difference between a Vienna guppy and a “regular” fancy guppy?

[Patrick_G]

On 9/27/2021 at 12:33 PM, Odd Duck said:

I have no recommendations but instead a question.

Pardon my guppy ignorance, but what is the difference between a Vienna guppy and a “regular” fancy guppy?

I’m glad someone finally asked! 

I like all the options you’re considering. None of them are to difficult but with the Wabi Kusa you’ll basically have an “instant” scape once you’ve grown out the Wabi Kusa. 
I have a 11 gallon cube that’s sort of scaped itself over time, but it’s simple and I’m pretty happy with it. My cleaning crew includes Otocinclus. If you’re looking for a fun grey fish they should definitely be on your list. 

[lefty o]

On 9/27/2021 at 2:33 PM, Odd Duck said:

I have no recommendations but instead a question.

Pardon my guppy ignorance, but what is the difference between a Vienna guppy and a “regular” fancy guppy?

vienna guppy is just a particular coloration strain.  as for the op's question. in an 11 gallon tank with 3 pairs of guppy's, i would go with a smaller corydora, hasbrosus or pygmy, likely 6 of either, and if you just had to put more fish , a half dozen ember tetras. be forewarned 6 pairs of guppy's in an 11 gallon tank by themselves will  breed non stop.

[Griznatch]

Sounds like a good plan so far, the Neos will do well with guppies. However, as was mentioned, a pair or three of guppies can soon become a couple hundred fry if they all have babies within a few weeks of each other...  I have had this happen.

[Guppysnail]

Possibly have you considered Pygmy cory instead of panda Cory. I have both both are braver and more active in schools of 10+ They are smaller so will appreciate the smaller footprint and you can do a bigger group. I have 22 Pygmy in a 10 as the only fish. The fun part is they also spend a lot of time swimming mid water in sort of schooling behavior as well as bottom. They are stricking grey with black stripe and white highlights. I did have them with guppies prior and they do splendid. I keep 11 panda in a 29 g with guppies when I only had 6 they hid more now they are fearless in the larger group 

[Odd Duck]

On 9/27/2021 at 3:35 PM, lefty o said:

vienna guppy is just a particular coloration strain.  as for the op's question. in an 11 gallon tank with 3 pairs of guppy's, i would go with a smaller corydora, hasbrosus or pygmy, likely 6 of either, and if you just had to put more fish , a half dozen ember tetras. be forewarned 6 pairs of guppy's in an 11 gallon tank by themselves will  breed non stop.

I figured that.  I’m trying (apparently badly) to ask what specific color variation/pattern makes it a Vienna guppy?

[lefty o]

[PedroPete]

 

On 9/27/2021 at 11:12 PM, Odd Duck said:

I figured that.  I’m trying (apparently badly) to ask what specific color variation/pattern makes it a Vienna guppy?

Hi there! 

Cory and pals brought back a strain of short tail guppies that won a championship in Vienna in 2018. See timestamp 4:23 ⬇️

I believe they are some form of galaxy tiger endler or grey moscow lace snakeskin guppy. Besides Aquarium Co-op videos, you can spot them Shenandoah Aquatics and other YT channels now.

[PedroPete]

Thank you, @Patrick_G, @Guppysnail, @lefty o, @Griznatch, for the input!! I really appreciate your experience and ideas. 😄😄😄

Love the scape, @Patrick_G! Very much my style, too, with lots of wild plants - which is why i want to try something different this time around. Very cool we have the same size tank. Not decided yet if I'll do the wabikusa style or the riverside...

To @lefty o and @Griznatch - I will be netting out fry to raise in 20 gallon grow out indoor pond tub, and I'm quite excited about the possibility of a growing colony. A handful of my best looking breeding age adults will live in this 11 gallon cube.

As for types of corydoras, @lefty o and @Guppysnail, the advice about a tiny version is the right choice, but I'm a bit torn up to move on from the pandas. I know you're right, so I'll do some more research to fall more in love with pygmaeus, habrosus, or hastatus. I do like the idea of a bigger group - and I do appreciate their silver/black appearance.

Does anyone think it would be too much to do 6 vienna guppies, 8ish corydoras pygmaeus, and 6ish norman lampeyes?

[Patrick_G]

This is a 8-9” Wabi Kusa started from tissue cultures that’s only a month old. The plants grow fast with unlimited co2!

Edited September 27, 2021 by Patrick_G

[shkote]

Vienna guppies go back quite awhile and come in a lot of different colors. Here is an example of my blonde vienna emerald lower sword guppies. It is pattern that makes it Vienna. 

[Odd Duck]

On 9/27/2021 at 4:29 PM, PedroPete said:

 

Hi there! 

Cory and pals brought back a strain of short tail guppies that won a championship in Vienna in 2018. See timestamp 4:23 ⬇️

I believe they are some form of galaxy tiger endler or grey moscow lace snakeskin guppy. Besides Aquarium Co-op videos, you can spot them Shenandoah Aquatics and other YT channels now.

Thank you!  That’s what I was looking for.  Back to the actual topic now.

On 9/27/2021 at 5:01 PM, shkote said:

Vienna guppies go back quite awhile and come in a lot of different colors. Here is an example of my blonde vienna emerald lower sword guppies. It is pattern that makes it Vienna. 

Thank you for the pics.  I was trying to figure out what the Vienna pattern entailed.  Pictures and videos worked to explain.

[lefty o]

On 9/27/2021 at 4:46 PM, PedroPete said:

Thank you, @Patrick_G, @Guppysnail, @lefty o, @Griznatch, for the input!! I really appreciate your experience and ideas. 😄😄😄

Love the scape, @Patrick_G! Very much my style, too, with lots of wild plants - which is why i want to try something different this time around. Very cool we have the same size tank. Not decided yet if I'll do the wabikusa style or the riverside...

To @lefty o and @Griznatch - I will be netting out fry to raise in 20 gallon grow out indoor pond tub, and I'm quite excited about the possibility of a growing colony. A handful of my best looking breeding age adults will live in this 11 gallon cube.

As for types of corydoras, @lefty o and @Guppysnail, the advice about a tiny version is the right choice, but I'm a bit torn up to move on from the pandas. I know you're right, so I'll do some more research to fall more in love with pygmaeus, habrosus, or hastatus. I do like the idea of a bigger group - and I do appreciate their silver/black appearance.

Does anyone think it would be too much to do 6 vienna guppies, 8ish corydoras pygmaeus, and 6ish norman lampeyes?

that will be a fairly heavily stocked set up. is it too much? well that depends on your filtration, plants, and how much tank maintenance you are prepared to do. in a smaller tank especially, more fish=more maintenance. doing the old fashioned 1" of fish per gallon, the 6 guppy's would max out an 11gallon tank. it is do-able, but you have to factor in the added maintenance.

[PedroPete]

Hi everyone!
Thanks so much for your ideas so far!  I’ve narrowed down my stocking and scape ideas, but I’m curious if anyone else wants to chime in...

My plan:

 

I decided that adding 5-6 lampeye killifish or oryzias woworae would be too much for this system to handle so they're no longer on the table.

Scape options:

Questions:

• Which scape do you think the guppies and especially the pygmy corys prefer?
• I am leaning to do a canister filter to give more floor space to corydoras (instead of an HOB and nano sponge). Tips on canister filters? I’ve never used one before. Or should I just stick with my wheelhouse of sponge filters/HOBs?  (FYI:  I do weekly 20% water changes on my tanks.)
• I think getting the proportions right on a cube scape is more difficult with the "wabi kusa bouquet" option, which means I'll probably not end up liking it, even though it would be my go-to for a 60x30cm tank (unfortunately I only had a space of 40x40cm to work with.
• Any other tips or related experience you think would help me out?

Thank you!
 

 

[Patrick_G]

I think all tanks on your vision board look great, you can’t go wrong with any of them, although the top left looks the most natural to my eye. I would recommend getting a light that can be centered over the tank if you choose a scape that has plants in the front. That’s one issue I have with my 35cm cube. 

Edited October 2, 2021 by Patrick_G

[lefty o]

dont worry which tank other people like. set up your tank so that is pleasing to your eye!😎

[PedroPete]

Thanks, y'all!

On 10/2/2021 at 7:04 PM, Patrick_G said:

the top left looks the most natural to my eye

Same here.

On 10/2/2021 at 7:04 PM, Patrick_G said:

I would recommend getting a light that can be centered over the tank if you choose a scape that has plants in the front. That’s one issue I have with my 35cm cube. 

Great advice, @Patrick_G! I didn't want to buy a new light, but I think I'll be switching from my previous light to this.

 

On 10/2/2021 at 7:09 PM, lefty o said:

dont worry which tank other people like. set up your tank so that is pleasing to your eye!😎

Ya, I agree, @lefty o, 😅 but I also was genuinely curious what other folks interested in both scaping and fish-keeping might think. I see so many talented hobbyists here on the forum, and I haven't connected to so many similar-minded folks here in Barcelona (of course, my Castellano Spanish is improving with aquarium-related vocabulary, but then there's the whole Catalan language to learn, too).😳

[Patrick_G]

On 10/2/2021 at 10:52 AM, PedroPete said:

Great advice, @Patrick_G! I didn't want to buy a new light, but I think I'll be switching from my previous light to this.

Yup, based on my experience that’ll provide a more even light.