Fish huddled

[Jackson]

My ember tetras have collected up in a corner of the tank . Three of them . About an inch or so from the top . Just noticed the behavior this morning . All others in the tank are acting normal . No ammonia , nitrates are okay ph 6.6 . Been keeping my ph around there . So any ideas on what may be up with them ?

[nabokovfan87]

pH being low is indicative of excessive waste. Unless you're running blackwater, botanicals, or a ton of wood, the PH should be 6.8 or so.

Active substrate will tend to buffer down things, but stabilize once it's charged in that 6.8 range.

First thing I would do is dose in prime, add air, and give yourself some time to test the KH of the tank as well as your source water.

Clean the filtration and make sure that is working properly. Once you have confirmation where things are the likely next step would be water changes, adjust filtration, adjust KH, and/or adjust air.

Fish at the surface could be temperature too, affecting oxygenation.

Let's check everything and see what parameters should be and triple check everything.

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/ph-gh-kh

 

[Guppysnail]

Normally when I see odd grouping behavior in a specific location I check a few things.

-Are my airstone clear and running?

- have my filters slowed down and possibly need a rinse?

-have I relocated anything in the tank that possibly made them feel less safe?

-is my heater functioning and evenly heating the tank or has it begun overheating.

If they are not gasping at the surface it’s usually something along those lines in my experience.  

 

[Jackson]

My ph is low because I haven't been adding after water changes . I test to see where it's at . Then may add up , but haven't in the last few W/C's . All my pest snails or most all ,have died off . My nitrates have been mostly low . 5ppm the test before last . But I extended my W/C change last week to get a better fix on things . So I was at about 20ppm . Tuesday was my last 50% water change . I should have plenty of air in the tank . I have a stone, sponge filter and a hob . Temp is about 78 . Just changed the hob filter . Need to clean the sponge filter . Haven't test for kh and gh in a long time .

On 12/15/2023 at 1:09 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

pH being low is indicative of excessive waste. Unless you're running blackwater, botanicals, or a ton of wood, the PH should be 6.8 or so.

Active substrate will tend to buffer down things, but stabilize once it's charged in that 6.8 range.

First thing I would do is dose in prime, add air, and give yourself some time to test the KH of the tank as well as your source water.

Clean the filtration and make sure that is working properly. Once you have confirmation where things are the likely next step would be water changes, adjust filtration, adjust KH, and/or adjust air.

Fish at the surface could be temperature too, affecting oxygenation.

Let's check everything and see what parameters should be and triple check everything.

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/ph-gh-kh

 

 

On 12/15/2023 at 1:16 PM, Guppysnail said:

Normally when I see odd grouping behavior in a specific location I check a few things.

-Are my airstone clear and running?

- have my filters slowed down and possibly need a rinse?

-have I relocated anything in the tank that possibly made them feel less safe?

-is my heater functioning and evenly heating the tank or has it begun overheating.

If they are not gasping at the surface it’s usually something along those lines in my experience.  

 

They are not gasping for air . Just in a corner near the top but not gasping for air . They seem to be near the air from the stone where the bubbles is rising .

[Jackson]

0 nitrates .

[Jackson]

They do seem to be going up to the surface at times ,Looking closer they are going after the bubbles from the stone . My black neons are just fine . 

[Mmiller2001]

On 12/15/2023 at 11:09 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

the PH should be 6.8 or so.

Shh, don’t tell anyone 😆

 

[Jackson]

DID a 50% W/C .We will see how it goes . I'll adjust the ph after I get it to cycle for a bit .

[nabokovfan87]

On 12/15/2023 at 10:47 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

Shh, don’t tell anyone 😆

You're a special case! LOL

I can only imagine what "normal" is for some of the high tech tanks.  There is also tanks that have breeding parameters and so it's lower for that reason. 

[Schuyler]

On 12/15/2023 at 12:42 PM, Jackson said:

DID a 50% W/C .We will see how it goes . I'll adjust the ph after I get it to cycle for a bit .

What are you doing to adjust the pH?

How long have you had the tank and the fish?

[Jackson]

On 12/15/2023 at 7:11 PM, Schuyler said:

What are you doing to adjust the pH?

How long have you had the tank and the fish?

I add ph up or down . I took out two embers . They were hurting . The third one is still in the tank doing better . I've had the tank and fish for over a year . all my other fish and critters are okay . Don't know if I got some insecticide on my hands and then maybe put that hand in the tank . If I did that it only bothered the embers .

[Lennie]

6.6 ph looks normal. Im confused why you focus on ph here. Seriouslyfish says 5.0-7.0 for embers, 6.6 is even on the up limit side. 

[Chris]

I probably wouldn't be so worried about PH in this instance. Lots of good advice in this thread, but not sure you're going to find any issues with a PH in the 6's, unless you've possibly had a PH swing by adding chemicals.

For reference, my water hangs around in the mid 7's in most of my tanks. I've kept embers (and other fish that liked acidic water, including wild-caught fish) just fine.

[Tanked]

The PH in my small community tank averages 6.6. The Embers are fine.  

Have you added larger fish recently?  Do they "huddle" only in the morning?  Mine generally stay close to each other, but  only huddle up when something spooks them.  Early Morning will find most of the fish on the side of the tank that gets a little bit of morning sun.  

[nabokovfan87]

You can't know what "normal pH" is without an off gas test.

What the fish will tolerate isn't the same as what the pH would be if the tank didn't have a KH crash.... If there is one happening, causing stress on the fish.

1. Why you need to do water changes or replenish KH. (One of many reasons.)

2. When you have any issues, step one. Test.

 

Edited December 16, 2023 by nabokovfan87

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 12/15/2023 at 1:16 PM, Guppysnail said:

is my heater functioning and evenly heating the tank or has it begun overheating

I’ve seen videos of fish huddling because they were cold. The heater wasn’t putting off much heat and they were all huddled around it.

[Jackson]

My sole ember has returned to normal behavior . All others are fine as well . Dunno why those two got sick . The survivor didn't show as much stress as the other two. when all was happening . .