gjcarew Posted November 16, 2022 Author Share Posted November 16, 2022 I recently bumped up my photoperiod from 8.5 to 10.5 hours, and there has definitely been better colors from the rotala as a result. Unfortunately for some reason the CO2 levels were also stressing the fish. I turned down CO2 30% to try to keep everyone happy. Surface aeration is high, so I don't know why the CO2 seems to be building so much more than when I was running the light for 8.5 hours 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted November 16, 2022 Share Posted November 16, 2022 Oh wow! Everyone is trying to get a big ol' drink of air there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 17, 2022 Author Share Posted November 17, 2022 (edited) On 11/16/2022 at 3:38 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: Oh wow! Everyone is trying to get a big ol' drink of air there! Yeah, I ended up turning off the CO2 for the day and dropping an airstone in there as soon as I saw this. I hate letting the fish get CO2 stressed like this, and I can't figure out what's going on. Joe Harvey, one of my Dutch aquascaping idols, runs 30 cc/m with a canister filter and skimmer on his 75. I have the same setup but am only running 18 cc/m at the time this photo was taken. The only difference I can think of is that he's running a reactor whereas I'm running an inline diffuser. Maybe the CO2 microbubbles are more stressful for the fish? I'm also gonna shamelessly post a recent picture of Joe's tank because he's a real deal Dutch aquascaper. He's the original inspiration for me going down this crazy path... Edit: One of my favorite things about this tank is that his stocking consists of a few ember tetras and single ridiculously spoiled betta Edited November 17, 2022 by gjcarew 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmiller2001 Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 Hmm, that's interesting with the CO2. I'm curious to know too. Joe is amazing. Hate that I refuse to even visit that one forum he's on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 @gjcarew, do you use a gas flow meter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 17, 2022 Author Share Posted November 17, 2022 (edited) Yeah @Patrick_G I use a Dwyer RMA-151. I wanted to know exactly how much I was changing CO2 by since the bubbles in a bubble counter are a blur in a 75 gallon Edited November 17, 2022 by gjcarew 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minanora Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 At least you didn't lose any fish. I'm glad everyone made it through. Plants are looking excellent though! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 (edited) On 11/16/2022 at 5:22 PM, gjcarew said: Maybe the CO2 microbubbles are more stressful for the fish? Now bear with me as I'm a total co2 layman. I understand why it works just not the dosing/regulator stuff as I've never looked into it. However the above statement makes sense to me. I instantly thought of really charged soda- super bubbly soda can be hard to drink- can't avoid those bubbles and your senses, throat, nose are just barraged with them. It's refreshing but not something easily gulped. Don't know about you but I burp A LOT when I drink the stuff. Then I thought of flatter soda- has fewer bubbles and larger ones. When drinking soda like that you can avoid the bubbles and most when you tip the glass end up going to the surface before you drink them. Maybe microbubbles are harder for the fish to avoid therefore taking in far more of it than with larger bubbles? Edited November 17, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anewbie Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 On 11/16/2022 at 7:22 PM, gjcarew said: Yeah, I ended up turning off the CO2 for the day and dropping an airstone in there as soon as I saw this. I hate letting the fish get CO2 stressed like this, and I can't figure out what's going on. Joe Harvey, one of my Dutch aquascaping idols, runs 30 cc/m with a canister filter and skimmer on his 75. I have the same setup but am only running 18 cc/m at the time this photo was taken. The only difference I can think of is that he's running a reactor whereas I'm running an inline diffuser. Maybe the CO2 microbubbles are more stressful for the fish? I'm also gonna shamelessly post a recent picture of Joe's tank because he's a real deal Dutch aquascaper. He's the original inspiration for me going down this crazy path... Edit: One of my favorite things about this tank is that his stocking consists of a few ember tetras and single ridiculously spoiled betta I'm not sure how you determine xx cc/m; but i use ph drop as my measurement and i always found in my tank that i can't get anywhere close to what other folks get before the fishes get upset - i use an inline diffuser but when i move in may i'll be switching to dual reactors. I know temp plays a role (colder water will hold more oxygen) and surface agitation but I'm thinking species also plays a role. I don't keep rainbows like a lot of the nice co2 tanks i've seen but i doubt that is it just looking gasping for reason. Still when i reached around 1 ph drop all my fishes were gasping at the top. On 11/16/2022 at 7:22 PM, gjcarew said: Edit: One of my favorite things about this tank is that his stocking consists of a few ember tetras and single ridiculously spoiled betta I don't know how spoiled your betta is but my oldest angel is so spoiled he won't eat when i feed the other fishes; instead he waits till i pick up his favorite food and then he comes up to me and wait for his pellet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted November 17, 2022 Share Posted November 17, 2022 (edited) On 11/16/2022 at 8:19 PM, gjcarew said: Yeah @Patrick_G I use a Dwyer RMA-151. I wanted to know exactly how much I was changing CO2 by since the bubbles in a bubble counter are a blur in a 75 gallon Does that meter need periodic calibration? Edit: just read the docs and answered my own question. It looks like a reasonably priced tool. Edited November 17, 2022 by Patrick_G 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 18, 2022 Author Share Posted November 18, 2022 Random pic time One of the rainbows truly looking like a 🌈 Not a great pic but a Rhadinocentrus ornatus male. I'm also trying to get my rotala bush skills back, I've fallen out of practice! Crypt nurii starting to show some stripes again 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 18, 2022 Author Share Posted November 18, 2022 On 11/17/2022 at 7:30 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: Now bear with me as I'm a total co2 layman. I understand why it works just not the dosing/regulator stuff as I've never looked into it. However the above statement makes sense to me. I instantly thought of really charged soda- super bubbly soda can be hard to drink- can't avoid those bubbles and your senses, throat, nose are just barraged with them. It's refreshing but not something easily gulped. Don't know about you but I burp A LOT when I drink the stuff. Then I thought of flatter soda- has fewer bubbles and larger ones. When drinking soda like that you can avoid the bubbles and most when you tip the glass end up going to the surface before you drink them. Maybe microbubbles are harder for the fish to avoid therefore taking in far more of it than with larger bubbles? In this case, with a reactor there are no bubbles. But I could see your point about the small bubbles being irritating to the fish gills vs. fully dissolved CO2 you would get with a reactor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 18, 2022 Author Share Posted November 18, 2022 On 11/17/2022 at 1:46 PM, anewbie said: I'm not sure how you determine xx cc/m; but i use ph drop as my measurement and i always found in my tank that i can't get anywhere close to what other folks get before the fishes get upset - i use an inline diffuser but when i move in may i'll be switching to dual reactors. I know temp plays a role (colder water will hold more oxygen) and surface agitation but I'm thinking species also plays a role. I don't keep rainbows like a lot of the nice co2 tanks i've seen but i doubt that is it just looking gasping for reason. Still when i reached around 1 ph drop all my fishes were gasping at the top. The tank temperature is 72 so I don't think that's the issue. At the end of the day I think it's just because I no longer have an airstone in there. I was getting 1.2 pH drop a couple years ago, but I was also running two airstones 24/7. You have to keep the aeration at the maximum level if you're going to push CO2. I'm currently hesitant to run an airstone because of the noise. This tank is in the guest room and I don't want it to be annoying - it's currently almost silent. I'd rather just stick to lower CO2 and lower light. I've used pH drop in the past, but I don't like having to recalibrate my pH meter every time I use it. It also takes at least a day to dial in CO2 with a pH meter, usually more (since you have to degas water, then measure pH, adjust flow, measure pH the following day, etc.) With the flowmeter I can set the CO2 to exactly where it was after changing tanks or dialing it down to let new fish adjust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anewbie Posted November 18, 2022 Share Posted November 18, 2022 Yea. I just don't know how ot get teh xx level. I actually use drops to verify my probe - since i only care about relative change i don't actually care if the probe is calibrated. I don't use air stones but i do have sponge fitlers in the back of the tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 20, 2022 Author Share Posted November 20, 2022 Looks like I didn't place this year in the AGA Dutch aquascaping competition. I haven't seen the judges' comments yet, but some things that I would critique are the unhealthy sword (started yellowing randomly the week before I took this), too much vallisneria (used on both sides), and the under-developed bush of Ludwigia natans. I can do better, but I'm happy with this attempt under the circumstances. Onwards and upwards! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmiller2001 Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 Yeah man, that late trouble didn't help. I am still proud you got an entry. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted November 28, 2022 Author Share Posted November 28, 2022 (edited) It's been a bit since the last update. I was gone for Thanksgiving and CO2 ran out at some point, so I had a GDA bloom. The plants looked fine for the most part. This is post trim and water change: And a few selected plant pics, first up is Bucephalandra 'Kedagang' This is what the Nymphaea minuta (AKA Kasselmann lily) looks like once it's settled in. The aponogeton crispus was getting too big and unruly so I replaced it with some eleocharis montevidensis. Edited November 28, 2022 by gjcarew 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted December 5, 2022 Author Share Posted December 5, 2022 There is GDA on the glass and I need to do a water change, but I'm really liking the color contrast going on on the left side here. The right still needs work though. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmiller2001 Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 Yeah, that's forming that look that's so hard to get! Very nice. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted December 10, 2022 Author Share Posted December 10, 2022 Big trim and rearranging things to try to get the right side of the tank on par with the left side. I don't really know exactly what I'm going for yet, just trying things out to see what I like. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted December 11, 2022 Author Share Posted December 11, 2022 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmiller2001 Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 That cube/rectangle tank is freaking awesome! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anewbie Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/10/2022 at 10:08 PM, gjcarew said: What kind of rainbow is that in the first picture ? And why is he so much more colourful than everyone else around him ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted December 11, 2022 Author Share Posted December 11, 2022 On 12/11/2022 at 8:44 AM, anewbie said: What kind of rainbow is that in the first picture ? And why is he so much more colourful than everyone else around him ? Melanotaenia trifasciata 'Habgood River'. They don't have much pigmentation, per se, but rather iridescence. So when the light shines on them right they are stunning but it's very hard to get the right light (and focus). Out of 12 of that species I'd say about 4 are that colored up. The rest of the males are a little less colorful and the females are fairly drab. On 12/10/2022 at 10:33 PM, Mmiller2001 said: That cube/rectangle tank is freaking awesome! On 12/10/2022 at 8:08 PM, gjcarew said: Thanks, it's a good reminder of how much I still love nature aquariums despite being deep in to Dutch style right now. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcarew Posted December 17, 2022 Author Share Posted December 17, 2022 I'm trying out some plants on the right hand side. The guy at the fish store gave me a crypt wendtii "Green Gecko", and I also bought a Crypt spiralis for the curtain plant. I went with Hygrophila siamensis (Willow hygrophila) after seeing it in @Mmiller2001's tank. I was also looking for some Limnophila aromatica 'mini' but ended up with Limnophila 'Vietnam'. I don't think it's as colorful but I'm gonna give it a chance and see what it looks like once it grows out a bit. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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