Pennsylaniaeric Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 Hello I am in the process of purchasing everything for a brand new 120 gal tank. I was going to use one large co-op sponge filter and the remaining filtration would be a tidal hob filter. Should I go with 2 tidal 75 or 1 tidal 110 or something totally different? Any advice would be appreciated. thank you and thanks for reading my post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynameisnobody Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 @Pennsylaniaeric This would all depend on a few factors. First off, if you go with a hang on back, I’d go 110, no matter what your stock is. Personally, I prefer the aquaclear filter. The tidal has issues if you are keeping shrimp or fish fry. Will you be planting it? Go into more detail about what the goal is and it will be easier to guide you. Your filtration will look very differently if you keep 1 guppy in a 120 rather that 5 Fancy goldfish, for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 On 1/10/2023 at 3:28 AM, Pennsylaniaeric said: I am in the process of purchasing everything for a brand new 120 gal tank. I was going to use one large co-op sponge filter and the remaining filtration would be a tidal hob filter. Should I go with 2 tidal 75 or 1 tidal 110 or something totally different? Any advice would be appreciated. Be sure to check out my tidal testing thread! I would do 2x 110s honestly. On my 75G tank I was running 2x 75s just because I didn't like the flow pattern of a single tank. The flow was very centralized to one half of the tank except when the filter was side mounted and running across the length of the tank. Second to that, I'd highly recommend having a pump head and a spray bar if you run a single filter. Potentially a canister just to ease that spray bar being in the tank if that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVoyager31 Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 A lot of people don't like them but I've always really liked canisters.. I've tried several brands sun-sun, fluval, and pen plaxx and haven't had any issues. Tons of space for sponge and any other media you like. If you do go HOB.. I generally also prefer aquaclear. For a 120 gallon I would probably get two 110 to cover your bases. Same applies if you go with the tidal.. no such thing as over filtration in my book 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty o Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 it depends entirely on how heavily you intend to stock it. i have a 120, i run 2 ancient emperor 400 HOB's on it. run them at one level below full blast and ive always been happy with them. if you are going to moderately stock, try a large sponge with a good quality hob, or canister. if in the long run it doesnt get the job done, you can always add another HOB, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darax Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 (edited) That's a 6' tank? A single tidal wouldn't generate enough flow, even for a 4'. I had these on 55 and 75 gallon tanks. I'd do something weird. I'd use both a cannister and an undergravel with a powerhead for at least one upflow tube. Maybe instead of the undergravel you could put the powerhead on your sponge. Be sure there is enough surface agitation to supply oxygen and reduce oil slicks. Edited January 10, 2023 by Darax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rube_Goldfish Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 (edited) The answer will depend, of course, on your planting and stocking levels. I'd heed the low-flow warnings across such a long tank, though, unless that's what you're trying for. Generally, though, some disadvantages of two HOBs are increased cost to buy and run them (though in such a big tank it's likely to be a negligible increase), and increased "stuff" sticking into your tank. Advantages, though, would include the chance to clean only one filter at a time to minimize the impact on your biofilter, to have redundancy in the event of mechanical failure, and greater opportunity to increase customize your media. For example, you can run one with an emphasis on biofiltration and the other could be nothing but mechanical filtration/water polishing. Edited January 10, 2023 by Rube_Goldfish Typo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty o Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 On 1/10/2023 at 10:50 AM, Darax said: That's a 6' tank? A single tidal wouldn't generate enough flow, even for a 4'. I had these on 55 and 75 gallon tanks. I'd do something weird. I'd use both a cannister and an undergravel with a powerhead for at least one upflow tube. Maybe instead of the undergravel you could put the powerhead on your sponge. Be sure there is enough surface agitation to supply oxygen and reduce oil slicks. they do have long skinny 120's, but most are 48"x24x24. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaneFishGuy Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 On 1/10/2023 at 8:24 AM, nabokovfan87 said: Be sure to check out my tidal testing thread! I would do 2x 110s honestly. On my 75G tank I was running 2x 75s just because I didn't like the flow pattern of a single tank. The flow was very centralized to one half of the tank except when the filter was side mounted and running across the length of the tank. Second to that, I'd highly recommend having a pump head and a spray bar if you run a single filter. Potentially a canister just to ease that spray bar being in the tank if that makes sense. @nabokovfan87 I don't want to hijack this thread but I have a related question - I plan on running my 75g with an Aquaclear 110 - I know you weren't a fan of flow on one 75, do you think a 110 solves this or should I plan for something else to help circulation? Im kicking around designing my stand to hide a side mounted filter and other hardware, cable, etc. (may make maintenance easier too) - but Im not sold yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winstons_estate Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 (edited) If it was me id run 2 medium sponge filters with air stones and call it good 😅 Especially if you are planting it Edited January 10, 2023 by Winstons_estate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOtrees Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 I love how many different answers there are here!!! 😂 And all of them are right! (so far, I mean based on the limited info given). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 On 1/10/2023 at 11:55 AM, PlaneFishGuy said: @nabokovfan87 I don't want to hijack this thread but I have a related question - I plan on running my 75g with an Aquaclear 110 - I know you weren't a fan of flow on one 75, do you think a 110 solves this or should I plan for something else to help circulation? I would always opt for (even a single 75) side mounted compared to one pushing water front to back on a long tank. Even on a 40B I'd probably run two HoBs. I tend to churn / circulate my tanks really well, either using ziss bubble bio, airstones, or sponges in addition to other filters. When I started my 75 I didn't want to cut the rim, so I ran to the shop and got an AC110. I wasn't satisfied and was needless to say pretty irritated with the plastics quality (much much better on the 110) compared to the 30, 50, 70 boxes. The lid was nicer, everything was night and day nicer. The foam itself was so massive that even with a high pressure faucet or hose it was really difficult to clean the interior section of gunk. Every time I turned the HoB off, could never get it to run.... so those two issues is why I opted for a single Tidal over the Aquaclear. But.... YES, I would recommend side mount, running multiple, or running additional air on the other side of the tank in your efforts to get flow across the tank. Any HoB that you can't basically mount in the middle of the tank is going to push the flow to one side or one half of the tank. I'll grab a diagram and explain, but basically this impacts food, dosing chemicals, heat, co2, and circulation itself.Single Tidal 75 (AC's won't fit without modifying rim)You can picture here, wherever you put this HoB if it's not on the side you're either going to be limiting the input or output's ability to cover the full width of the tank. This is where having a spraybar really helps because you lengthen that output across the tank or you can easily put it on the side and blow the water across the length of the tank! In the example below, imagine you're feeding on the right corner, generally speaking you're always going to have mulm and detritus on that half of the tank and you're going to end up focusing on siphoning that half of the tank as a priority.Single 110 (AC or Tidal)Here we have "more flow" but the actual turnover doesn't really physically work any better. You're still pushing the output or input to one section, creating that low flow area on the opposing sidewall of the tank.Dual 75 or Dual 110: (75 shown here in terms of scale, but either works)In this setup, I placed both my heaters under each of the HoBs. This is also where fish like hillstream loaches, plecos, and shrimp love to sit. They love that flow in that area and you see a much cleaner tank because you don't have as many dead spots. On 1/10/2023 at 11:55 AM, PlaneFishGuy said: Im kicking around designing my stand to hide a side mounted filter and other hardware, cable, etc. (may make maintenance easier too) - but Im not sold yet. Setup a smaller scale example, even with a 10G QT tub or something. Front to back vs. side mounted is night and day. I wish lids and things were made to give us the choice. I'd side mount everything. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaneFishGuy Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 @nabokovfan87 you have completely sold me on the side mount. Thanks for taking the time on the detailed response. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennsylaniaeric Posted January 11, 2023 Author Share Posted January 11, 2023 Thank you everyone for your feedback on my question. I should have been more specific concerning the tank. The tank is 48x24x24. It will be planted with moderate amount of community fish, tetras, guppies etc. i appreciate all the different ideas that was provided. I have a lot to think about it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 On 1/11/2023 at 4:41 AM, Pepere said: I was also convinced by a certain youtube channel that the Seachem Tidal hob was a filter to bow down and worship. I bought one based on that video… I remain seriously underwhelmed. At best it gives me flow…. Definitely mod it. 😞 Such a frustrating issue that one is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darax Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 On 1/11/2023 at 4:41 AM, Pepere said: Personally I have a hard time envisioning a tank I would not want to place undergravel filter plates into I agree. The ugf is an awesome filter for me. I'm somewhat confused that they are out of fashion. I think people are turned off by the uplift tubes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 On 1/11/2023 at 10:18 AM, Pepere said: I pull the sponges, rinse them out and replace them and a few days later the water is bypassing them… Yep. I have some pretty specific techniques. I am working on a wrap up of my years of testing these things at various models in various setups. If you look at the link in my description, I use a pair of pliers and cut the basket base in a specific way. Start with that. I know you have the right tools for the job and will make it look a lot better, but the outline of where / what to do is there. Without modding the skimmer, without doing much work, you're talking 15 minutes of work and a world of difference in terms of usability. The designer in me is really annoyed at Seachem for not coming out with a v2.0 of this thing by now. On 1/11/2023 at 10:47 AM, Darax said: I agree. The ugf is an awesome filter for me. I'm somewhat confused that they are out of fashion. I think people are turned off by the uplift tubes. I actually dig the uplift tubes. Reminds me of being a kid, especially those little black carbon blocks on the top. It's just a tube, easy to glue moss and junk to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 I don't any tank over 53 gallons, but I have nothing but Fluval x07 canister filters on all my tanks (even a small one on my 14 gal). I love them, they are silent, have adjustable flow, and the design of placement of the sponges is great for mechanical filtration but also gives you a ton of extra bio filtration. I fill all the trays with K1 media and/or pot scrubbers, and all tanks are crystal clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rube_Goldfish Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 On 1/11/2023 at 2:46 PM, nabokovfan87 said: I actually dig the uplift tubes. Reminds me of being a kid, especially those little black carbon blocks on the top. It's just a tube, easy to glue moss and junk to it! Like a bisected cholla wood log! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc24 Posted January 12, 2023 Share Posted January 12, 2023 On 1/11/2023 at 3:15 PM, Bill said: I don't any tank over 53 gallons, but I have nothing but Fluval x07 canister filters on all my tanks (even a small one on my 14 gal). I love them, they are silent, have adjustable flow, and the design of placement of the sponges is great for mechanical filtration but also gives you a ton of extra bio filtration. I fill all the trays with K1 media and/or pot scrubbers, and all tanks are crystal clear. Same. I prefer my 407s for customization of media and the ability to put what I need in there. My purigen, polyfil and crushed coral (along with more traditional media) are all in the 407. I’d be hard pressed to run all the same media in a HOB. I actually run all kinds of different filters and each serve a purpose. - 55g (“overstocked”/mod-heavily planted) Fluval 407 - 29g (grow out, minimal plants atm) Aquaclear 20 - 20L (two killifish, a few plants) Med ACO sponge filter - 6g cube (CPD, heavily planted paludarium) nano ACO sponge + submersible pump for flow 3g hospital tank - it came with an overflow +submersible pump. I yanked the standard charcoal box filter and added biomedia, sponge and polyfil 3.5g aquaponics system x2 - that’s it’s own bizarre filtration. my point is - you can experiment, “trick out” and change what you are using. There isn’t any one right answer for a certain size aquarium. honestly, the right filter is one that you understand how to use well enough to maintain excellent water parameters for your little glass nature box. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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