Diamond eye?!

[JessLynne7]

Meet Drogon a dragon scale betta. I have had him one year and a month.

he has stress stripes.

I struggled with a cycle crash over past few months. Then my ph dropped so low api test kit would not read it and that put me into another cycle crash.

i changed the gravel bc the blue painted gravel had paint flakes chipping away.

10 gallon. New natural rock gravel mixed with one lb of crushed coral.

ph is now 7.6 I don’t know have gh and kh bc I am out of strips but in recent past gh runs 75 on tetra strip. Kh varies from 0 to 20 sometimes 40 mostly on lower end.

Nitrite 0 nitrate 10 and ammonia 0.25 or a tad less. So where in the middle in api test kit.

he has stress stripes and has had them for over a month.

they have lightened up and gotten less tho.

the red mark on his head has always been there. I was worried the white saddle back on him was Columnaris. Plus the whiteness in his eye could maybe be Popeye. I noticed it all about two months ago. Treated with antibiotics and had my first cycle crash and the white spot didn’t go away nor the eye.

he eats and he is active so maybe the white spot is ok. However his eye is not. Is it diamond eye or popeye.!? I think diamond. But thought I would see what others think.

I know betta like lower ph but I had no buffer and constantly struggled with ammonia spike and and being able to produce enough bacteria.

I think now that I have added some buffer to the substrate I can start growing bacteria. I am already doing better bc ammonia stayed at .50 and nitrates always a trace. Now I have less ammonia and nitrates and a more stable ph

 

I have a sponge filter and a small finnexx7 nano hob.

heater and inkbird controller. Java fern and Amazon frog bit plus fake plants too.

 

what do you all think!? Medicate again with food not to ruin my cycle progress or let it be because it’s diamond eye

Edited May 8, 2022 by JessLynne7
Not sure if posted

[JessLynne7]

I’m not sure if I uploaded this.

 

 

test!?

[Colu]

I think the best course of action would be daily water changes and add a double dose of prime to help detoxify any ammonia till it stays at zero as I think water quality is what's causing most of your problems the cloudy eye you mentioned can be caused by poor water quality as well I would add some Indian almond leaves as they have antibacterial and antifungal properties as well as the water changes 

[JessLynne7]

On 5/8/2022 at 9:20 PM, Colu said:

I think the best course of action would be daily water changes and add a double dose of prime to help detoxify any ammonia till it stays at zero as I think water quality is what's causing most of your problems the cloudy eye you mentioned can be caused by poor water quality as well I would add some Indian almond leaves as they have antibacterial and antifungal properties as well as the water changes 

@Colu

i got the almond leaves today and out one in.

here’s some good pics and you can see the good eye vs bad.

been feeding out of a feeding ring preparing for the worst

 

[Dancing Matt]

Ammonia in the water is a concern, work on eliminating that and see if he improves.

[Colu]

It's possible the eye is like that because he's a dragon scale Betta am not 100% sure that why  have you managed to get the ammonia to zero  with the daily water changes

[JessLynne7]

On 5/11/2022 at 9:12 PM, Colu said:

It's possible the eye is like that because he's a dragon scale Betta am not 100% sure that why  have you managed to get the ammonia to zero  with the daily water changes

The test today was almost to 0. It was yellow with a hint of green. Just a hint. The most yellow result I’ve had. Nitrites still 0 and nitrates around 5-10

[JessLynne7]

On 5/11/2022 at 8:12 PM, Dancing Matt said:

Ammonia in the water is a concern, work on eliminating that and see if he improves.

@Dancing Matt

yes I was struggling and had two cycle crashes.

the ammonia was ammonium bc my ph was running around 6 some days it wouldn’t even register at 6. Bc of that bacteria was struggling 

I added 1lb of coral mixed it in and changed my substrate and did a 50 percent water change about a week ago. My ph is now 7.2-7.4. Bacteria must be growing bc nitrates are going up and ammonia is going down and nitrites are at zero. I also added some tetra safe start plus. I know people hate tetra but that stuff has worked for me.

we seem to be doing better. I got some almond leaves and added one yesterday 

@Colu

ammonia is yellow on api test with minor tint of green so I’m somewhere between 0-.25. Doing much better. Ph was around 7.2 yesterday evening. Nitrite 0 and nitrates between 5-10.

we are doing much better. I added some botanicals and an almond leaf yesterday.

I just added the whole leaf. Should I opt to make a tea to add to water instead!? I’ve never used these leaves before

[Colu]

I just add the leaves but other people such as @Guppysnail makes tea by boiling the leaves it's up to you if you don't like the look of the leaves in your tank boil them and add the tannins I personally like the leaf litter look    

Edited May 26, 2022 by Colu

[JessLynne7]

Thank you.

I added the leaf right away thinking the sooner the better but now I’m thinking I should have made tea . My oh my the decisions

[Guppysnail]

On 5/12/2022 at 7:39 AM, Colu said:

I just add the leave but other people such as @Guppysnail makes tea by boiling the leaves it's up to you if you don't like the look of the leaves in your tank boil them and add the tannins I personally like the leaf litter look    

I am not the one who makes tea. I lay them overlapping and run a zip tie through them and a suction cup and stick them on the back wall as a “flower” background on the inside. 

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

Dragonscales are prone to scales growing over the eye and sometimes require removing the scale over the eye. I am not seeing that yet but the color of one of his eyes sure makes me think that could occur down the road. I would post on one of the Betta focused forums and do some research on that. The one on FaceBook is sometimes a little brutal but not as bad as the Reddit group. Or you can certainly keep posting here but that's a very specific question. Inglorious Bettas Gianne may also be a good resource. 

As long as the leaves are from a legitimate source should be ok to just plop them in. The tea method is used to add/release humic acid more quickly either for a blackwater look or for the quick infusion of some of the more medicinal compounds the leaves emit. Although some have argued on other forums that the heating of the leaves may breakdown some of the beneficial compounds through the heating, others argued that this is the only way to get the compounds to release yadda yadda yadda. I have not seen a study on this. As you said decisions decisions. 

I found the first 3-6 months is always difficult with these guys and then with all the ups and downs you've had despite these he is still with us which is a credit to your husbandry. Keep having fun and hang in there. Bettas are marketed as beginner fish but due to all the inbreeding I think at the least they're intermediate. I would put fancy guppies in there as well as neon tetras. I feel like there needs to be a video and some evangelism on this. Chris at Fish For Thought is probably the person who has railed against this the most. 

[JessLynne7]

On 5/12/2022 at 8:48 AM, Guppysnail said:

I am not the one who makes tea. I lay them overlapping and run a zip tie through them and a suction cup and stick them on the back wall as a “flower” background on the inside. 

Make a flower!? Way cool!

[JessLynne7]

On 5/12/2022 at 12:47 PM, Beardedbillygoat1975 said:

Dragonscales are prone to scales growing over the eye and sometimes require removing the scale over the eye. I am not seeing that yet but the color of one of his eyes sure makes me think that could occur down the road. I would post on one of the Betta focused forums and do some research on that. The one on FaceBook is sometimes a little brutal but not as bad as the Reddit group. Or you can certainly keep posting here but that's a very specific question. Inglorious Bettas Gianne may also be a good resource. 

As long as the leaves are from a legitimate source should be ok to just plop them in. The tea method is used to add/release humic acid more quickly either for a blackwater look or for the quick infusion of some of the more medicinal compounds the leaves emit. Although some have argued on other forums that the heating of the leaves may breakdown some of the beneficial compounds through the heating, others argued that this is the only way to get the compounds to release yadda yadda yadda. I have not seen a study on this. As you said decisions decisions. 

I found the first 3-6 months is always difficult with these guys and then with all the ups and downs you've had despite these he is still with us which is a credit to your husbandry. Keep having fun and hang in there. Bettas are marketed as beginner fish but due to all the inbreeding I think at the least they're intermediate. I would put fancy guppies in there as well as neon tetras. I feel like there needs to be a video and some evangelism on this. Chris at Fish For Thought is probably the person who has railed against this the most. 

Hey thank you for your response.  I have had this betta for a year and two months now.

his poor little eye issue is a newer development.

I just don’t want ol to call it diamond eye and it be pop eye or Vice versus.  I can try some more betta specific groups or forums and am a member of one.

 

crazy always a debate about stuff,lol

 

thank you

[Guppysnail]

On 5/12/2022 at 2:22 PM, JessLynne7 said:

Make a flower!? Way cool!

Give me a few minutes and I’ll make one and take pics so you can see how. 

[Colu]

On 5/12/2022 at 1:48 PM, Guppysnail said:

I am not the one who makes tea. I lay them overlapping and run a zip tie through them and a suction cup and stick them on the back wall as a “flower” background on the inside. 

Must of been thinking of someone else

[Guppysnail]

On 5/12/2022 at 2:22 PM, JessLynne7 said:

Make a flower!? Way cool!

I buy bulk so they are not pressed flat and pretty the way most are. 

[JessLynne7]

On 5/12/2022 at 2:39 PM, Guppysnail said:

Give me a few minutes and I’ll make one and take pics so you can see how. 

So creative with like everything! That’s awesome you give us people who are not creative hope

On 5/12/2022 at 2:47 PM, Guppysnail said:

I buy bulk so they are not pressed flat and pretty the way most are. 

Such a good idea and then they are not all over your gravel! Smart

[Torrey]

On 5/12/2022 at 6:01 AM, JessLynne7 said:

Thank you.

I added the leaf right away thinking the sooner the better but now I’m thinking I should have made tea . My oh my the decisions

I have used both with my bettas. They like having the leaf litter, and the tea needs to get pretty strong to reach therapeutic levels.

Research, to make decision making easier:

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308344669_The_Effects_of_Terminalia_catappa_L_Leaves_Extract_on_the_Water_Quality_Properties_Survival_and_Blood_Profile_of_Ornamental_fish_Betta_sp_Cultured

[JessLynne7]

We are in some trouble and took a turn for the worst.

I have been keeping almond leaves and extracts of tea in his tank. The Diamond or cloudy eye did not get better and it seemed like his other eye started getting worse. About a week ago I noticed some scraps on his scales and missing scales on his side. He was also jerking and twitching. I treated one round of prazi pro just to make sure it was not flukes. I k ow it could be he scrapped hisself bc he can’t see but the jerks scared me and from my re search praxis could not hurt.

 

he eats he swims he flares at his mirror daily.

today I come home from work and find he is missing more scales on his face and has a huge knot on his head and his face is swollen. He’s hiding at bottom on tank. His scales are pineconed only where the swollen knot on his head is and no where else.

hos color looks dull and gray. 

I dosed water with kanaplex and dosed metroplex in his food. He ate. He flares at his mirror. He came out for pics but went back to hiding. Drogon isn’t doing well.

I hope I’m doing the right thing hete and I can’t find any info

[Colu]

I think the  injury's are because of his sight I would remove any thing in the tank that he could injury him self on 

[JessLynne7]

I am thinking that as well he hurt his self. Poop dude is all banged up.

I am worried about infection bc for him to lay in his cave well that never happens ever. He’s not hisself. I’m sure going blind and banging yourself up is scary.

what about the intense twitching and jerks. He doesn’t flash against objects but he jerks like seizes up and two he’s hard. He’s been doing it for awhile and it’s more and more frequent 

[Colu]

The twitching could be caused by  water quality are you still getting any ammonia any nitrites as he has been in the same tank for more than a year if you haven't add any other fish  or plant in the past 2-3 months it unlikely to be parasites I couldn't rule it out

Edited May 25, 2022 by Colu

[JessLynne7]

On 5/25/2022 at 7:08 AM, Colu said:

The twitching could be caused by  water quality are you still getting any ammonia any nitrites as he has been in the same tank for more than a year if you haven't add any other fish  or plant in the past 2-3 months it unlikely to be parasites I couldn't rule it out

He has been in the tank a year and half his whole life. One other fish a pleco that passes away a few months back.

plants have been added yes recently. I do soak plant in alum overnight and then in fresh water for 2-3 days before adding to the tanks.

I finally got it to cycle but had low levels ( .25) ammonia for several weeks.

now we are at 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and nitrates where at 10 yesterday 

 

[Colu]

Do you not what the pleco died of