South American stocking suggestions for a 40gal breeder – details of tank in body text

[Retrophyllum_minus]

Hi everyone I have a stocking question for a 40gal breeder tank which will be heavily planted. I am looking for suggestions/comments regarding South American fish specifically. It's not a biotope tank but I still want to stick to S. American species.

Sand substrate, some driftwood and river stones. 

It'll be a bit before the plants are well established and I'm happy with it. I'm patient. But when I am I want to be prepared for what fish I'll stock in it. 
 

There will be CO2 injection, an air stone if needed, and approximately 200 gallon per hour filtration from a modified Marineland HOB. However, I'm also going to play with a sponge filter and see whether I like that better - either way, I'll ensure adequate filtration. 

These are my possibilities currently. I've made a list. Obviously it would be some of these, not all of them. 

Fish list

One type of Cory from this list:

Peppered Corys (Hoplisoma paleatus) which I've learned was recently reclassified into Hoplisoma from Corydoras. These are my top choice I think. 

Sterbai Corys (Corydoras sterbai)

True Eques Corys (C. eques)

Pygmy Corys (C. pygmaeus)

Adolfo's catfish (Corydoras adolfoi) - also another favorite.

Violet Corys (C. similis)

One group (or two?) of a Tetra spp.

Von Rio Tetras (Hyphessobrycon flammeus) - a favorite.

Cardinal Tetras (Paracheirodon axelrodi)

Crystal Tetras (Protocheirodon pi)

And then maybe/probably one or both of the following:

Guppies (Poecilia reticulata)

Dwarf Pencilfish (Nannostomus marginatus)

 
What are some other possibilities I am missing that may do well with some of these based on my parameters?
 

Would some of these possible options be a bad idea or not work for the pH/etc I have listed below?

 

What combination of these might do well? I am pretty set on the Von Rio tetras and the Peppered Corys. The rest I am open to ideas on.
 

Parameters that are important is the pH will probably hover around 7-7.5 - I'll have to wait and see what it settles at with the hardscape and plants once they're established. The water is hard well water. I can post the general hardness and kH later - I'm not home currently.
I want to keep the temperature in a range that will be good for the corys and tetras specifically and then decide on other fish that will best match those criteria. 

Thanks for your thoughts!

[clownbaby]

Woo! I am saving up for a 40gal breeder that will have South American fish in it too! The stocking will funnily enough be very similar. 

I think yes, peppered corydoras & Von Rio Tetras are a great match! I love the Hyphessobrycon fishes very much. I am kind of an addict for mixing in some otocinclus in with a corydora school. They enjoy each other's company. I love my otos, very funny and adorable! For high light and co2 they will also keep algae down. I think dwarf pencilfish are super cool also and might make a cool addition 🙂

In my experience, pygmy corydoras are annoyingly tiny. I have them in my 30gal and their mouths are so tiny that finding a food they can eat is a struggle. I have to stick to repashy gel food and daphnia for live foods exclusively. If you're not into having to make food or culture live foods, dont get them haha

I see no problems with pH or gH as long as you get tank-raised fishes! All of them are pretty hardy. 

An ideal temperature range would be 75 to 79 degrees fahrenheit, pH range of 5.8 to 7.8 would be good, and gH of 5-15; so you have some wiggle room. 

Maximum numbers I would recommend are as such:

peppered cories x 10 - 15

von rio tetra x 12 - 15 

dwarf pencilfish x 10 - 15

and if you added some otos, I would add them one at a time to make sure algae is available and aim for 3 as a goal. Otos are shoaling fish but you do gotta make sure there is some algae available, so start slow 🙂 

And honestly the numbers above are low. You could increase these: at those numbers your tank would be about 70% stocked or so, so understocked. Play around on aqadvisor - its a super helpful tool.

[Retrophyllum_minus]

On 9/9/2024 at 12:28 PM, clownbaby said:

And honestly the numbers above are low. You could increase these: at those numbers your tank would be about 70% stocked or so, so understocked. Play around on aqadvisor - it's a super helpful tool.

Thank you! I am just quoting this small part of what you wrote, but I appreciate it all. Lots of useful commentary and ideas. I think those stocking suggestions sound good. I'd rather understock to start than overstock. 
 

I'd love to hear more of what you're thinking of stocking in yours, as well. 
 

When I get to the point where it is worthwhile to post photos I will do so.

[knee]

You can do one male or a pair of Bolivian rams for your centerpiece fish 

[Tony s]

On 9/10/2024 at 3:06 AM, knee said:

You can do one male or a pair of Bolivian rams for your centerpiece fish

@Retrophyllum_minus that would be awesome. Or for slightly smaller, look up laetacara species. I have araguaia. The have a lot of color in their brown body. Or try curviceps. All 3 of these have great personalities. 

[Retrophyllum_minus]

On 9/10/2024 at 8:04 AM, Tony s said:

Or try curviceps.

Ooh. Just looked into the Laetacara curviceps and I like the look of/what I'm reading about those a lot. 

[knee]

Another option would be Nannacara Anomola. They’re just a bit smaller than Laetacara but also has some nice colors. 

[clownbaby]

On 9/9/2024 at 7:49 PM, Retrophyllum_minus said:

Thank you! I am just quoting this small part of what you wrote, but I appreciate it all. Lots of useful commentary and ideas. I think those stocking suggestions sound good. I'd rather understock to start than overstock. 
 

I'd love to hear more of what you're thinking of stocking in yours, as well. 
 

When I get to the point where it is worthwhile to post photos I will do so.

I am planning on black neon tetras (my absolute favorite fish I have ever kept), ember tetras, and salt & pepper cories (aka dainty cories). Maybe a small pleco, I just love plecs. Still have a lot more money to save though ... hahaha. Probably gonna hoard my birthday money and holiday money and then buy the tank from that. So I have a ways to go 🙂 Plus I want to get a co2 system for it so I need to get rich asap!

[HelplessNewbie]

I am also planning for my 40 gallon breeder. Perfect timing with this topic. I also like the look of the curviceps but I wonder which are more peaceful: Laetacara curviceps or german (blue, black, gold) ram?

I am leaning toward rummynose tetra with a type (or 2) of cory with oticinclus and amano shrimp.

My tap water is soft. Tank will be heavily planted with sand and gravel in separate areas.

[Tony s]

On 9/10/2024 at 5:06 PM, HelplessNewbie said:

german (blue, black, gold) ram?

When I tried the german rams, they weren't all that peaceful. But let's ask @Guppysnail. She breeds a several of those species. 

[Guppysnail]

On 9/10/2024 at 6:28 PM, Tony s said:

When I tried the german rams, they weren't all that peaceful. But let's ask @Guppysnail. She breeds a several of those species. 

I had them with CPD and pleco and they did fine however with similar size fish or corydora im uncertain if they spawn they could get hurt by cory while defending spawn site 

My Bolivian Ram breeding group does great with cherry barbs and psuedomugil gertrudae but again with corydora that’s questionable 

[Retrophyllum_minus]

On 9/10/2024 at 5:06 PM, HelplessNewbie said:

I am also planning for my 40 gallon breeder. Perfect timing with this topic.

Nice. What is your setup? Substrate? Filter? Etc. 

I'm just curious. 

[Tony s]

@Guppysnail @Retrophyllum_minus was also looking at nannacara, laetacara curviceps, possibly araguaia, or dorsigera (they just dont know it yet 😄) and bolivians. Which ones of those go best in a soft water community tank? Looks the best and remains peaceful?

[Guppysnail]

On 9/10/2024 at 7:10 PM, Tony s said:

@Guppysnail @Retrophyllum_minus was also looking at nannacara, laetacara curviceps, possibly araguaia, or dorsigera (they just dont know it yet 😄) and bolivians. Which ones of those go best in a soft water community tank? Looks the best and remains peaceful?

Curviceps are very peaceful. If you getvtrue curviceps they are beautiful blue. Many popular online sites are selling dorsigera as curviceps. You can tell because curviceps never have the deep black yellow or white striping. And the top edge of the dorsal is always white. I had a breeding pair with 2 Apisto girls. Dorsigera I would not trust plus they like warmer water. Though I ADORE my dorsigera pair. I happen to have 200 curviceps juveniles right now so message if you go that route.   Bolivians are very peaceful. I just wholesaled my Bolivians so if you direct message me I can let you know where to get tank raised. Nannacara are on my next to breed list so no input. 
 

Since corydora are a must have provide tall smooth structures cichlids can spawn on that they won’t feel need to forever defend against nosey corydora. 
 

These are the resin decor stone looking cave swim throughs they work great to spawn on top of. 
 

[HelplessNewbie]

On 9/10/2024 at 6:57 PM, Retrophyllum_minus said:

Nice. What is your setup? Substrate? Filter? Etc. 

I'm just curious. 

I am putting in an under gravel filter with 4 uplifts: 2 air-driven and 2 (mini)powerhead-driven. Substrate: recycled gravel with some crushed coral on top of ugf plates; then on top of that will be soil (with root tabs) and wood pellets (ala hugel kultur style) in media bags (maybe rolled up, maybe flat), then on top of bags will be Safe-T-Sorb on half the footprint, and decking sand or black diamond blasting sand (not sure yet) on other half. Air driven diy sponge filter(s) for insurance. Lighting will be cheapo led strip as I only plan on easy plants. 

Canister filter is on standby for polishing only. Paranoid about leaks.

[Tony s]

On 9/10/2024 at 7:52 PM, HelplessNewbie said:

Paranoid about leaks

To ease that paranoia a bit. keep your cannister in a tote or on a medium depth pan. then go to a Home Depot or Lowes and get a cheap moisture sensor. One that will scream at you when it gets wet. That way you know for sure if it leaks.

[Guppysnail]

On 9/10/2024 at 8:01 PM, Tony s said:

To ease that paranoia a bit. keep your cannister in a tote or on a medium depth pan. then go to a Home Depot or Lowes and get a cheap moisture sensor. One that will scream at you when it gets wet. That way you know for sure if it leaks.

I do this but not the sensor. I need to check those out! Thanks 

[Tony s]

On 9/10/2024 at 8:34 PM, Guppysnail said:

I do this but not the sensor. I need to check those out! Thanks 

I didn’t do it for that but it works. I went into the basement a month ago and stepped into 8 inches of crystal clear water. Didn’t even see it at first. The softener stuck on and the sump failed. Just by luck I got there then. It could have filled up to the electric panel otherwise. I’d have had my own personal swimming pool down there  😅

[Guppysnail]

On 9/10/2024 at 9:46 PM, Tony s said:

I didn’t do it for that but it works. I went into the basement a month ago and stepped into 8 inches of crystal clear water. Didn’t even see it at first. The softener stuck on and the sump failed. Just by luck I got there then. It could have filled up to the electric panel otherwise. I’d have had my own personal swimming pool down there  😅

Wow that stinks!

[Tony s]

On 9/10/2024 at 10:07 PM, Guppysnail said:

Wow that stinks!

Yep. Was an interesting couple of days anyway. Saved most things. 

[Tropical Fish Gallery]

On 9/10/2024 at 9:02 AM, Retrophyllum_minus said:

Ooh. Just looked into the Laetacara curviceps and I like the look of/what I'm reading about those a lot. 

This was the first fish that came to mind when I read your post title.  A LOVELY fish.

[Retrophyllum_minus]

On 9/10/2024 at 11:47 PM, Tropical Fish Gallery said:

This was the first fish that came to mind when I read your post title.  A LOVELY fish.

Yeah it looks it. And it looks like its temperament will work with the others. 

[Retrophyllum_minus]

On 9/10/2024 at 7:52 PM, HelplessNewbie said:

with some crushed coral

Oh, you must have softer water and a lower pH if you're adding the crushed coral. I have hard well water so that is not my concern, but I do need to drop my pH slightly. I'll be seeing if driftwood will do it and if not I'll play around with other ideas. I'd like to avoid using any chemical treatments to drop the pH. 

[Guppysnail]

On 9/11/2024 at 8:05 AM, Retrophyllum_minus said:

Oh, you must have softer water and a lower pH if you're adding the crushed coral. I have hard well water so that is not my concern, but I do need to drop my pH slightly. I'll be seeing if driftwood will do it and if not I'll play around with other ideas. I'd like to avoid using any chemical treatments to drop the pH. 

My tap is crazy hard I have to cut it 50/50 with RO or distilled for it to even register in tests. I do many fish that need soft low ph water. I simply cut my tap with RO or distilled.  Walmart purified drinking water is Ro. When I only had 2 species that needed the softer water I just bought that to mix. I upgraded to an RO system as I branched out to many soft water types. 

[clownbaby]

On 9/11/2024 at 5:05 AM, Retrophyllum_minus said:

Oh, you must have softer water and a lower pH if you're adding the crushed coral. I have hard well water so that is not my concern, but I do need to drop my pH slightly. I'll be seeing if driftwood will do it and if not I'll play around with other ideas. I'd like to avoid using any chemical treatments to drop the pH. 

Botanicalsssss! Leaves. Seed pods. Cones. I use oak leaves, almond leaves, alder & birch cones, alder leaves, leaves from my Guiana chestnut tree (whenever they fall)... but there are so many options. They slowly lower the pH and also feed microorganisms in your tank, which is super beneficial for your beneficial bacteria colonies. You can buy these online or collect them outside. I usually collect them because I am cheap, but make sure if you do collect stuff from outside you know it is in an area that does not use herbicides pesticides etc :]