What is y’all’s opinion on dr Tim’s aquatics ammonia dosage?

[Whitecloud09]

Hello all, back with another topic and question. 
 

I started my 20g long tank cycle yesterday. I used the whole bottle of dr Tim’s one and only, and dr Tim’s ammonium chloride. I did 1 drop per gallon which for a 20g equals 20 drops. I know that the bottle now says 4 drops per gallon, but reading several things on the internet has brought me to believe that 4 drops is extreme.

But is it? I tested paremeters this morning and these were my current levels.

Ammonia: .25 or less ppm.

nitrite: 0 ppm.

Ph was 7.5 and stable.

Yes it’s day two, I am not trying to jump to conclusions but what is y’all’s opinion? 4 drops per gallon too much? 1 drop per g? 
I am just wondering. I was thinking that maybe since a 20g would have more ammonia with more fish to work with that I should dose 4 drops per gallon during the cycle, so it will be ready to handle more fish. I am just getting opinions, TIA 

🙂

Edited June 6 by Whitecloud09
Mistype in title.

[AllFishNoBrakes]

In my experience 4 drops per gallon seemed way overkill to me. I used 2 drops per gallon, iirc.

To me, I only need the tank to process the waste from the initial food I’m putting in. Additional fish, or feeding more, the established bacteria colonies should be able to catch up if you ramp up nice and slow on the feeding. 

[Pepere]

4 drops per gallon yields 2 ppm.

 

I see noproblem with 2 ppm so long as you dont have livestock in the tank.

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/6/2024 at 12:29 PM, AllFishNoBrakes said:

In my experience 4 drops per gallon seemed way overkill to me. I used 2 drops per gallon, iirc.

To me, I only need the tank to process the waste from the initial food I’m putting in. Additional fish, or feeding more, the established bacteria colonies should be able to catch up if you ramp up nice and slow on the feeding. 

Thanks! 

 

On 6/6/2024 at 12:29 PM, Pepere said:

4 drops per gallon yields 2 ppm.

 

I see noproblem with 2 ppm so long as you dont have livestock in the tank.

I don’t. Yes I did 4 drops for my 10g. I guess I will try 2 ppm next time and see what that yields. And maybe if I dose again during this cycle I will try 4 drops. 
So 2 or 4. Idk

[Tony s]

As long as you have measurable ammonia your cycle will progress. It’s better to do the 2 ppm to get a stronger colony. It may take a bit longer when keeping the numbers down. That’s all.

[face]

I’ve always wondered if when you dose high amounts of ammonia if you don’t get different kinds of nitrifying bacteria there’s a lot of different kinds some do better in high ammonia/ nitrite environments some do better in low you see often enough that people will get a cycle that can handle quite a bit of ammonia but is crashes when fish are added I’ve been wondering if this isn’t because the bacteria can’t survive in very low ammonia environments but that’s just a thought 

I’ve also wondered if with that much ammonia you don’t get more bacteria in the actual aquarium instead of in the filter in a filter is relatively safe it’s more likely to get disrupted in the aquarium especially in a basically Sterile environment when you start adding food to the aquarium and it starts to get out competed it’s better for it to be in the filter but who knows it would take a lot of money and time to figure this out 

but honestly I wouldn’t worry to much regardless it will cycle just need time 

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:07 PM, face said:

I’ve always wondered if when you dose high amounts of ammonia if you don’t get different kinds of nitrifying bacteria there’s a lot of different kinds some do better in high ammonia/ nitrite environments some do better in low you see often enough that people will get a cycle that can handle quite a bit of ammonia but is crashes when fish are added I’ve been wondering if this isn’t because the bacteria can’t survive in very low ammonia environments but that’s just a thought 

I’ve also wondered if with that much ammonia you don’t get more bacteria in the actual aquarium instead of in the filter in a filter is relatively safe it’s more likely to get disrupted in the aquarium especially in a basically Sterile environment when you start adding food to the aquarium and it starts to get out competed it’s better for it to be in the filter but who knows it would take a lot of money and time to figure this out 

but honestly I wouldn’t worry to much regardless it will cycle just need time 

Thanks. Yes I was not worrying on how long it would take, just asking for a recommendation for dosage. I guess 2 drops. Nobody really clearly has said that. Allfishnobrakes said 2 and pepere said 4. Idk what to do. Sorry if I misunderstood guys 😆. But @Tony s, and @face, what would you do? 4 drops to equal 2 ppm?

[Meep556]

Why exactly would you need to add ammonia? I’ve never had to add it. When I was cycling my tank I was told to add a rice grain sized piece of raw meat. Would adding ammonia from a bottle speed up the cycling process? 

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:19 PM, Meep556 said:

Why exactly would you need to add ammonia? I’ve never had to add it. When I was cycling my tank I was told to add a rice grain sized piece of raw meat. Would adding ammonia from a bottle speed up the cycling process? 

Good question. I’ve used Dr Tim’s ammonia for every tank I’ve cycled. Idk I never thought of why I really use it, somebody just recommended it @Meep556

[Tony s]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:19 PM, Meep556 said:

Why exactly would you need to add ammonia? I’ve never had to add it. When I was cycling my tank I was told to add a rice grain sized piece of raw meat. Would adding ammonia from a bottle speed up the cycling process? 

what you were doing is a type of ghost feeding. the rotting meat and/or rotting fish food supplies ammonia for the cycle. adding ammonia is just a more direct method to do the same thing. you can also do a fish in cycle where fish provide the ammonia

[Yoshi]

It's just a more precise way to control the amount of ammonia.

I've been using it to cycle my 55 gallon, as @whitecloud09 already knows 😄  I actually found 4 drops per gallon never quite got me to the 2ppm level.  The dosing instructions also say one teaspoon = 100drops.  That saved me some time standing over my tank!

[Meep556]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:27 PM, Tony s said:

what you were doing is a type of ghost feeding. the rotting meat and/or rotting fish food supplies ammonia for the cycle. adding ammonia is just a more direct method to do the same thing. you can also do a fish in cycle where fish provide the ammonia

Ah ok. Yea I cycled my first tank with the piece of meat method. After that I’ve mostly done fish in cycles. I just make sure to stay on the low side of the tanks population when I do fish in cycles. 

[face]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:13 PM, Whitecloud09 said:

Thanks. Yes I was not worrying on how long it would take, just asking for a recommendation for dosage. I guess 2 drops. Nobody really clearly has said that. Allfishnobrakes said 2 and pepere said 4. Idk what to do. Sorry if I misunderstood guys 😆. But @Tony s, and @face, what would you do? 4 drops to equal 2 ppm?

At the end of the day it probably doesn’t matter I’d probably do 2 drops but I don’t think it really matters that much 

On 6/6/2024 at 2:26 PM, Whitecloud09 said:

Good question. I’ve used Dr Tim’s ammonia for every tank I’ve cycled. Idk I never thought of why I really use it, somebody just recommended it @Meep556

People use it because it’s known quantity people us to use hardware stores cleaning ammonia for example but you don’t know how much to add without trial and error fish in cycles require more work and just letting something rot in the aquarium is off putting to some there’s pros and cons to them all 

[Airborne 82nd]

I did my fishless cycle with the same products Dr. Tims. Cycle started mid Jan 2024 cycle complete mid April. 0 ammo 0 nitrIte 160 nitrAtes added ammonia 2ppm 24 hours later it was eaten did this 2 days done. Did enough water changes to get NitrAtes to 10ppm. I did not care about the drops only the results 2ppm. This may not shorten your cycle time but will give you a larger colony. You don't need Dr. Tims it just gives you more control Now when I put my fish in 1Oscar 1 Pleco both 1 1/2 inches. These fish are messy but at this size they cannot produce 2ppm ammonia in 7 to 10 days when I do a 50% water change. So to answer face yes I lost a lot of the colony they have to eat cut back on there food (ammonia) they will die now the colony will stay the size for the amount of ammonia the fish give them add another fish = more ammonia = more colony. The  bacteria like moving water there will be some on everything but the water column but most will be in the filter how much depends on the surface area of your filter media. Just remember the colony will grow or die off depending on how much food (ammonia) they are given no matter what it come from.

Airborne

EDIT NEVER use added ammonia with fish in They are the ammonia makers.

Edited June 6 by Airborne 82nd

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:54 PM, face said:

At the end of the day it probably doesn’t matter I’d probably do 2 drops but I don’t think it really matters that much 

People use it because it’s known quantity people us to use hardware stores cleaning ammonia for example but you don’t know how much to add without trial and error fish in cycles require more work and just letting something rot in the aquarium is off putting to some there’s pros and cons to them all 

Thank you @face. 

 

On 6/6/2024 at 3:05 PM, Airborne 82nd said:

I did my fishless cycle with the same products Dr. Tims. Cycle started mid Jan 2024 cycle complete mid April. 0 ammo 0 nitrIte 160 nitrAtes added ammonia 2ppm 24 hours later it was eaten did this 2 days done. Did enough water changes to get NitrAtes to 10ppm. I did not care about the drops only the results 2ppm. This may not shorten your cycle time but will give you a larger colony. You don't need Dr. Tims it just gives you more control Now when I put my fish in 1Oscar 1 Pleco both 1 1/2 inches. These fish are messy but at this size they cannot produce 2ppm ammonia in 7 to 10 days when I do a 50% water change. So to answer face yes I lost a lot of the colony they have to eat cut back on there food (ammonia) they will die now the colony will stay the size for the amount of ammonia the fish give them add another fish = more ammonia = more colony. The  bacteria like moving water there will be some on everything but the water column but most will be in the filter how much depends on the surface area of your filter media. Just remember the colony will grow or die off depending on how much food (ammonia) they are given no matter what it come from.

Airborne

EDIT NEVER use added ammonia with fish in They are the ammonia makers.

Thanks for the time to post this! I truly appreciate it!!! @Airborne 82nd

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:30 PM, Yoshi said:

It's just a more precise way to control the amount of ammonia.

I've been using it to cycle my 55 gallon, as @whitecloud09 already knows 😄  I actually found 4 drops per gallon never quite got me to the 2ppm level.  The dosing instructions also say one teaspoon = 100drops.  That saved me some time standing over my tank!

Yes. Thank you @Yoshi! Lol

Edited June 6 by Whitecloud09

[Galabar]

I've done all of my fishless cycles with a bottle of ammonia that I got at the grocery store.  Just make sure it has a single ingredient.  You can fill up a 5 gallon bucket, does a certain mL and see what the ppm reads.

[Whitecloud09]

So, side Q. My ammonia is 1 ppm. Should i add more? I am on day 7, on this guide i have from dr tims website, it says add more today. Should i wait till it goes under .25 ppm? Idk what to do. Because i thought it may spike (the ammonia) and cause high ammonia. Like maybe more than 4 ppm, which what i have read can stall the cycle. It is 9:30 pm here tho, so if i did i would add more tommorow. Thx!

[Tony s]

On 6/7/2024 at 2:05 AM, Galabar said:

I've done all of my fishless cycles with a bottle of ammonia that I got at the grocery store

You know, I thought about that. But wasn’t sure it was the exact right kind, or if it was slightly different. 

On 6/14/2024 at 9:31 PM, Whitecloud09 said:

on this guide i have from dr tims website, it says add more today

Follow the guide. Check if you’re concerned about it. Getting it back to the correct level could speed it up 

[Galabar]

My approach has been to add "seasoned" filter media (and plants) from other tanks and add the ammonia once.  After I see nitrites go to 0, I add fish.  You could certainly add ammonia again, and make sure that both ammonia and nitrite go to 0 quickly.  However, at some point, you just have to add fish.  I also try to add fish slowly and feed lightly.

 

[Tony s]

On 6/15/2024 at 12:54 AM, Galabar said:

My approach has been to add "seasoned" filter media (and plants) from other tanks and add the ammonia once.  After I see nitrites go to 0, I add fish

I agree. I’ve even gotten in the habit of keeping extra sponges in existing tanks. I’ve actually cycled 2 new tank instantly that way in the last couple of weeks. No ammonia or nitrites to speak of. Yet (Crossing all fingers and toes)

[AdamS]

I last cycled a 20 gallon long using this method. One and only plus ammonia. It took 14 days just like the schedule says. I put in 4 drops per gallon. 
 

Side answer. Put in ammonia up to 2 ppm. 

[Galabar]

I wish those products would also come with potassium nitrite, which might knock off a couple of weeks of cycling for a new tank.

ACO, you listening? 😉

Edited June 15 by Galabar

[Lennie]

On 6/15/2024 at 9:11 AM, Galabar said:

I wish those products would also come with potassium nitrite, which might knock off a couple of weeks of cycling for a new tank.

ACO, you listening? 😉

Ammonia to nitrite takes pretty fast tho. Nitrite to nitrate takes much longer. So this would lead an overdose of nitrite, especially considering ammonia ends up reading more nitrite and nitrite reading more nitrate on test results when converted to the next one.

Idk if it is true, but sth like this: 1 ppm ammonia --> 2.7 ppm nitrite --> 3.6 ppm nitrate.

If you dose 2ppm ammonia and also nitrite, and while nitrite is processing for much longer time but ammonia constantly increasing the nitrite, you will then either depend on nonstop testing and constant water changes or waiting forever for nitrite to process and completely eliminate.

 

 

On 6/6/2024 at 7:22 PM, Whitecloud09 said:

Hello all, back with another topic and question. 
 

I started my 20g long tank cycle yesterday. I used the whole bottle of dr Tim’s one and only, and dr Tim’s ammonium chloride. I did 1 drop per gallon which for a 20g equals 20 drops. I know that the bottle now says 4 drops per gallon, but reading several things on the internet has brought me to believe that 4 drops is extreme.

But is it? I tested paremeters this morning and these were my current levels.

Ammonia: .25 or less ppm.

nitrite: 0 ppm.

Ph was 7.5 and stable.

Yes it’s day two, I am not trying to jump to conclusions but what is y’all’s opinion? 4 drops per gallon too much? 1 drop per g? 
I am just wondering. I was thinking that maybe since a 20g would have more ammonia with more fish to work with that I should dose 4 drops per gallon during the cycle, so it will be ready to handle more fish. I am just getting opinions, TIA 

🙂

I dont have access to this product in my country. But when I started researching for saltwater tanks, I saw MANY people cycling with this. Again, I have no first hand experience, and salt water is not the same as freshwater, but it is way more common beyond saltwater people using these instead of some other ammonia releasing starting technique like dropping in fish food. Or old school shrimp method

[Whitecloud09]

On 6/15/2024 at 12:28 AM, Tony s said:

You know, I thought about that. But wasn’t sure it was the exact right kind, or if it was slightly different. 

Follow the guide. Check if you’re concerned about it. Getting it back to the correct level could speed it up 

Thanks. I am going to add more tonight, checked paremeters after asking the Q last night and it is same, 1 ammonia, 0 nitrite. I will soon start nitrate tests later. 

 

On 6/15/2024 at 2:09 AM, AdamS said:

I last cycled a 20 gallon long using this method. One and only plus ammonia. It took 14 days just like the schedule says. I put in 4 drops per gallon. 
 

Side answer. Put in ammonia up to 2 ppm. 

Thank you! Thanks @Tony s, @AdamS, @Galabar, and @Lennie