Tank is a mess! Please help!

[StephG]

I’ve had a goldfish for almost a decade with no issues for years and decided to add 2 new fish after my other black moor died a few months back. So I added two new goldfish about 3 weeks ago. Long story short the new black moor developed white spots so I treated for ich with aquarium salt and took filter cartridge out with daily 25% water changes using prime for a week. He died anyway and now then if guy has fin rot and are not eating with labored breathing. The koi is darting around nervously but appears okay just a little split in a fin. The other was white now looks more pink. I can see some veins that I don’t remember seeing before. Water is a bit cloudy. There is some funky looking tiny white algae ? with little hairs on the glass. I’ve put the filter back in, stopped the water changes, tried melafix, added stresszymes and I’m adding ph down because it’s a bit high between 8.2-9. Carbonate is also high in the 200’s, alkalinity is high also appears in the 200’s, no ammonia or nitrates or nitrites and GH is like zero because we have soft water. I don’t know what to throw at this anymore! These poor guys have symptoms of everything so I don’t know what to do next. I’m spending so much on this stuff trying to figure it out. Just ordered Tetra Lifeguard to try next. Please help!!

[Ken Burke]

I think the root of your problem is water quality, so I would start there.  
 

out of your tap, what are your perimeters, especially ph an kh?

 

[StephG]

Looks like Ph is high from tap close to 9 and kh also very high closer to the 360 end. I’m confused about how to fix these because it says when you add crushed coral it will raise ph but mine is already super high

[Stroy15]

yeah, you don't need crush coral because of your tap. I not sure what to make of "white spots" in your tank but I can recommend some sachem alkaline buffer and PH down for your next water change, if you aim to keep PH at 8.0.  

Edit: other sachem products can also be helpful in achieving water equilibrium to raise Gh and Kh to maintain the PH. Although you seem to have a lot of Kh in your system.

Edited August 14, 2022 by Stroy15

[StephG]

Big guy is now belly up 😞 koi is only one left. Now that I think of it maybe it’s the water softener? It’s never been an issue before but since I had to do so many water changes to treat the ick maybe that’s what through it all off??

[Ken Burke]

I would try measuring your tap water after letting it set for 2 - 24 hours.  Heigh co2 can cause height ph.

 

Out of curiosity, are you on well or city water?  
 

Personally I would not do anything to change you water until you have a better understanding about what is happening.  Well, except adding almond leaves, if you feel you need to do something.

[StephG]

We are on a well and have a water softener. I bypassed the softener and tested it straight from the well and it looks a little better, ph still on the higher end but better GH. I may try to draw a few gallons from the bypass and let it sit awhile then change out some tank water to see if that helps. I’m worried my koi is gonna be next to go!

[Stroy15]

yep the high ph is hurting your fish go with ph down and run to the fish store or grocery store for some spring or RO water or aquarium water they should be at a ph of 7 which lowering the ph would be fist priority for your tank. You need to get the water down to an 8 ph rather than 9.

[StephG]

Ok will do! Thanks so much for both of your input on this. Super frustrating and sad to lose my big fish and the little black moor was so young. Everything was fine just a few weeks ago. Ph was always on the money around 7.5. Introducing the new fish lead to this cascade of chaos. Hopefully I can save this last guy 🤞🏼

[modified lung]

On 8/14/2022 at 11:47 AM, StephG said:

Ok will do! Thanks so much for both of your input on this. Super frustrating and sad to lose my big fish and the little black moor was so young. Everything was fine just a few weeks ago. Ph was always on the money around 7.5. Introducing the new fish lead to this cascade of chaos. Hopefully I can save this last guy 🤞🏼

Did something change with the water you use recently? If the amount of carbonate on your test is accurate, 7.5 pH would be very strange especially after the water sits around for a while. 

[Patrick_G]

Have you tested for ammonia? I have a suspicion that you might have disrupted your cycle when you added new fish and then removed your old filter cartridge. With a fully cycled tank you should be registering some Nitrates even though you’re doing extra water changes. Ammonia in the water might also be causing the cloudiness and the new algae. 

[StephG]

Before all of this ph was nice and stable around 7.5. I only had one fish in a 20 gallon tank for many months, maybe that’s why it stayed good? I only did small water change once a month. We are experiencing a severe drought at the moment so I’m sure that could have changed the well water somehow. 
 

I bought an ammonia alert thingy and it’s registering safe so it doesn’t appear to be an ammonia issue but I know what you mean. Weird right that I have no nitrates or nitrites?
 

 

[Ken Burke]

If the ph doesn’t come down after resting you water, you may need to cut you well water with RO or spring water.  Check the spring water before use.  
 

 Drought impacting you well water is a reasonable hypothesis.  Hopefully it improves 

[nabokovfan87]

On 8/14/2022 at 7:44 AM, StephG said:

Your PH is monumentally high.  I don't know how much I trust that strip.  I would try to ask a shop locally if you can have them test water for you. 

PH, KH, GH, Nitrites, Nitrates, Ammonia, and temperature.

I think you're dealing with something called old tank syndrome.  Second to that, because it's a goldfish tank you could be dealing with issues from a buildup of thiaminase.

In terms of how to "fix this" there's a few things that need to happen in order and we need to investigate further to resolve it long term.

First, we need to understand where the tank is at now.  Getting the water tested from a secondary source.  Whether that's a different test kit or a place that will do it for you.

Second, we need to understand what your tap water is doing.  This means the off-gassing test.
A.  Test water from the tap and record that data (tests mentioned above)
B,  Aerate that water sample for 24 hours with an airstone and retest.  When you do your water changes in the tank, this is the parameters you'd expect to see as a result of that water change.
C.  Compare the results from test B to your tank water testing results.

Third, 30% water changes, 1 every 24-48 hours to rebalance the tank and equalize your water quality.  You'll need to do a good gravel vac, clean filters, clean impellers, and verify that everything is working properly to maintain water quality. 

Fourth, long term care at this point.  Gravel vac once a week.  Water changes once every 7-14 days.  Testing weekly.  And hopefully all of this results in a tank where parameters are stable for the fish and they can recover. 
 

On 8/14/2022 at 6:30 AM, StephG said:

Long story short the new black moor developed white spots so I treated for ich with aquarium salt and took filter cartridge out with daily 25% water changes using prime for a week.

Can you please share your filtration and how you have it setup?

[Brandon p]

This often used for discus but I have used it on my tanks. You do have to prepare your water a day or two before and a little goes a long way. Don’t add it to the tank directly. Seachem makes and acid buffer but I prefer this method. You will need to lower the dose from the discus amounts but I love it. 
 

 

 

[StephG]

Wow you guys are amazing! I only wish I had done this sooner. This is such great info. I didn’t know about old tank syndrome but it sounds a lot like my situation. The filter I use is just a basic filter from the local petco with the charcoal and the cotton filter I pour it in, then I rinse and slide into the holder. I’m going to get some spring water today, bring my water to get tested and look for the acid buffer phosphoric stuff as well. You guys have given me so much insight I can’t thank you enough!! 🙏🏼