Evan.. Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 Hey y’all, I’m having an issue and I don’t know how to fix it. My plants will not stay alive and I’ve tried everything. I have about 3 1/2- 4in of gravel and I use root tabs I have my light on for about 9 hours a day and they don’t seem to be doing well at all. I do 2 water changes a week and gravel vac about every week and a half (depending on how dirty it is). Any insight would be great, thanks!!. also the pics are from when I got them till now (when I got them they were full,now not so much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 I’m not a plant expert but for stems planting them to close together is not good. Anything near the lower half not getting enough light will shed the leaves. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seattle_Aquarist Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 Hi @Evan.. It may be light related but it looks more like a nutrient issue, possibly one of the mobile nutrients since it looks like the stems are moving nutrients from older leaves and using it for new growth. What size tank? What root tabs are you using? How many do you dose? How often? Do you know any of your water parameters like pH, dKH, dGH, nitrate ppm? -Roy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan.. Posted February 12, 2022 Author Share Posted February 12, 2022 (edited) @Seattle_AquaristI have around 8ph,10-15 nitrate ppm,80-120 kh,and gh of around 150 oh and I’ve used flourish tabs by seachem. I spaced them out a couple of inches around the plants Edited February 12, 2022 by Evan.. Forgot to say something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmiller2001 Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 I know @Seattle_Aquaristwill get you squared away shortly, but you will want to start water column dosing even with root tab use. From my experience and from following a few journals, roots tabs can't cover everything and require water column dosing. However, water column dosing can cover everything and root tabs can be eliminated. I would start some research into liquid fertilizer (or dry) and start using it. With your pH above 7, I would look for separate NPK and Micro solutions. You'd want the Micro solution to be DTPA chelated or Ferrous Gluconate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanked Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 I agree that initially the plants were planted too close together. What time span are we dealing with? Your tank might be too clean. Cutting back on the water changes and gravel vacs may help. I see at least two plants that have two sets of roots. Cutting off between those nodes and planting the top most portion might give you more plants and stimulate the bottom portion to produce new growth. I have found that sometimes the new growth has acclimated to your specific conditions, and the cutting out performs the parent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan.. Posted February 12, 2022 Author Share Posted February 12, 2022 @Tankedi first got the plants on January 22nd, I will definitely try cutting the top off and planting it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanked Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 On 2/12/2022 at 11:17 AM, Evan.. said: @Tankedi first got the plants on January 22nd, I will definitely try cutting the top off and planting it New plants often go through a die back (melt). Some just don't like change! You are 3 weeks in and have new growth showing, so be patient. What are the 5 grass like stems in the foreground of the first picture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan.. Posted February 12, 2022 Author Share Posted February 12, 2022 (edited) @Tankedso should I still atleast spread them out more? Oh and those stem like plants are a kind of grass that I bought from my local fish store, I can’t seem to remember what they were called though Edited February 12, 2022 by Evan.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seattle_Aquarist Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 (edited) On 2/11/2022 at 7:00 PM, Evan.. said: Hey y’all, I’m having an issue and I don’t know how to fix it. My plants will not stay alive and I’ve tried everything. I have about 3 1/2- 4in of gravel and I use root tabs I have my light on for about 9 hours a day and they don’t seem to be doing well at all. I do 2 water changes a week and gravel vac about every week and a half (depending on how dirty it is). Any insight would be great, thanks!!. also the pics are from when I got them till now (when I got them they were full,now not so much Hi Evan, Let's start off with some background basics. Most of the plants we use in our aquariums are not "true aquatics" (plants that only grow submerged in water) but are instead "marginals" which are plants that grow along rivers and lakes and have adapted to living both submerged in water and emersed (out to water). Plants we buy at our local aquarium shops (except for tissue culture plants) come from aquarium plant nurseries in Florida, Asia, and greenhouses. In order to grow the most plants as quickly as possible, and avoid issues like algae on leaves, snails, etc. the nurseries grow their plants emersed typically with the bottom of the plants either submerged or in very boggy soil. All that is fine the nurseries grow plants quickly and they cost us less and we get plants without algae and pests Unfortunately plants that are grown emersed do not typically transition smoothly to growing submerged. When plants are grown emersed they develop a thick cuticle layer on the leaves to prevent transpiration (loss of water through the leaves) which would result in wilting or drying out in the air. Unfortunately, the leaves with a thick cuticle layer cannot 'breathe' underwater and utilize the dissolved CO2 in the water. So what happens when we plant emersed grown plants is the emersed grown leaves start to die, and stems try to re-absorb as much of the nutrients from the dying leaves, and use those nutrients and energy to develop new submerged grown leaves that can 'breath' submerged. Once we understand this, we realize it is 'normal' for new stems and plants to experience a 'die off' shortly after we plant them. The trick is to be patient, allow the stems or crowns of the plants to grow new submerged leaves that are adapted to being submerged, and progress from there. Many of the comments above are correct regarding not crowding stems and plants together and waiting for the tops of the stems with the new submerged grown leaves to grow sufficiently to trim and plant them. As for dosing nutrients in to the water column I would suggest doing low doses at first until the new submerged grown leaves have emerged and the stems are growing. Why? Just as the cuticle layer blocks emersed grown leaves from getting CO2 from the water it can restrict the intake of nutrients as well. As more submerged grown leaves emerge from the stems you can increase the dosing of nutrients into the water column. Seachem make many good products and their root tabs are fine for some species (I like them for Cryptocorynes and swordplants) as a supplement but Seachem Flourish Tabs are not meant to be an all-purpose fertilizer, in fact their website states "Provides micro elements, trace elements and other nutrients". The tabs contain very little nitrogen or phosphates and a moderate amount of potassium which are the macro-nutrients that plants need the most of for good healthy growth.We could spend a lot of time discussing the methods nutrient dosing in the substrate verses the water column but let's talk about your tank. You have a high pH of 8.0, moderate dKH of 5-6 degrees, and moderate dGH of about 8 dGH. Other than some issues the high pH may cause your tank should grow plants well. @Evan.. where are you located? Are you in the U.S. or overseas so I know what products to recommend. -Roy Edited February 14, 2022 by Seattle_Aquarist 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted February 12, 2022 Share Posted February 12, 2022 When I first tried stem plants like I had similar results. ☹️ I was annoyed and wanted to yank them out and start over. My wife who is a intuitive gardener cut the tops and replanted them. It took a while but they eventually started growing great. I would start off by following @Tanked’s suggestions and do some trimming and replanting. There’s a good chance not everything will bounce back but for now put your effort into the plants that do. For nutrients get a good comprehensive fertilizer like Easy Green. I would also buy more plants! It seems like plants just grow better in tanks with a high plant mass. Some plants aren’t grown emersed and don’t need a conversion period. Look for Sword species, Lotus species and Aponogeton. Anubias is another good choice. It is grown emersed but weathers the conversion process with little die back. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan.. Posted February 13, 2022 Author Share Posted February 13, 2022 @Seattle_Aquaristim located in the u.s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeQ Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 I can't post any examples now but first thing I do with new plants is to take note if they are reacting properly to your light? Are they opening and closing with your daylight cycle? This tells you more than any numbers you can provide us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanked Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 On 2/12/2022 at 12:07 PM, Evan.. said: @Tankedso should I still atleast spread them out more? Oh and those stem like plants are a kind of grass that I bought from my local fish store, I can’t seem to remember what they were called though Whatever they are, I think they may provide an interesting look. They look a lot like the new growth on the Horsetail reeds in my pond. I'm not familiar with the plants you have there, but I would give them a little more space. When planting a garden always keep in mind the needs and size of the plants next month and next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seattle_Aquarist Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 On 2/12/2022 at 10:37 PM, Evan.. said: @Seattle_Aquaristim located in the u.s Hi @Evan.. Regrettable the suggestion to use Easy Green as an all purpose fertilizer will result in your plants getting little to no iron (about 3% of the total amount in the bottle). Why, because it uses EDTA chelated iron as the iron source which becomes unavailable to plants at a high pH. Quote I have around 8ph,10-15 nitrate ppm,80-120 kh,and gh of around 150 oh and I’ve used flourish tabs by seachem. An all-purpose fertilizer is the easiest to dose an if you go that route I suggest Nilocg.com Thrive C which contains only DTPA iron or you could dose both Easy Green plus Easy Iron (which does contain some DTPA iron). Whichever way you go follow the instructions on the bottle to start. Hope this helps! -Roy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishoff Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 Really helpful information in this post. Thank you 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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