Mostly native fish, riffles habitat compatibility question

[NoCo tap water]

Hello, I’m in the early stages of prep and building a tank for a mostly native community stream/decent flow 29. My centerpiece will be rainbow darters, the tank is being scaped for them, but I have some compatibility questions with other fish.

The temp will be set at 64, but during the summer my unheated tanks can hit 70 in my fish room. High flow across the length of the 29gal.

Im torn between rainbow shiners or Pygmy Sunfish as a secondary. Does anyone know if the sunfish can handle the flow? Any behavioral concerns? Come to think of it same question with the Florida flagfish, they seem more Stillwater though.

I also would like to have some hillstream loaches. The temp and flow will work great. Any behavior issues anyone can think of? I had previous issues in another tank with platty out competing the hillstreams for food to the point of starvation, I don’t want to do that again.

thanks all for any input!!

Edited September 28 by NoCo tap water
Words

[Mississippi fish guy]

On 9/27/2024 at 11:05 PM, NoCo tap water said:

Im torn between rainbow shiners or Pygmy Sunfish as a secondary. Does anyone know if the sunfish can handle

Pigmy sunfish are generally found in water with slow or no flow so I don’t think they could handle the flow well. I did find a pigmy sunfish in a creek with decent current but it was hiding in a slower area in so grass that was hanging in the water.

@Fish Folk has experience with native fish and can probably answer other questions you might have.

[NoCo tap water]

Thanks man!! Yeah I’d rather not chance it and stick to the shiners. Appreciate it.

[Tlindsey]

On 9/28/2024 at 12:05 AM, NoCo tap water said:

sunfish can handle the flow? No they don't thrive in high current water like the rainbow darter. I personally would just add the rainbow shiners to the aquarium. @NoCo tap water

 

[Fish Folk]

On 9/28/2024 at 12:05 AM, NoCo tap water said:

Hello, I’m in the early stages of prep and building a tank for a mostly native community stream/decent flow 29. My centerpiece will be rainbow darters, the tank is being scaped for them, but I have some compatibility questions with other fish.

The temp will be set at 64, but during the summer my unheated tanks can hit 70 in my fish room. High flow across the length of the 29gal.

Im torn between rainbow shiners or Pygmy Sunfish as a secondary. Does anyone know if the sunfish can handle the flow? Any behavioral concerns? Come to think of it same question with the Florida flagfish, they seem more Stillwater though.

I also would like to have some hillstream loaches. The temp and flow will work great. Any behavior issues anyone can think of? I had previous issues in another tank with platty out competing the hillstreams for food to the point of starvation, I don’t want to do that again.

thanks all for any input!!

Rainbow Darter will love that setup. Temperature plan is excellent. If your substrate is dark, they'll carry a darker under color. If it is light, they'll appear more of a tan color.

Pygmy Sunfish are not typically found where there is much flow. They'll probably not like that arrangement. Rainbow Shiners, however, will love it. No aggression issues I've ever noticed. I keep and breed both Notropis chrosomus and Elassoma gilberti.

I've never kept Hillstream Loaches with Rainbow Darters. I want to assume they'd get along . . . but that's a question mark.

Florida Flagfish are Ok with _some_ flow. I prefer female Flagfish to help with algae. Males get very aggressive if they decide to spawn. Mymale torn into my Rainbow Shiner's tails.

As far as Darters go, Rainbow Darters can get chunky. I like Banded Darters better -- but they can prove to be harder to keep alive.

Here's two tanks of mine featuring Rainbow Shiners and different Darters  . . .

 

 

[NoCo tap water]

On 9/27/2024 at 10:49 PM, Fish Folk said:

Rainbow Darter will love that setup. Temperature plan is excellent. If your substrate is dark, they'll carry a darker under color. If it is light, they'll appear more of a tan color.

Pygmy Sunfish are not typically found where there is much flow. They'll probably not like that arrangement. Rainbow Shiners, however, will love it. No aggression issues I've ever noticed. I keep and breed both Notropis chrosomus and Elassoma gilberti.

I've never kept Hillstream Loaches with Rainbow Darters. I want to assume they'd get along . . . but that's a question mark.

Florida Flagfish are Ok with _some_ flow. I prefer female Flagfish to help with algae. Males get very aggressive if they decide to spawn. Mymale torn into my Rainbow Shiner's tails.

As far as Darters go, Rainbow Darters can get chunky. I like Banded Darters better -- but they can prove to be harder to keep alive.

Here's two tanks of mine featuring Rainbow Shiners and different Darters  . . .

 

 

You rock man! That’s everything I was iffy about. I really appreciate the advice and experience. 

I’m going to stick with the rainbow darters and shiners. I kinda want to see what happens with the loaches so they are in as well.

Should have fish in the tank in about 2mo depending on my acrylic ship date. I’ll let you know how it goes.

Thanks again !

 

 

 

[NoCo tap water]

@Fish Folk

Hey, I’m on the process of setting up a hardscape for these darters. I wanted your opinion, habitation wise, before I start planting.  Marked up photo shows the current.

thanks!!

[MWilk]

That’s going to look really good when it’s all cleared up. Don’t be afraid to let the rocks build up some algae for everyone to eat. 

[NoCo tap water]

On 10/6/2024 at 8:46 AM, MWilk said:

That’s going to look really good when it’s all cleared up. Don’t be afraid to let the rocks build up some algae for everyone to eat. 

Thanks man! Yeah I plan on adding some hillstreams in there too, in my experience they really need a good seasoned tank to thrive from the start. Otherwise it’s the whole, which of 100 foods do I have to buy for you to not die….

[MWilk]

On 10/6/2024 at 9:50 AM, NoCo tap water said:

Thanks man! Yeah I plan on adding some hillstreams in there too, in my experience they really need a good seasoned tank to thrive from the start. Otherwise it’s the whole, which of 100 foods do I have to buy for you to not die….

For sure. Them, and otocinclus, poor things will starve to death without some green slimy stuff to chew on. I have 2 tanks with hillstreams and I just leave the back wall green, in the one tank between the one loach and the Amano shrimp he keeps the wood completely cleaned off so I always find him crawling around the back glass leaving trails. 

[NoCo tap water]

I trusted my gut and started planting.

Marcus fish tank got my order slightly wrong (quantities) so I got less sag than expected, and it came in pretty rough too. I have them in my plant grow out bucket with a ton of co2 and light until they come back a bit. 
 

I plan on having the right side front sparingly spaced from the low point up the hill with the dwarf sag.

going to order up some more buce for the crevices.

once it clears up you should see the plants from my living sump for my guppy pond tank underneath.

 

we’ll see what happens. Thanks for the help y’all 

Edited October 6 by NoCo tap water
Photos

[Fish Folk]

On 10/6/2024 at 10:20 AM, NoCo tap water said:

@Fish Folk

Hey, I’m on the process of setting up a hardscape for these darters. I wanted your opinion, habitation wise, before I start planting.  Marked up photo shows the current.

thanks!!

Perfect! Absolutely perfect! What species are you looking to add? Keep temperatures as cool as possible. Under 70-F is best. Feed them Hikari frozen bloodworms.

[NoCo tap water]

On 10/6/2024 at 9:14 PM, Fish Folk said:

Perfect! Absolutely perfect! What species are you looking to add? Keep temperatures as cool as possible. Under 70-F is best. Feed them Hikari frozen bloodworms.

Thanks man. 
The temp was plan is a tiny heater set at 65. I’m in a Colorado basement and that window sill can get an unheated tank down to 60. My unheated tanks will usually sit at 68-70 in the summer , peaking for a week or two at 72. Though this is my first acrylic tank and it is sealed super tight , we’ll see what happens.

I have an email out to BT Darters, their high color variation rainbow marketing has me interested. https://btdarters.com/product/high-color-rainbow-darter/
 

I did settle on rainbow shiners and hillstreams to go with them, we’ll see how that goes .

 

[Fish Folk]

On 10/7/2024 at 12:09 AM, NoCo tap water said:

I’m in a Colorado basement

^^this is every Darter’s dream tank^^

[NoCo tap water]

Tank is starting to clear up a bit, check out the living background!!

 

Bonus photos from some of my other tanks That’s Broiges the redtail. Destroyer of fins .

Edited October 7 by NoCo tap water
Photos

[Biotope Biologist]

Looks good! Here is what my mature algae looks like. It changes color based on the photo period. I have an unheated stream tank. Water stays around 68-72F. I love my stream style tank and im sure you will love yours too! 

 

 

Edited October 7 by Biotope Biologist

[NoCo tap water]

On 10/7/2024 at 10:36 AM, Biotope Biologist said:

Looks good! Here is what my mature algae looks like. It changes color based on the photo period. I have an unheated stream tank. Water stays around 68-72F. I love my stream style tank and im sure you will love yours too! 

 

 

Man that looks amazing , how?

[Biotope Biologist]

Patience lots of patience haha. Took about 1.5 years for it to get that long. 

[NoCo tap water]

Water is “light and sweet”. Fish in!

shiners and loaches came in from huna. Great shape as always 

[NoCo tap water]

@Fish Folk

Hey, there seems to be a waitlist from BTdarters. Otherwise I’m good to keep darters in co. 

Do you have a preferred source/vendor? I’d prefer tank spawned/raised but not a 100% dealbreaker.

[Fish Folk]

On 10/10/2024 at 8:16 AM, NoCo tap water said:

@Fish Folk

Hey, there seems to be a waitlist from BTdarters. Otherwise I’m good to keep darters in co. 

Do you have a preferred source/vendor? I’d prefer tank spawned/raised but not a 100% dealbreaker.

I have darters arriving today from jonahsaquarium.com

Edited October 10 by Fish Folk

[NoCo tap water]

On 10/10/2024 at 6:39 AM, Fish Folk said:

I have darters arriving today from jonahsaquarium.com

Awesome!!! I’ll check them out

[NoCo tap water]

Settling in well. I’ve never kept rainbow shiners before. Best I can describe their behavior is a cross between white clouds and rosy-red minnow that tightly school. Fun fish , can’t wait to see them color up.

https://streamable.com/w16i1e

 

I did place an order with jonahs aquarium. Should see the darters next week some time .

Edited October 10 by NoCo tap water

[Mississippi fish guy]

On 10/10/2024 at 12:44 PM, NoCo tap water said:

rosy-red minnow

I kept those as well as fathead minnows before. They are great fish though in the future I will not put them with my angel fish since they were bullies when it was feeding time. Also I found an interesting mutation on one from my grandparent’s pond that I escaped or was eaten by a catfish before I could bring it home.

This minnow had one whole tail fin and part of another.
 

also my brother caught one out of the same pond that was completely see through with green eyes but when he handed it to me so I could see it it flipped back into the pond. I’m hoping that someday I catch another weird fathead or rosy red so I can breed them to get that trait passed down.

[NoCo tap water]

On 10/10/2024 at 3:08 PM, Mississippi fish guy said:

I kept those as well as fathead minnows before. They are great fish though in the future I will not put them with my angel fish since they were bullies when it was feeding time. Also I found an interesting mutation on one from my grandparent’s pond that I escaped or was eaten by a catfish before I could bring it home.

This minnow had one whole tail fin and part of another.
 

also my brother caught one out of the same pond that was completely see through with green eyes but when he handed it to me so I could see it it flipped back into the pond. I’m hoping that someday I catch another weird fathead or rosy red so I can breed them to get that trait passed down.

Fatheads, that’s what they are called, I kept thinking hammerhead but knew that wasn’t right.

I’ve only kept them once, briefly. Few years ago I into a Petco, their minnow tank had all sorts of fungus growing all over them, like an inch of frothy death at the top of the tank . I was totally grossed out, and that’s all I could think of when I saw them in my tank. They had to go