svachon9 Posted June 5 Share Posted June 5 I have 2 Tidal 110's. I have 3 sponges in one and 2 with a bio-bag in the other. I just cleaned them and in a week they overflow button pops up. I do not believe it good or necessary to clean this filter weekly. Any suggestions? Or is this even a big deal? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rube_Goldfish Posted June 5 Share Posted June 5 @nabokovfan87 you've spent a fair amount of time with Tidal HOBs, right? Any thoughts? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 5 Author Share Posted June 5 I even did a slight mod to one by making bigger holes at the bottom of the basket and it didn't seem to make a difference. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 5 Share Posted June 5 On 6/5/2024 at 4:21 PM, svachon9 said: Any suggestions? Or is this even a big deal? I solved the problem by turning my Tidal hob in to a basement dust collector and replacing it with a Canister filter. You could opt for a different solution. my personal opinion of the Tidal filter is not very high. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 5 Author Share Posted June 5 On 6/5/2024 at 6:52 PM, Pepere said: I solved the problem by turning my Tidal hob in to a basement dust collector and replacing it with a Canister filter. You could opt for a different solution. my personal opinion of the Tidal filter is not very high. Ha not happening and not very helpful but thanks anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 Had I bought the canister filter from the get go, the cost of the Tidal would havepaid half of it… but regardless, another HOB would be superior to the Tidal. Even if the overflow button is not up an awful lot of the flow is completely bypassing the filter sponges going through that massive bypass cut out in the basket. And that water pours out into the tank largely bypassing any other media pile in the basket…. If the water is not going through the filter media, it really isnt doing much filtering… I dont think there is any reasonable solution to make the tidal work well…. I lived with it for 8 months and I should have canned it much earlier… The only mod I could forsee that might be worthwhile is removing the plastic basket and friction fitting coarse foam in its place, I have absolutely no regret in replacing mine with a fluval 207… I have dramatically improved flow throughout the entire tank that keeps injected CO2 in suspension in the waterand only service it once a month Personally I am not enamored with HOBs or Sponge filters, but truth be told every filter has its compromises and downsides…. The Tidal series doesnt have much upside in my opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoshi Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 I'll be honest, I'm loving my Tidal 55. I haven't had any problems with the bypass. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 Got it, everyone has their opinions on types of filters. I have what I have and I'm just looking for a solution to it or maybe the flow thing doesn't matter. Any opinions on that? Thanks! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyxxl Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/5/2024 at 4:21 PM, svachon9 said: I have 2 Tidal 110's. I have 3 sponges in one and 2 with a bio-bag in the other. I just cleaned them and in a week they overflow button pops up. I do not believe it good or necessary to clean this filter weekly. Any suggestions? Or is this even a big deal? Well some Google revealed it's notorious to bypass your sponges unless you fill the tray with holes. Because the flow is pretty strong and the tray is very restricted. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/5/2024 at 1:21 PM, svachon9 said: I have 2 Tidal 110's. I have 3 sponges in one and 2 with a bio-bag in the other. I just cleaned them and in a week they overflow button pops up. I do not believe it good or necessary to clean this filter weekly. Any suggestions? Or is this even a big deal? It's a very common thing... Are you running them stock in the media basket or is anything modified? On 6/5/2024 at 1:41 PM, Rube_Goldfish said: @nabokovfan87 you've spent a fair amount of time with Tidal HOBs, right? Any thoughts? Basically it's "normal" but there's a lot to discuss with that. Appreciate the tag! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 On 6/5/2024 at 8:23 PM, johnnyxxl said: Well some Google revealed it's notorious to bypass your sponges unless you fill the tray with holes. Because the flow is pretty strong and the tray is very restricted. Yes I've read that also. I have done some mods but am willing to do more if need be. When it bypasses, how much I wonder does it actually bypass? I mean does enough still go through the media? On 6/5/2024 at 8:37 PM, nabokovfan87 said: It's a very common thing... Are you running them stock in the media basket or is anything modified? Basically it's "normal" but there's a lot to discuss with that. Appreciate the tag! I have done a small mod where I made a couple of slots at the bottom of the basket bigger. I may have to do more I guess. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyxxl Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 I would make the basket as open as you can, also I would put sponge on the intake as a pre filter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/5/2024 at 8:58 PM, svachon9 said: or maybe the flow thing doesn't matter Well, if the water is not going through the media it is circulating and not filtering. The basket has huge bypass holes built into it where water bypasses the filter media hence the water is not getting filtered. When I plocked off those bypass holes, the water then overflowed the basket and again bypassed the media. The basket in essence is the problem with this “filter”. The coarse sponge in the bottom of the basket clogs up incredibly quickly due to minimal surface area and then flow through the sponge drops off quickly. I strongly suspect Seachem then redesigned the basket with the large bypasses to minimize the bypass float from raising up i mediately and make people think it wasnt bypassing so quickly. I tried various attempts to improve the thing to get water to flow through the filtering media before determining that the problem was more trouble than it was worth. I believe @nabokovfan87 was more persistent in pursuing a solution yet came to pretty much the same conclusion. the square upintake and the surface skimmer slots also make it inconvenient to add an intake prefilter sponge. I found I had to dissasemble the motor and impeller every week to clean that out as well as it would get loaded up with gunk. I had an Aqueon hob that also had the moror in the tank pumping water into the hob thatbI could fit a Co op prefilter onto and I removed the filter cartridges and used medium pore sponge in its place that was far less problematic than the Tidal…. But without question I much prefer the canister filter over either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/6/2024 at 2:13 AM, Pepere said: But without question I much prefer the canister filter over either. I woke up to the craziest issue with my canister filter yesterday. Not even sure it works, hoping it does.... The tidal has plenty of issues, so does the 407. So does just about every single filter out there. There is no "perfect" filter and it's sad that it's this difficult to get something that just works effectively out of the box. On 6/5/2024 at 6:38 PM, svachon9 said: Yes I've read that also. I have done some mods but am willing to do more if need be. When it bypasses, how much I wonder does it actually bypass? I mean does enough still go through the media? I'll post some sketches and details when I can in the morning, but for now, I highly recommend checking out my mod thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 But with water going through the overflow that doesn't mean that NO water is going through the filter media right? So is it still doing what it's designed to do just with the a bit of an annoyance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 (edited) Water will always seek the path of least resistance. As the obstruction through the filter media increases, proportionately more water will bypass…. realize that with the Tidan there is something like a half a centimeter of head between no restriction and overflow… 1 pound per square inch yields 2 feet of head. What fractional psi do you think is flowing through filter media when you have maybe a quarter to a half inch of head? Somewhere around 1/3 of an ounce per square inch of pressure..l. tonight I will take a few photos to illustrate part of the difficulty faced with the Tidal…. Edited June 6 by Pepere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 On 6/6/2024 at 11:40 AM, Pepere said: Water will always seek the path of least resistance. As the obstruction through the filter media increases, proportionately more water will bypass…. realize that with the Tidan there is something like a half a centimeter of head between no restriction and overflow… 1 pound per square inch yields 2 feet of head. What fractional psi do you think is flowing through filter media when you have maybe a quarter to a half inch of head? Somewhere around 1/3 of an ounce per square inch of pressure..l. tonight I will take a few photos to illustrate part of the difficulty faced with the Tidal…. Lots of numbers. So are you saying the filter is getting enough flow to effectively support the bacteria or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 It has enough to handle the bacteria. But it clogs very often… my canister never clogs I service it monthly as per manufacturers recommendation, but I bet it could go several months without… but there is also more to filtration than nitrifying bacteria. There is also bacteria that consume dissolved organics that reduce cloudy water making it more clear. And mechanical filtration.l. Simply put the tidal was always irritating me and I was always annoyed with it trying to make it work as it should. I also addes internal filters in addition to the tidal in an effort to have flow to keep the CO2 bubbles in suspension… and that had to be cleaned it weekly too.. and between the two of them and an iar driven box filter for mechanical filtration I was using more electricity than my Canister filter does now and not doing as good a job, had more current carrying wires immersed in tank water and had three filters visible in the tank… Within a month of swapping out I no longer had doubts about the decision to go with canister filter… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/6/2024 at 5:19 AM, svachon9 said: But with water going through the overflow that doesn't mean that NO water is going through the filter media right? So is it still doing what it's designed to do just with the a bit of an annoyance? There's a variety of issues, the majority of the water does not flow through the media. Cutting holes in the bottom doesn't fix that. There's bypass cutouts to ensure flow happens when the sponge is clogged, but unfortunately where Seachem put those in the basket design it means that the "path of least resistance" for the filter is to basically avoid everything. On 6/6/2024 at 11:38 AM, svachon9 said: Lots of numbers. So are you saying the filter is getting enough flow to effectively support the bacteria or not. The filter supports bacteria because it has media in a section of high oxygenation and flow. It can be greatly improved relatively easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 On 6/6/2024 at 3:10 PM, nabokovfan87 said: The filter supports bacteria because it has media in a section of high oxygenation and flow. It can be greatly improved relatively easily. What can be improved easily? Flow, bacteria or both. And then of course how? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quikv6 Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 You can improve consistant flow (ie: less "clogs"/bypass) which, in turn, will support bacteria consistantly (because of less "clogs"/bypass) by............switching to an aquaclear. Yes...I know that isn't what you want to hear. But sometimes a direct and efficient improvement is a new start with something else that has a better track record with what YOU want to improve on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 On 6/6/2024 at 1:21 PM, svachon9 said: What can be improved easily? Flow, bacteria or both. And then of course how? I would suggest going to the thread in my signature. It has photos of all the mods I've done and what the result of those changes are. Fixing one thing compounds an issue elsewhere and so you have to decide what sort of fix you want to implement based on what your goal is. My goal was to remove the skimmer entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynameisnobody Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 @Pepere I’d hate to be the person to gift you a tidal for your birthday. We do share the same feelings for it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svachon9 Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 My bottom line is, as long as the filter is supporting bacteria, and providing sone mechanical filtration (which it appears to be doing both) then who cares it there is some overflow. Am I wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepere Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 On 6/6/2024 at 6:50 PM, svachon9 said: My bottom line is, as long as the filter is supporting bacteria, and providing sone mechanical filtration (which it appears to be doing both) then who cares it there is some overflow. Am I wrong? Well, if your happy with it, keep going with it. personally I have no regrets over having replaced it. If you decide to stop servicing it when overflow indicator shows, it would probably be a good idea to continue testing for ammonia nitrite until you gain confidence levels do not rise with deferred maintenance.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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