Nano Fish ready to be put in self sustaining Tank?

[ouray1]

For the last 2 1/2 weeks I’ve been waiting for my heavily planted guppy grass 5 gallon aquarium with some small pearl weed and dwarf grass & moss (no filter) so far the guppy grass is exploding like crazy and producing enough oxygen aswell as removing many bad elements. I added 2 ghost shrimp to start eating some algae. I haven’t done any water changes more or less adding water every week from evaporation. I plan to add very very few maybe 2-3 nano fish in this tank within the next two weeks. My ammonia and nitrite levels are zero nitrate is between 20-30(I think less now) ph I believe is 6.0-6.4. I talked to my local fish store they told me just to give it 2 weeks or a week 1/2 and add the 3 nano fish then I don’t plan to add anymore than that due to the ecosystem adapting to that bio load. This tank was mainly done outta experimentation because usually for my self sustaining setups I do have a filter in the beginning later on take it out once it’s heavily planted and thriving. So my question should I add the nano fish with the next week or so? 

[Fish Folk]

Can you say more about "self-sustaining tank"? Do you plan to feed your fish at all? Is it self-sustaining in the sense that it just needs to be topped off occasionally?

I'll tell you what I would put in there . . .

Nothobranchius rachovii. Annual killifish. About the size of a Sparkling Gourami. Males are an explosion of color.

[ouray1]

I more or less plan to have a nano fish that will eat off the plants or at least that’s the plan but if it comes to topping it off once awhile that’s obviously okay. And great recommendation! I’m gonna do some research on those! I’m open to more ideas of other types of nano fish aswell I originally thought about ember tetras but I’d love to get a range of options

[Guppysnail]

Sounds like a great tank. One thing I would check before introducing fish is your dissolved oxygen levels at night. 
The plants produce o2 during the day while consuming co2. At night in the dark this reverses to consuming o2 and generating co2. 
Small dissolved o2 reagent tests are readily available. 
Early in the morning before sunup or light hits the tank do the test. The dissolved o2 will be at its lowest point then. 
If it is too low you can either add an airstone or perhaps choose a labyrinth organ fish. 

[ouray1]

Thank you!

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

Eating off the plants +- biofilm and aufwachs is what we’re talking about unless you stock it with daphnia, scuds, blackworms etc. When we start to get into the weeds on the Father Fish, Alex from Fishtory etc tanks unless you do the kind of work to stock them in this way it’s difficult to call it self sustainable. Dr. Walstad uses air stones in new setups to allow the blast mass to build enough for your to deal with the respiratory process @Guppysnailindicated.

The fish that eat plants are typical Loricariads so ancistrus. Algaevores like otocinclus, live bearers which go from Tiger Teddy’s to platys, guppies and Florida flag fish can do some of this plant eating but in the price of trying to get to the algae’s, biofilm, and aufwuchs they prefer. 

Tetras are opportunistic and will eat fish eggs, biofilm, really anything. Buenos Aires tetras are the worst plant eaters. 

3 fish that could handle these conditions I’d say Florida Flagfish would be the most ideal based on what you’re proposing. If you were willing to wait for green spot algae to form I’d say otocinclus. Male endlers or guppies or platys are another choice. 

[ouray1]

I’m really considering getting some air stones would you recommend ember tetras or mountain cloud minnows very very keep in mind for my tank? I came across those as an idea for my tank 

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

I think white clouds over embers from a hardiness perspective. You’ve got long fins, golds, Vietnamese and a couple other varietals now with Whiteclouds. 

[Lennie]

I personally really never understand a tank “self sustaining”

do you feed the tank? Do you top off? Add filteration? Add food? Clean the tank?

 

the thing is water changes are good. I think most people miss the point that water in nature don’t sit in a X gallon tank meanwhile they try to imitate “nature” in their tanks

[Fish Folk]

On 7/14/2023 at 6:17 PM, Beardedbillygoat1975 said:

Buenos Aires tetras are the worst plant eaters

^^ FACT ^^

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

^^FACT^^! @Fish Folk hahahaha!! 

@ouray1I think it’s all about what you’re into in the hobby. Low stocking levels are just not my jam most of the time. I’m in it for the fish and inverts and it’s hard for me not to see streaks of color and motion. My 60 g that my fishwife requested is the closest I’ve come to the sort of tank being discussed - but I’ve got a lot invested in the plants and am enjoying CO2 on this and my other tank. I almost threw in 50 green neons but my wife would have had my head! 

For others it’s the challenge of creating a self sustaining system I recognize that challenge it just not one I’m up for now. Or perhaps like father fish you have extremely hard water, like soft water fish wanting to give them an opportunity to thrive, and through deep sand beds and no water changes you soften the water and it allows for those soft water fish in a lightly stocked tanks to thrive. Ocean Aquarium in SF has the same beliefs he’s just not quite as vociferous as FF. For Alex at FishStory it’s taking up the challenge of father fish but with soft water here in the PNW he likes growing his fishes foods in the tank with the animals he keeps- I think he sees with black worms and scuds and daphnia before adding fish. I think as usual there’s more than one way to be an aquarist and as long as it brings you joy in for it! Have fun! 

[Peaceful Fish]

On 7/14/2023 at 5:20 PM, ouray1 said:

I’m really considering getting some air stones would you recommend ember tetras or mountain cloud minnows very very keep in mind for my tank? I came across those as an idea for my tank 

I personally think adding an air stone is a very good idea. I really like white clouds and cherry barbs for nano fish. 

[ouray1]

On 7/15/2023 at 2:08 PM, Lennie said:

I understand what you’re saying completely I haven’t add a water change for my other aquarium in months now it does have a filter and heater and obviously addition of water every once in awhile but it’s absolutely thriving I feel as it at least in case the more plants the better for the fish. The main reason I’m doing a self sustaining tank is because I have military orders from the air national guard and I won’t be home for a few months. I have family members to top off both my tanks but this more as an experiment for myself.

[ouray1]

I absolutely understand this more of an experiment than anything I have many friends who enjoy the self sustaining experience as-well as I am. Before I leave for my military orders and give some notes to my family about what to do I plan to get an air stone and heater for the aquarium. In reality my tank in the end won’t be exactly “self sustaining” a pure self sustaining tank is like dropping a human in a Forrest to survive possible but not pleasant. That’s why I’m adding a airstone and heater to give them a more pleasant advantage and experience. My idea and just what I‘ve seen is the more heavily planted tanks require less work and maintenance which is what I’m aiming for mainly just for military purposes of leaving home