Need new equipment, want the best.

[AllFishNoBrakes]

My uncle worked for Hach for the majority of his career before retiring. Their equipment is definitely above the hobbyists level, but maybe that’s what you need with what you intend to pull off 

[The endler guy]

On 12/23/2022 at 2:53 PM, BettaFishCO said:

Was testing my PH with my old BlueLabs ph pen but it looks like its done for. I'm looking for the best of the best ph, ppm, temp, etc. meters in the world. I don't want cheap stuff that ill instantly replace (like my recently bought 25$ ppm meter). Looking for the best in the field. I know with hydroponics bluelabs is pretty much the go to but maybe aquarist have a better one.

Thanks for the help.

I’m sure you don’t want cheep stuff but as with every hobby you can get into the “take out a lone and mortgage for your house” expensive 

if money isn’t a problem, I’d look into parameter testers used on deep sea camera rigs and used for rov’s

[anewbie]

On 12/26/2022 at 10:32 AM, tolstoy21 said:

We were discussing the Milwaukee devices earlier. The probes can wear out. I am not sure what their longevity is. But the better units have replaceable probes. Also, you are meant to store the probes in their caps, filled with storage solution, or yes they do dry out and will prematurely fail and require replacement.

Yeah, I've seen that solution as well.

I think in the end it depends on if you want to monitor a system or just perform periodic tests. 

Monitoring is nice since I believe you can have the CO2 solenoid flip on or off in response to the monitored Ph level, right?  

I never seen the purpose of flipping co2 on/off based on level since it takes time to 'gas' up and down; however yea that is the big difference between milwaukee/hanna and apex/bluelab (with monitor adapter)/hydros/... is taking a snap shot or monitoring. In freshwater i really have no clue what you would actually control with these devices but i do prefer the monitoring aspect to watch temp/co2. I would like to monitor tds in my low ph tank and will try using a close loop pump with the hydros tds monitor when i have thing setup in the spring. In theory that should work. They do also have water detectors in many of these bundles (hydros comes with it but i'm not using it) to detect aquarium leaks. Anyway i've not used apex and it is horribly expensive for what it offers but have used hydros and will test ghl in the spring. Given teh price point i don't see the point of the milwaukee/bluelab/hanna unless they proved more accurate than the hydros. I'm not saying the hydros is great but at the price point it does what those units do and seem reasonably accurate and provide actual monitoring. If you want actual control of devices ghl solution is probably the most cost effective - much cheaper than apex at the low end... of course there larger units are quite expensive.

[Streetwise]

I think the pH and temperature sensors are the same or similar for the ones you leave in the tank. I had to replace my temperature sensor after about 2-3 years ($38), and I’m about to replace my pH sensor after about 3-4 years ($90, 56, or 33).

[modified lung]

On 12/24/2022 at 4:23 PM, anewbie said:

What is ORP ?

 

On 12/25/2022 at 6:18 PM, BettaFishCO said:

it's something to do with the water basically squeezing out oxygen or the sucking up of oxygen.

ORP is the measurement of the amount of stuff in the water that wants to eat electrons. Oxygen eats a lot of electrons so more oxygen = higher ORP. But it doesn't have to be oxygen. Chlorine and hydrogen both eat a lot of electrons too so more chlorine or H+ also = higher ORP. 

High ORP usually means less harmful bacteria and viruses in the water.

On 12/25/2022 at 6:18 PM, BettaFishCO said:

Also, ever heard of over oxygenation of freshwater? I probably would run into that before too little. If so, I'll look into measuring orp. 

Usually only if the temperature suddenly increases or if there's a crack in a pipe before the intake of a pump sucking air into a pressurized system.

 

[BettaFishCO]

So, I need both, one to test and one to monitor as redundance. I love the replaceable probe models and actually never heard or seen a storage solution. Thats pretty cool. 

As far as co2 regulation, I will use a co2 tester for actual dissolved co2 which its kind of my ph down. My bio activity raises ph like crazy and constant co2 helps keep it in check. My balancing act is figuring out how much co2 I can actually use to regulate the ph. 

[BettaFishCO]

@modified lungIf hydrogen is looking for ions, wouldn't it readily attach to o2 making it neutral or water? so as long as your pumping air (mind you the temp micros of whats going on) into the water, the hydrogen would bond up? 

Also, would chlorine then try to stabilize at hydrogen chloride and or chlorine oxide? My chemistry is less than ideal.

[modified lung]

On 12/26/2022 at 1:28 PM, BettaFishCO said:

So, I need both, one to test and one to monitor as redundance

That's smart because pH sensors in continuous use drift off of their calibration over time. You need a second pH meter to know when the monitoring meter needs to be recalibrated. The second meter doesn't drift much because it's sensor is kept in the storage solution when not in use.

 

On 12/26/2022 at 1:35 PM, BettaFishCO said:

If hydrogen is looking for ions, wouldn't it readily attach to o2 making it neutral or water? so as long as your pumping air (mind you the temp micros of whats going on) into the water, the hydrogen would bond up? 

No because H+ and atmospheric O2 are both looking for electrons, not ions. For H+ to react with oxygen, the O2 would have to be split into two separate oxygen atoms and I think that's usually only done by biological processes which water is often a byproduct.

On 12/26/2022 at 1:35 PM, BettaFishCO said:

Also, would chlorine then try to stabilize at hydrogen chloride and or chlorine oxide? My chemistry is less than ideal.

Yep, that's right. Which one depends on the pH.

[Streetwise]

@modified lung, you reminded me to order new calibration fluid with a new pH probe. I plan to get the lab-grade double junction model.

[modified lung]

@Streetwise Nice. I bet a double junction will work good on an Apex.

[anewbie]

On 12/26/2022 at 6:13 PM, Streetwise said:

@modified lung, you reminded me to order new calibration fluid with a new pH probe. I plan to get the lab-grade double junction model.

I'm last here what is a 'double junction' ph probe ?

[Streetwise]

@anewbie, I was shopping on the big marine site and they had a single-junction at $33, a double-junction at $56, and a lab-grade double-junction probe at $90. Maybe the double-junction units are more waterproof, and lab-grade means better internal components. I just want it to have the longest lifespan.

[anewbie]

On 12/27/2022 at 9:08 AM, Streetwise said:

@anewbie, I was shopping on the big marine site and they had a single-junction at $33, a double-junction at $56, and a lab-grade double-junction probe at $90. Maybe the double-junction units are more waterproof, and lab-grade means better internal components. I just want it to have the longest lifespan.

I found a white paper on hanna website which includes a table of what substance should use what type; it is not clear to me that one type has better longevity over another type; rather they work better for different usage and have different level of accuracy. What this implies to me is that a $1400 probe might be more accurate when used with gases but it might not last longer than a $33 probe for an aquarium. I'm not claiming that is the case as the paper didn't go into that level of detail.

 

Further reading suggest a double junction probe will last longer than a single junction probe. 

Edited December 27, 2022 by anewbie