Chris's Fishes Fish Room Journal

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 10/23/2022 at 7:40 PM, Chris said:

The spots aren't uniform, they're different sizes, extremely raised, and look almost spherical

Are they sort of a yellowish color?

[Chris]

On 10/23/2022 at 2:07 PM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Are they sort of a yellowish color?

Nope, snow white.

[TheSwissAquarist]

Any ideas @Colu?

[Colu]

It could be Epistylis he's how you tell the difference between ich and Epistylis if it's Epistylis you want to treat with kanaplex in food feeding a small amount twice a day for 7 days as Epistylis feed's off the gram negative bacteria on your fish and spreads more quickly at higher temperatures and I would also leave the salt at 1 table for 2 gallons @Chris

[Chris]

On 10/24/2022 at 8:32 AM, Colu said:

It could be Epistylis he's how you tell the difference between ich and Epistylis if it's Epistylis you want to treat with kanaplex in food feeding a small amount twice a day for 7 days as Epistylis feed's off the gram negative bacteria on your fish and spreads more quickly at higher temperatures and I would also leave the salt at 1 table for 2 gallons @Chris

This actually looks more like what she has than ich - I wouldn't call the spots translucent, but they definitely vary in size and are a bit more patchy than ich. None on the eyes, though, but the area around her eyes was covered at one point.

As of this morning the sick female is down to 4 spots and the rest of the crew look completely healthy. Current salt dosage is about 25 tbsps for the entire tank, so I'd guess specific gravity is roughly 1.0025-1.003. 

I'll go ahead and dose the medicated food since I have the meds on hand. but out of curiosity - is salt an appropriate treatment for this?

[Colu]

 salt in combination with the antibiotic medications it more  effective salt  at higher level 10g a liter can be effective  Epistylis @Chris

[Chris]

On 10/24/2022 at 12:02 PM, Colu said:

 salt in combination with the antibiotic medications it more  effective salt  at higher level 10g a liter can be effective  Epistylis @Chris

So, from what I'm reading and learning, Epistylis itself is more likely an opportunistic secondary infection that's taking advantage of a weakened immune system on fish that have a primary infection, correct? The Epistilis do not feed on the fish, but on the bacteria on the fish, and because Epystilis itself is a protozoa, the antiobiotics don't treat the Epistylis directly, but rather they eliminate its' food source (the primary infection on the fish). Do I have all that right?

If all that is correct, I have to wonder what kind of primary infection these guys may have been dealing with... they've all shown some symptoms, at one point or another, but seem to be getting better. Maybe the stress of the LFS and being QT'd weakened them until a primary infection took hold, which turned into an Epistylis infection, but they were able to fight off the primary infection on their own once in a stable environment, and the weakest female is the one still showing symptoms?

Or, does Epistylis have a life cycle like ich, and this could just be a "cold" period before the infection gets "hot" again?

So many questions!

[Colu]

On 10/24/2022 at 5:50 PM, Chris said:

So, from what I'm reading and learning, Epistylis itself is more likely an opportunistic secondary infection that's taking advantage of a weakened immune system on fish that have a primary infection, correct? The Epistilis do not feed on the fish, but on the bacteria on the fish, and because Epystilis itself is a protozoa, the antiobiotics don't treat the Epistylis directly, but rather they eliminate its' food source (the primary infection on the fish). Do I have all that right?

If all that is correct, I have to wonder what kind of primary infection these guys may have been dealing with... they've all shown some symptoms, at one point or another, but seem to be getting better. Maybe the stress of the LFS and being QT'd weakened them until a primary infection took hold, which turned into an Epistylis infection, but they were able to fight off the primary infection on their own once in a stable environment, and the weakest female is the one still showing symptoms?

Or, does Epistylis have a life cycle like ich, and this could just be a "cold" period before the infection gets "hot" again?

So many questions!

Yes so the antibiotic's essential starve the Epistylis of it's food source the causes can be lack of water circulation and  poor aeration causing higher bacterial concentration in the substrate other causes can be bacterial infection such as columnaris hemorrhagic septicemia Epistylis often occurs in fish with fin rot the bacteria infecting the fins feed's the Epistylis when Epistylis gets a foothold on your fish then Epistylis secrets an enzyme at it's base that attacks the slime coat this attack allows bacteria to get into the fish's body causing secondary bacteria infections that feed's the Epistylis 

[Chris]

So I got home yesterday and the female guppy only had one spot left, on her tail. This morning, she's completely clean - no spots, and so are the rest of the crew. I'm leaning towards just leaving the salt in there for the rest of the week and not medicating, since they appear to be fine. I'll keep a close eye though, and will medicate if I see anything out of the ordinary. 

I spent a little time looking at my musk turtle tank this morning. Really enjoying having fish and plants in with this guy. So far, no chomping on the plants - he's tried to get ahold of the fish a few times but they're so much faster than him I don't think he'll have much luck. 

After I checked out the guppies, I looked into the puffer tank. Really happy to see the Caulerpa Racemosa and Palys doing well:

On the Caulerpa, all the lighter green is new growth. I've only had it for a week!

And finally, the urchin down as up on the glass today. He's done a great job of cleaning up the rock - I think I'll start feeding him seaweed a few times a week to make sure he doesn't get too hungry. He's still carrying thag dang snail shell, too!

[Chris]

Alrighty, so I've been feeding the Xtreme Krill Flakes for about two weeks now, and I gotta say... 

I think I like them! 

Its not a magical food or anything. I don't think such a thing exists in a dry, flake/pellet form. But, the fact that my fish go after these flakes like they go after frozen foods is definitely encouraging and makes me feel as if they must be tasty. Long-term health benefits are yet to be seen, but I think it's worth ordering some if anyone has been holding out! 

Also, I took a video of my GSP eating a pellet for giggles. I don't feed him these often, but he doesn't seem to complain when I do! 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by Chris

[Chris]

Alrighty y'all, today is testing day! I'm testing all of my tanks and doing any required maintenance. I don't usually test super often, but with so many new tanks around, it can't be a bad idea.

First up, the 33 gallon Koi Swordtail tank. This tank tested within range on all parameters, but what surprised me was the 0 PPM nitrate reading. I feed pretty heavily and don't have a ton of plants, and I dose with Easy Green once a week. I dosed an extra pump of Easy Green and am calling this tank good for the week. This tank is also now home to a random Otocinclus I found in the 20 gallon (hiding in the algae, I guess? I haven't bought Otos in three years!) and a few pond snails. I've noticed most of the plants doing well except for the Bacopa - I'm wondering if that's due to the low light or the low nutrients, or a combo of both.

Notice the Bacopa browning at the bottom? Any thoughts?

The swords like the Oto's algae wafer, too:

Next is the 37 gallon guppy tank - the tank still has salt in it, but tests normally otherwise. Nitrates are between 10-20, so this tank will get a normal 5-10 gallon water change and not much else for now.

Here's the 20 long with the Emperor Tetras and the Krib. It tested normally with essentially 0 nitrates - I assume it's all tied up in the algae. I removed about a third of the total algae mass in the tank. Here it is before:

And after:

I've got a little more to do, but I think that's enough for one post, anyway!

[Patrick_G]

On 10/30/2022 at 11:38 AM, Chris said:

This tank tested within range on all parameters, but what surprised me was the 0 PPM nitrate reading.

If I get a totally unexpected reading I’ll double check with another test. 

[Chris]

On 10/31/2022 at 3:57 PM, Patrick_G said:

If I get a totally unexpected reading I’ll double check with another test. 

I usually do as well, but got caught up with other things and kinda just went with it, honestly. I should run another test on the tank, though - just to be sure.

[Patrick_G]

On 11/1/2022 at 6:52 AM, Chris said:

I usually do as well, but got caught up with other things and kinda just went with it, honestly. I should run another test on the tank, though - just to be sure.

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a quick, cheap,  accurate electronic test? 

[Chris]

On 11/1/2022 at 10:41 AM, Patrick_G said:

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a quick, cheap,  accurate electronic test? 

It really, really would be.

I came within an inch of buying some of the Hannah checkers when I was really into reef tanks - they're so expensive, and the reviews really aren't all that good, either. Not to mention the reagent cost per test is insanely high.

I'm still using an API kit - I've really liked the Salifert kits in the past, but I'm thinking of switching to mainly using strips soon.

[Patrick_G]

There's this unit from API but it's not cheap. 

 

 

[Chris]

On 11/1/2022 at 11:15 AM, Patrick_G said:

There's this unit from API but it's not cheap. 

 

 

Looks interesting!

My biggest issue becomes that I only ever really use test kits frequently when I have new tanks. Once my tanks are established, I only test every month or two at most, if that. An electronic test would certainly take some of the work out of the process, if done correctly.

I'm really wanting to get into wild bettas and gourami, so maybe at some point something like this will make sense for me.

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 11/1/2022 at 3:41 PM, Patrick_G said:

Wouldn't it be nice if there was a quick, cheap,  accurate electronic test? 

Idea for @Cory! I recently borrowed an old conductivity meter form my school science room (benefits of high-school!!) which was quite useful; is that the same thing...?

[eatyourpeas]

Nice to catch up with your journal, @Chris! That puffer is too much fun! Now my husband wants a turtle! 🙃

[Chris]

On 11/1/2022 at 12:28 PM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Idea for @Cory! I recently borrowed an old conductivity meter form my school science room (benefits of high-school!!) which was quite useful; is that the same thing...?

I think the main issue is that conductivity meters don't require any sort of chemical or reagent to function - they just measure electrical conductivity. Most tests we'd use as hobbyists would require chemicals and other things to function, even when the test is performed electronically. I think. I guess I don't really know! Maybe someone smarter than me can figure it out and chime in.

On 11/1/2022 at 1:07 PM, eatyourpeas said:

Nice to catch up with your journal, @Chris! That puffer is too much fun! Now my husband wants a turtle! 🙃

I do love the puffer! They're some of my favorite fish, for sure. I feel kind of silly about having one 4" fish in a 55 gallon tank, but he makes it worth it with all his antics! Musk turtles are a lot of fun, too. Everytime I check your Puget Sound thread it makes me want to setup a coldwater tank - if I could find a good resource for ordering livestock, I'd bite the bullet!

[eatyourpeas]

On 11/1/2022 at 12:00 PM, Chris said:

Everytime I check your Puget Sound thread it makes me want to setup a coldwater tank - if I could find a good resource for ordering livestock, I'd bite the bullet!

Thanks! There was someone on another forum who started a temperate SW tank, but found it very difficult to source livestock for it. He was in California if I remember correctly. I think he took the tank down due to frustration. ☹️

[Chris]

On 11/4/2022 at 1:21 PM, eatyourpeas said:

Thanks! There was someone on another forum who started a temperate SW tank, but found it very difficult to source livestock for it. He was in California if I remember correctly. I think he took the tank down due to frustration. ☹️

I've not been keeping up with updating this very well - my bad! Been spending a bit more time with my tanks and a bit less documenting and sharing, and I think the tanks are better off for it, mostly. Maybe a bit uglier (I'm the only one who's been looking!) but healthy, nonetheless.

The Koi swordtails and Ginga Sulphereous guppies I got from @PineSong have done very well. I ended up losing two swordtails, and it was very much my fault. The top of the tank is above my head, and I didn't realize I left the strip at the back of the tank off, and they jumped through the gap between the glass lid and the rim. I fixed that, and no more losses. So far, I only have one male - the other 7 haven't developed gonopodiums or swords, however only about 4 or 5 of them have the "rounded" look, so I'm wondering if a couple aren't just underdeveloped males. I haven't lost any of the guppies, and the males have all matured and colored up amazingly well. The females have grown a bit smaller than I expected (they're just now catching up to the males in size), but they're on a tank in the floor, so temps have hovered in the low 60's over the past month or so since winter has hit. That may have something to do with it. I just added a group of 5 Sunkist Neos in with them, and so far everyone is doing well. I hope to get the tank into a better viewing location eventually.

 

The assorted fancies in the 37 have all done well - everyone recovered from the bout of Epistylis and I haven't seen any signs of disease since. I just recently got salt levels down in the tank, so I added in some Crypts and Cabomba this past weekend - and I'm just now seeing my first few fry in this tank! There's been plenty born in here, but they haven't had anywhere to hide. This little guy seems to be the first survivor, so far! He's right in the center of the Anubias.

The tank with the Krib and tetras is doing well, too. I've been manually removing algae every few days and we're down to just the tightly-attached stuff. It's yellowing and not growing anymore, so I think I just need to get some Amanos in here to clean up. The colors on all of these fish are very, very nice in person!

Edited December 20, 2022 by Chris

[PineSong]

Oh, shucks on the leaping swordtails--I lost two of my first batch the same way and the gap between tank and lid was really quite small. I am sorry that happened. Their tank looks great.

If you end up short on males let me know, I am down to my last 8 or so unsexed juveniles so I am probably going to put my #1 male back in with a female here pretty soon.

Glad to hear you beat that epistylis and are having fun with your tanks.

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 12/20/2022 at 4:39 AM, PineSong said:

Oh, shucks on the leaping swordtails

Also had that problem when doing a water change - juveniles got sucked into the bucket, went away to fetch a net; 3 or so had jumped out.

[Chris]

On 12/19/2022 at 10:39 PM, PineSong said:

Oh, shucks on the leaping swordtails--I lost two of my first batch the same way and the gap between tank and lid was really quite small. I am sorry that happened. Their tank looks great.

If you end up short on males let me know, I am down to my last 8 or so unsexed juveniles so I am probably going to put my #1 male back in with a female here pretty soon.

Glad to hear you beat that epistylis and are having fun with your tanks.

Thanks for the sympathy - it's something that's happened to me before with other fish, so I knew better. But live and learn, right?

I think I'll be alright with just the one male - but I'll keep that in mind if something happens.