EASY live food cultures

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 8/24/2022 at 8:04 PM, Guppysnail said:

Scarlet badis. I just did the reveal in my journal. I’ve also wanted Ellasoma gilberti or okefenokee for a few years and 1soooo hard to find and 2 the live food thing kept me from hunting them down. So next goal. 😁

Wow! They colored up very nicely since they were added from the specimen container! Beautiful!

I second that, @TeeJay. Baby brine shrimp are very simple! I just used salt, an airstone, eggs, and a mason jar. Easy peasy!

[TeeJay]

On 8/24/2022 at 9:34 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Wow! They colored up very nicely since they were added from the specimen container! Beautiful!

I second that, @TeeJay. Baby brine shrimp are very simple! I just used salt, an airstone, eggs, and a mason jar. Easy peasy!

I guess I'm more thinking of something I can have culturing over longer periods of time that I can pull from every other day or 2. 

[Guppysnail]

On 8/24/2022 at 9:46 PM, TeeJay said:

I guess I'm more thinking of something I can have culturing over longer periods of time that I can pull from every other day or 2. 

Grindal worm colonies last indefinitely with minimal maintenance. 

[TeeJay]

On 8/24/2022 at 10:11 PM, Guppysnail said:

Grindal worm colonies last indefinitely with minimal maintenance. 

Yes i know I'm going def with vinegar eels and either gridal and or microworrms. 

[Atitagain]

I feel like this is sending me down another rabbit hole 🕳 already have plans to make room for cultivating containers. @Guppysnail @modified lung this is some great info. Thank you so much for breaking everything down this way.

[Guppysnail]

WHITE WORMS 

So I watched videos by The Carbon Dragon and others on white worms. No idea I actually ordered on eBay from The Carbon Dragon so pretty cool. 
He did an entire series on them. I will link one video here. 
For harvesting I’m using 2 methods I ran across. Using the coconut coir as medium it does not stick to plastic for the grindal worm harvest so no rinsing needed. I also used the plastic craft grid sheet. 

HAPOY ADVENTURES…LEARN SOMETHING NEW. 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

From what I can tell, those look like containers of cookies & cream ice cream!

[Guppysnail]

Has anyone tried triops or tried these eggs. I was looking at the site where @modified lung got eggs and seen these. They would be great as I’m looking for things I do not need green water to culture and that I can see. If I can’t see them they are a touch smaller than the adult Scarlet badis and Least killifish need. 
 

I am thinking of trying my hand at some of modified lungs cultures using the liquid chlorella in the picture. Will that work?

[TeeJay]

On 8/26/2022 at 7:45 AM, Guppysnail said:

Has anyone tried triops or tried these eggs. I was looking at the site where @modified lung got eggs and seen these. They would be great as I’m looking for things I do not need green water to culture and that I can see. If I can’t see them they are a touch smaller than the adult Scarlet badis and Least killifish need. 
 

I am thinking of trying my hand at some of modified lungs cultures using the liquid chlorella in the picture. Will that work?

I'm not quite sure but they look like breakfast cereal 🤣 plenty of protein and fiber in every bowl!

[modified lung]

On 8/26/2022 at 4:45 AM, Guppysnail said:

I am thinking of trying my hand at some of modified lungs cultures using the liquid chlorella in the picture. Will that work?

I don't know. Unless I missed something, on their website that product looks like it's meant for feeding straight to your animals which would work but be expensive over time.

If you're looking to start a culture from it, the website says it survives 3 months in refrigeration. Assuming it's alive when you receive it, that should work.

But if it's meant for feed, there's no guarantee it won't be contaminated with something that might make it harder to grow. In which case you might as well just start one from scratch at home. But to isolate a pure culture from scratch you'll need a microscope and some patience.

Maybe I'm being overly skeptical about it. I tend to do that. If you try using that Chlorella product, definitely let me know how it goes. Or if you want to be extra safe, living Chlorella meant for growing pure cultures can be bought from Carolina Biological or Algae Research Supply.

[modified lung]

Just one today.

SCUDS / FRESHWATER AMPHIPODS

My main scud culture is a 55 gallon barrel in the backyard. It was originally supposed to be ramshorn snail farm to sucker ...I mean sell to puffer owners. I also threw in some wild collected hornwort and elodea.

One week a bunch of leaves and peaches fell into it from the tree and rotted. I assumed everything in there had been killed. But I didn't installed a drain valve so I never drained it out for cleaning.

Maybe 6 months later I discovered it had become a source of never ending scuds. It's been going for 4 years now. Sometimes I pull out hundreds of scuds a week but it's never showed signs of running out. You see, I make most of my discoveries through laziness and incompetence. 

I don't feed the barrel anything. I only top off the evaporation. To harvest I just scoop up hornwort with a 10" wide net. Each net collects 20-40 scuds at a time. I make sure the netting has large enough holes to let the youngest scuds through.

The screen is to prevent more peaches from falling in and to keep out damsel fly larvae. I'm not sure what the larvae eat but I worry they can eat scuds. 

Where I live the biggest challenge for keeping anything outside is the summer heat. Because there's no aeration, the barrel has a +10°F vertical temperature gradient from top to bottom. So during a heatwave, the scuds can go deeper to keep away from too hot of an environment.

Another good way to grow scuds is with a large ACO coarse sponge filter. Hundreds of scuds can grow inside the filter even when fish are in the tank. As an added bonus they also keep the filter clean. To harvest just pull out the filter, place it in a bowl, and scuds will fall right out. Or just give it a light shake while still in the tank and a good amount will swim out. But this will only work if your sponge can collect enough detritus for them to feed on.

A third method I've used is feeding them land moss in a 5 gallon tank. The land moss survives for a short time underwater which means fewer water changes are needed compared to feeding vegetables. And they really seem to like it.

[Guppysnail]

My little gold bladder snail/ detritus worm/seed shrimp jug is doing well. Critters and plants are thriving. 

[Guppysnail]

I finally got my scud colony. I plucked any algae I could find in my tanks, a handful of guppy grass and some frogbit. @Torrey said they don’t need an airstone.  That lasted one day. It completely weirds me out to have critters without moving water. 🤷‍♀️  It lives on my windowsill with the seed shrimp colony.  

[Schuyler]

On 8/26/2022 at 4:45 AM, Guppysnail said:

Has anyone tried triops or tried these eggs. I was looking at the site where @modified lung got eggs and seen these. They would be great as I’m looking for things I do not need green water to culture and that I can see. If I can’t see them they are a touch smaller than the adult Scarlet badis and Least killifish need. 
 

I am thinking of trying my hand at some of modified lungs cultures using the liquid chlorella in the picture. Will that work?

I grew triops as a kid they are pretty cool on their own. I would be wary of putting them in a tank they are omnivores. They use them in rice patties as pest control and they eat weeds. I would be worried that they may eat my plants or fry.

https://youtu.be/T2xnXaX7r3g

Edited December 12, 2022 by Schuyler

[TheSwissAquarist]

Have you tried Paracemium @Guppysnail? 
They’re relatively smellless and are pretty useful for small fish & their fry. (I’ve got some coming in for my tetra breeding projects)

[Guppysnail]

On 10/22/2023 at 2:01 PM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Have you tried Paracemium @Guppysnail? 
They’re relatively smellless and are pretty useful for small fish & their fry. (I’ve got some coming in for my tetra breeding projects)

No I’ve not done paramecium. I’m getting ready to brave moina and daphnia magna. Hubby is skeptical but willing to allow me to try on the condition “if it stinks like that stuff (epic fail infusoria attempt) you did before I’m dumping it. 🤣

[beastie]

Why i don't even know if the cultures work and the ammonia reading on them is scary, they don't look so bad, some floating particles are visible, they dont need much work and don't smell unless bad. So i will squirt some in the tank once in a while and hope for the best. And based on the clown killifish fry and the pseudomugil fry they found something to eat 🙂

 

[Guppysnail]

Here we go. I’m braving daphnia magna. 
No one bothered to tell me they are so adorable. Now I feel bad feeding them to fish. But ….

Right now I’m feeding chlorella powder and active yeast. The chlorella powder keeps sinking so I’m going to also try some spirulina powder. My live chlorella vulgaris starter should be here by the beginning on next week. I figure that’s safer so less chance I’ll crash them. 
 

They are in a 10 gallon not yet full with duckweed and hornwort. I put in a Spixii snail. I need to dig through tanks and find a few more. Tomorrow I’ll bet some neocaridina and let them drop to room temp to put in. 
 

8 days for juveniles to have babies so hopefully in 8 days I have enough to feed again. Can I control my urge to watch the fish dance about catching them until then….🤣
 

Wish me luck. 

HAPPY ADVENTURES…TRY SOMETHING NEW 

[Guppysnail]

So I have lots and lots of babies today. I may need to harvest some tomorrow.  It was too cold for my snail. He stayed huddled in the same spot.  I added about 100 seed shrimp to help keep the debris cleaned up. 
I think I’m under feeding but until I get the hang of not poisoning the tank I think small feedings often may be a safer bet?  Not sure  suggestions from experience always welcome  

 

[TheSwissAquarist]

@Lowells Fish Lab does a mix of yeast and water and just pours it in and leaves it to sit. 

[Guppysnail]

On 10/27/2023 at 2:11 AM, TheSwissAquarist said:

@Lowells Fish Lab does a mix of yeast and water and just pours it in and leaves it to sit. 

That is what I’m doing now along with a touch of chlorella powder. The old saying we are what we eat is very true. The nutritional content of live chlorella vulgaris is much higher. So I want these adorable little critters to be gutloaded as much as possible. 

[TOtrees]

Just catching this thread. I have a great daphnia culture going, so I feel have something to offer here. My method is based on Aquarimax Pets, you can find a few daphnia videos on his youtube. 

I have a 20 gallon culture that really thrives, and a 5 gallon bucket as backup. Like all water in glass box setups, more volume is more stable. So keeping a 20 gallon is way easier than keeping a small window culture, I feel. I think a 10 gallon tank would be a good sweet spot, if you don't need a lot of daphnia. Also this is one of the places I'd absolutely go with vertical over horizontal, eg a hex or column tank would be ideal.

I feed both my cultures daily, but missing a day here and there isn't an issue. Food is around 3:1:1 spirulina powder, rice flour and chick pea flour. I feed about 1/2 tsp of this mixture stirred in water (tank water or other aged/chlorine free water - I've been told to stay away from dechlorinators with daphnia), just pour it in. It stays suspended quite well. Both my cultures have a TON of ramshorn snails, which I remove periodically. No plants in either culture. I don't have enough light to make green water, and any that did occur would be snatched up immediately by my high daphnia populations, but I've heard that live plants take the nutrients that green water algae could otherwise use. 

I feed them to any fish I'm trying to put size on (along with regular high protein fish foods), and also to my dart frog tadpoles. I harvest in one of 2 ways. A) soft brine shrimp net, start at the bottom make 3 passes is z shape, first to left, up and back right, and up again and back left then lift. Otherwise I get too much snail poop. Invert the net into a plastic deli cup with water, and feed from that. B) The other method (that yields a ton more daphnia) is via water change. I remove 5 gal from the 20 gal culture using a 3/4" diameter hose, focusing on the parts of the tank with the most daphnia. Then I refill the culture tank from any other running tank, and fill the other tank as I would following water change. Then I pour the 5 gal bucket filled with daphnia through a reusable coffee filter, then use a baster to remove the ~heaping tbsp of daphnia in the filter into a deli cup with water where it's easier to work from. Can pour this straight into tanks, or pass through a bbs filter to serve them without water (if that makes sense).  

I sometimes separate smaller from larger daphnia if I want to feed smaller fry or my tads. Just add a step passing the daphnia from one deli cup into another through a fish net with appropriate sized mesh.  

Lights aren't on in fish room yet, i'll add a picture later.

[Guppysnail]

@TOtrees this is fabulous information. Thank you. 
With no plants and no dechlorinators how do you control ammonia?  
 

I just watched the video. I think I made a fatal mistake. I was told to start the culture using old tank water. I do have hydra that are mostly dormant but do become active during high fry times.  

[TOtrees]

On 10/27/2023 at 9:53 AM, Guppysnail said:

With no plants and no dechlorinators how do you control ammonia?  

Not sure how to answer this. A) I mostly don't worry about or control ammonia in these cultures, B) I think daphnia are pretty resilient to ammonia (think shrinking ponds in summer, with almost more daphnia than water at times), C) it might be that @Cory's often-proposed idea that there can be a lot of bb on glass/substrate surfaces might have more truth than many would think, and D) I do occasional water changes (more below). 

My dapnia tank has a thin layer of crushed coral in an otherwise bare bottom setup. This presumably holds a decent amount of bb. In reality, I'm sure the hundreds of small snails foul the water way more than the daphnia, which, while its something to consider, doesn't mean it doesn't work. I tested ammonia just now to see, and it's close to 0.5ppm. Considering no filter, and considering how tolerant/robust dapnhia are, i'm not worried.

I change about 5 gals every 2-3 weeks (more to cull the daphnia numbers than to actually change water), and I vac up the detritus maybe every 2-4 months. 

Here's a pic of my setup (20H tank, with cheapo amazon underwater light). Yes it really is that murky. Almost all the time. 

Here's the wee buggers, along with snails, crushed coral and mulm/detritus on the bottom. 

Edited October 27, 2023 by TOtrees

[Guppysnail]

@TOtrees what is your ph?  Mine is 8-8.2. I read they like hard high ph so I think I’m good there. 
Do you leave your light on 24/7? 
I used an empty tank I had unused so hopefully the old tank water brought over some BB.  
I can’t thank you enough for taking all this time to answer my questions.