Hillstream loach care

[Hannah Parker]

Hi everyone,

I'm hoping someone can provide some insight into the care of hillstream loaches 🙂 

I've of course read up a ton on them on the internet, so I know their parameters and stuff like that, but the main question I have is how to feed them and the maturity level of the tank they require. I've read conflicting information online about the amount of algae/biofilm they need. The tank in question is a 60 gallon goldfish tank with 3 fancy goldfish of varying sizes, 8 white cloud minnows, 6 zebra danios and 6 nerite snails. I feed this tank veggie lover's garlic flakes from my LFS regurlary, with algae wafers, Repashy Super Green, and frozen tubifex worms mixed in there. It has been running for 2 months now, and is finally starting to mature with the algae and biofilm production.

That's why I'm thinking about adding some hillstream loaches, but I have been very nervous because they are a bit pricey and some sources online say that feeding-wise they can be as delicate as otocinculus. Does anyone have any advice for me about maybe getting some? Thanks in advance 🙂 

[AndEEss]

I think the biggest problem you're going to have with them is water flow rates/oxygenation. As their name implies they live in streams with high flow rates. 

I don't know that the environment that fancy goldfish would thrive in would be appropriate for hillstream loaches and vice versa. 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Hi Hannah, I have 1 in my Flex9. They do great! Keeps my plants and glass mostly clean and I supplement their food with Repashy gel foods and Hikari Algae wafers. Despite popular belief high flow is not necessary to keep them IME but aggitation is likely appreciated- my flex has fairly high pump output anyway (but not so much to push the long tail fins of the Guppies in there too much but enough they like to play on that side of the tank sometimes). I know I've seen an ACO video where Cory mentioned all the tank environments he's kept his in- including Goldfish tanks and even warmer tropical tanks- this encouraged me to get one. I've also seen another Youtuber breed them without flow (just sponge filter) in smaller tank with 20+ per tank with no issues. 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/15/2022 at 6:25 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I've of course read up a ton on them on the internet, so I know their parameters and stuff like that, but the main question I have is how to feed them and the maturity level of the tank they require. I've read conflicting information online about the amount of algae/biofilm they need.

If you haven't, please do yourself a favor and go check out Rachel O'Leary and her hillstream videos. A wealth of information on that fish in particular.

On 7/15/2022 at 7:38 AM, AndEEss said:

I think the biggest problem you're going to have with them is water flow rates/oxygenation. As their name implies they live in streams with high flow rates. 

I don't know that the environment that fancy goldfish would thrive in would be appropriate for hillstream loaches and vice versa. 

Absolutely.  Hillstream loaches, Borneo loaches will literally attach themselves to a surface and they move around in a very specific way. They have very unique body features which require certain things. If you had a normal tank with a decent HoB, two airstones, it's probably plenty of oxygenation for them. Second step for that is just having the right temp and environment.

Goldfish on the other hand also have very specific body features. They require a certain type of tank as well. As long as the tank is "big enough" and you can give the goldfish a place to rest and escape a higher flow part of the tank, that might be one way to handle the setup.

On 7/15/2022 at 6:25 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I feed this tank veggie lover's garlic flakes from my LFS regurlary, with algae wafers, Repashy Super Green, and frozen tubifex worms mixed in there.

Switch out or add some soilent green and you're probably golden. They like flat surfaces to graze on and sort of act like little cows so to speak. They "clean the field" so having slate, ceramics, rocks, or something with a surface for them to eat on is what they like. Glass is good, but rougher surfaces might give them a bit more of a place to graze on. You can target feed them with frozen foods.  They will hover over it, lift up their heads, and then suck in the food. Really cool to see. With repashy also you can take any of the items and paint on surfaces for them. I've seen others use sticks and things to make it easier to drop in and prepare foods.

On 7/15/2022 at 6:25 AM, Hannah Parker said:

but I have been very nervous because they are a bit pricey and some sources online say that feeding-wise they can be as delicate as otocinculus. Does anyone have any advice for me about maybe getting some?

They definitely can be and I try to keep mine very similarly to otos. Otos get wood and plants, the loaches like places to explore and graze on that are stone or ceramic.

On 7/15/2022 at 8:12 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Despite popular belief high flow is not necessary to keep them IME but aggitation is likely appreciated-

Agreed. Having water movement is good. Having the right temp and oxygenation is what makes them do well.  If you've ever had otos you always pay attention to their stomachs and their gills for signs of stress. For these fish it's crazy because you can see their heart and that's what I would always focus on. Definitely an amazing, beautiful fish.

Edited July 15, 2022 by nabokovfan87

[Wrencher_Scott]

On 7/15/2022 at 6:25 AM, Hannah Parker said:

Hi everyone,

I'm hoping someone can provide some insight into the care of hillstream loaches 🙂 

I've of course read up a ton on them on the internet, so I know their parameters and stuff like that, but the main question I have is how to feed them and the maturity level of the tank they require. I've read conflicting information online about the amount of algae/biofilm they need. The tank in question is a 60 gallon goldfish tank with 3 fancy goldfish of varying sizes, 8 white cloud minnows, 6 zebra danios and 6 nerite snails. I feed this tank veggie lover's garlic flakes from my LFS regurlary, with algae wafers, Repashy Super Green, and frozen tubifex worms mixed in there. It has been running for 2 months now, and is finally starting to mature with the algae and biofilm production.

That's why I'm thinking about adding some hillstream loaches, but I have been very nervous because they are a bit pricey and some sources online say that feeding-wise they can be as delicate as otocinculus. Does anyone have any advice for me about maybe getting some? Thanks in advance 🙂 

I have one I got as a super tiny little guy at Petco back in February. He is definitely growing but not super fast like the Bristlenose Pleco I got close to the same time. 

The reason I got it was I wanted an algae eater that is interesting looking and doesn't grow too big. And this one fit the bill.

It eats brown algae like crazy and will go for anything that makes it to the bottom (in my case mostly frozen blood worms and Tetra pro flake crisp).

As for water parameters don't worry as long as you keep it clean and aeriated.  Every fish deserves at least that.  As for water movement just because (not aeration) it doesn't matter. I can tell you this fish doesn't care if the water is moving, it just likes to clean everything. And by that I mean eat of course. 🙂  

Be sure to get one big enough that it won't fit in anyone's mouth. I was beginning to wonder about mine when my larger Ram and Discus where checking it out very closely at first, lol. Now it's big enough they don't give it a second thought. 

Edited July 15, 2022 by Wrencher_Scott

[Hannah Parker]

On 7/15/2022 at 10:38 AM, AndEEss said:

I think the biggest problem you're going to have with them is water flow rates/oxygenation. As their name implies they live in streams with high flow rates. 

I think so too. High oxygenation is important for goldfish too! It's just the high flow/current that can be a problem for them since they are fancy. I have an AquaClear Powerhead set up that creates good waves, but it's pointed towards the front of the tank and not long-ways so it's only on a small portion. I think this would be sufficient enough for the loaches to hang out in when they want that current.

On 7/15/2022 at 11:12 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Hi Hannah, I have 1 in my Flex9. They do great! Keeps my plants and glass mostly clean and I supplement their food with Repashy gel foods and Hikari Algae wafers. Despite popular belief high flow is not necessary to keep them IME but aggitation is likely appreciated- my flex has fairly high pump output anyway (but not so much to push the long tail fins of the Guppies in there too much but enough they like to play on that side of the tank sometimes). I know I've seen an ACO video where Cory mentioned all the tank environments he's kept his in- including Goldfish tanks and even warmer tropical tanks- this encouraged me to get one. I've also seen another Youtuber breed them without flow (just sponge filter) in smaller tank with 20+ per tank with no issues. 

Thank you! This makes me hope they can thrive in my tank 🙂 

On 7/15/2022 at 11:57 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

If you haven't, please do yourself a favor and go check out Rachel O'Leary and her hillstream videos. A wealth of information on that fish in particular.

Absolutely.  Hillstream loaches, Borneo loaches will literally attach themselves to a surface and they move around in a very specific way. They have very unique body features which require certain things. If you had a normal tank with a decent HoB, two airstones, it's probably plenty of oxygenation for them. Second step for that is just having the right temp and environment.

Goldfish on the other hand also have very specific body features. They require a certain type of tank as well. As long as the tank is "big enough" and you can give the goldfish a place to rest and escape a higher flow part of the tank, that might be one way to handle the setup.

Switch out or add some soilent green and you're probably golden. They like flat surfaces to graze on and sort of act like little cows so to speak. They "clean the field" so having slate, ceramics, rocks, or something with a surface for them to eat on is what they like. Glass is good, but rougher surfaces might give them a bit more of a place to graze on. You can target feed them with frozen foods.  They will hover over it, lift up their heads, and then suck in the food. Really cool to see. With repashy also you can take any of the items and paint on surfaces for them. I've seen others use sticks and things to make it easier to drop in and prepare foods.

They definitely can be and I try to keep mine very similarly to otos. Otos get wood and plants, the loaches like places to explore and graze on that are stone or ceramic.

Agreed. Having water movement is good. Having the right temp and oxygenation is what makes them do well.  If you've ever had otos you always pay attention to their stomachs and their gills for signs of stress. For these fish it's crazy because you can see their heart and that's what I would always focus on. Definitely an amazing, beautiful fish.

Thank you so much for all the information! I will definitely be checking Rachel out on YouTube. I have an airstone, 2 sponge filters and an AquaClear powerhead so I think the oxygenation would be sufficient for them. And I think I was misremembering, Soilent Green sounds right and I think that's what I have, not Super Green. I have a lot of driftwood in this tank, do you think they would like grazing on that?? 

On 7/15/2022 at 1:09 PM, Wrencher_Scott said:

I have one I got as a super tiny little guy at Petco back in February. He is definitely growing but not super fast like the Bristlenose Pleco I got close to the same time. 

The reason I got it was I wanted an algae eater that is interesting looking and doesn't grow too big. And this one fit the bill.

It eats brown algae like crazy and will go for anything that makes it to the bottom (in my case mostly frozen blood worms and Tetra pro flake crisp).

As for water parameters don't worry as long as you keep it clean and aeriated.  Every fish deserves at least that.  As for water movement just because (not aeration) it doesn't matter. I can tell you this fish doesn't care if the water is moving, it just likes to clean everything. And by that I mean eat of course. 🙂  

Be sure to get one big enough that it won't fit in anyone's mouth. I was beginning to wonder about mine when my larger Ram and Discus where checking it out very closely at first, lol. Now it's big enough they don't give it a second thought. 

Thank you!! It makes me feel better that they are busy eaters, and perhaps not as finicky as otos. I try and keep this tank very clean and oxygenated, with a powerhead and 50% weekly water changes because the goldfish are so dirty, so I think they could really thrive in it. 

[Wrencher_Scott]

On 7/15/2022 at 10:13 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I think so too. High oxygenation is important for goldfish too! It's just the high flow/current that can be a problem for them since they are fancy. I have an AquaClear Powerhead set up that creates good waves, but it's pointed towards the front of the tank and not long-ways so it's only on a small portion. I think this would be sufficient enough for the loaches to hang out in when they want that current.

 

My canister's out put is the same way, up high and pointed a little to the side but mostly forward because of the Discus (like your Fancy's they don't do well in fast water). My tank is very tall (like 30 inches) and there is only slow flow on the bottom and the other side of the tank. I can tell you my Hillsteam NEVER hangs out in the fast water, it hangs out mostly on the bottom and sometimes sides looking for algae. There is no doubt it could care less about fast water. 

Go get them, you will love it I'm sure.

[Hannah Parker]

On 7/15/2022 at 1:25 PM, Wrencher_Scott said:

My canister's out put is the same way, up high and pointed a little to the side but mostly forward because of the Discus (like your Fancy's they don't do well in fast water). My tank is very tall (like 30 inches) and there is only slow flow on the bottom and the other side of the tank. I can tell you my Hillsteam NEVER hangs out in the fast water, it hangs out mostly on the bottom and sometimes sides looking for algae. There is no doubt it could care less about fast water. 

Go get them, you will love it I'm sure.

That's fantastic to hear! My tank is super tall too, it's got the same footprint as a standard 55 but with an extra five gallons and extra inches upward. I already use the powerhead to create more oxygen, so that small section of current is already there in case they want it 🙂 I've been calling around all day, and finally found 1 LFS with them in stock! I'm so excited, going straight after work. I'll probably just start with a trio and see how they do, and maybe have up to 6 someday. 

[Jayci]

Hi! I've had my 3 Hillstream Loaches (bought from the Co-Op) for about a year and a half now, so I'd like to give some insight. For reference, I have a 20 G long moderately planted tank with a nano powerhead and sponge filter.

All 3 of mine seem finicky eaters, but they are VERY hardy. I have given them Repashy Soilent Green and Hikari Mini Algae Wafers. They never swim immediately towards them, they just kind of stumble upon it, eat it a bit, and then swim off like 6 seconds later. Yet here they are, all 3 of them healthy despite never munching on my given food for an extended time. I must have quite a bit of naturally sustaining bio-film. I still get algae, green hair and brown, so mine don't eat them too much, if at all.

Other parameters: I don't have many flat rocks, and I wouldn't say my tank has fast water flow. The powerhead just keeps the water circulating and that's about it. My fish have never seemed to show any illness. I think you will be fine. Now below is a short story on how amazing these fun little guys are!

HARDINESS: Case in point, I was deployed for 9 months and had an auto-feeder that gave Hikari wafers and pellets (for my betta and 23 Emerald eye rasboras). I had a family member visit the house every 2 weeks to re-fill the feeders, give a block of frozen baby brine and repashy, and top off water. That was it. No water changes, no cleaning off algae, no fertilization. I knew what I was doing, and I was confident my low tech tank could withstand it. I was however expecting the 3 Hillstream loaches to not make it.

I return, and the 'ONLY' fish I lost were 7 of the rasboras. All 3 of my Hillstream loaches were alive and healthy! (The tank was overgrown with algae, and only a few crypts and Valisneria runners survived). They are quite wonderful fish, you will enjoy them! Cheers.

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/15/2022 at 10:13 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I have a lot of driftwood in this tank, do you think they would like grazing on that?? 

It really depends.  If it's got a lot of knobs or it's something like spiderwood they might not fit.  Something with bigger flat sides like mopani, malaysian driftwood they do alright with!

This video has a bit of their behavior on the substrate, rocks, and wood.
 

 

There are the type I had.  A variety of borneo loach.

[Cinnebuns]

On 7/15/2022 at 8:25 AM, Hannah Parker said:

Hi everyone,

I'm hoping someone can provide some insight into the care of hillstream loaches 🙂 

I've of course read up a ton on them on the internet, so I know their parameters and stuff like that, but the main question I have is how to feed them and the maturity level of the tank they require. I've read conflicting information online about the amount of algae/biofilm they need. The tank in question is a 60 gallon goldfish tank with 3 fancy goldfish of varying sizes, 8 white cloud minnows, 6 zebra danios and 6 nerite snails. I feed this tank veggie lover's garlic flakes from my LFS regurlary, with algae wafers, Repashy Super Green, and frozen tubifex worms mixed in there. It has been running for 2 months now, and is finally starting to mature with the algae and biofilm production.

That's why I'm thinking about adding some hillstream loaches, but I have been very nervous because they are a bit pricey and some sources online say that feeding-wise they can be as delicate as otocinculus. Does anyone have any advice for me about maybe getting some? Thanks in advance 🙂 

I had the same issue when I was researching hillstream loaches and infact a similar issue with other fish to a lesser degree. The problem is, in this hobby, there is more than one RIGHT way to do things. That doesn't mean there is a wrong way because there is. There is just more than one right answer. Some people have a hard time realizing this and their minds stick to the one and only answer they know. 

Yes hillstream loaches do not require the high flow and such that many people claim they do. It is however true that some will refuse all food but natural algae. Mine do not and will eat just about anything I offer them but I have heard some can get that way. That said, I do not think they are suitable in a tank with goldfish. If they are not already, the goldfish will eventually get large enough to each the loaches as well as the other fish you have in that tank. Goldfish eat anything small enough to fit in their mouths. That is why it's common to have nothing but goldfish in the same tank. 

Honestly, I think you have a great situation to set up a 2nd tank to add hillstream loaches to. It doesn't have to be large. I would say maybe 20 gallons. The danios, white clouds and hillstreams would make an amazing tank! 

[Hannah Parker]

I ended up getting a trio last night and I think they were sold to me sick. 2 have already passed and the last one looks very rough. 

 

[Hannah Parker]

I put some Seachem stress guard in there and turned off the lights, I really couldn’t think of what else to do. I can’t tell what this sickness looks like I’ve never seen it before, or if it even is sickness 

[Wrencher_Scott]

On 7/17/2022 at 11:02 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I put some Seachem stress guard in there and turned off the lights, I really couldn’t think of what else to do. I can’t tell what this sickness looks like I’ve never seen it before, or if it even is sickness 

This reminds me, kind of a long story. Bought one good size from a LFS. It was dead next day. Took it back got another (they got like 5 in a shipment). I got in my car and just before I left for home it was on it's back in the bag, it was at least alive when I bought it. Took it back, they gave me my money back, put it in the tank and watched it. Next day I went in to check on it and they said the whole shipment died! Very odd!

I really got the feeling they were man handled too much like some of these people do when they catch/move them. Or maybe had problems in shipping like with ammonia in the bag but I really do not know. I've had the one I got from Petco that was VERY small for over 5 months now. 

Anyway I would return them. 

[Jayci]

Oh no, hope everything goes well for that last one. That really is such a shame; try not to get discouraged no matter what happens to that last one!

[Hannah Parker]

On 7/17/2022 at 11:00 PM, Jayci said:

Oh no, hope everything goes well for that last one. That really is such a shame; try not to get discouraged no matter what happens to that last one!

He was the prettiest, he was absolutely gorgeous. And yes, it is a shame. Sadly he passed over night as well. All three died in like 36 hours. I won't be trying again for quite a while, and certainly won't go back to that LFS. I made the mistake of going because my usual ones didn't have them in stock. I'll be smarter next time for sure. 

Edited July 18, 2022 by Hannah Parker

[Wrencher_Scott]

On 7/18/2022 at 6:09 AM, Hannah Parker said:

He was the prettiest, he was absolutely gorgeous. And yes, it is a shame. Sadly he passed over night as well. All three died in like 36 hours. I won't be trying again for quite a while, and certainly won't go back to that LFS. I made the mistake of going because my usual ones didn't have them in stock. I'll be smarter next time for sure. 

Put them in a bag, take them back and get your money back. 

I know they aren't exactly cheap and I bet they will return your money. 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/17/2022 at 10:53 AM, Hannah Parker said:

I ended up getting a trio last night and I think they were sold to me sick. 2 have already passed and the last one looks very rough. 

There is skin blotchiness towards the rear fins right?  I am trying to determine if it's just the translucency on the fin or a white discoloration.
 

On 7/18/2022 at 6:09 AM, Hannah Parker said:

He was the prettiest, he was absolutely gorgeous. And yes, it is a shame. Sadly he passed over night as well. All three died in like 36 hours. I won't be trying again for quite a while, and certainly won't go back to that LFS. I made the mistake of going because my usual ones didn't have them in stock. I'll be smarter next time for sure. 

Aquahuna usually has them 🙂

I'm very sorry about your struggles.  It isn't fair to the hobbyist or the fish for things to be sold and lead to these kinds of issues.  I would highly recommend QT next time, especially for these guys so they can acclimate and you can keep a good eye on them for how they are doing.

[Hannah Parker]

On 7/18/2022 at 4:47 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

There is skin blotchiness towards the rear fins right?  I am trying to determine if it's just the translucency on the fin or a white discoloration.

Yes there is, it almost looked like the top layer of skin peeled away in white strips on that blotch. It also had little skin-things "flaking" off from it's underside, and you can see them around it's outline on the glass. It's hard to explain because it was very bizarre, I've never seen anything like it. It wasn't an injury, but it didn't look like any sicknesses I'm familiar with. I suspect that's because this species looks so different from other fish and I've never had them before. 

On 7/18/2022 at 4:47 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

Aquahuna usually has them 🙂

I'm very sorry about your struggles.  It isn't fair to the hobbyist or the fish for things to be sold and lead to these kinds of issues.  I would highly recommend QT next time, especially for these guys so they can acclimate and you can keep a good eye on them for how they are doing.

Thank you 🙂 I've looked on AquaHuna before, but I'm hoping to get them locally since they are sensitive. We have very hard water in my area. They looked completely healthy when I got them, and I should have known better an quarantined. None of my goldfish or the other fish in the tank seems sick so whatever it was wasn't contagious hopefully. 

On 7/18/2022 at 4:47 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

There is skin blotchiness towards the rear fins right?  I am trying to determine if it's just the translucency on the fin or a white discoloration.

You can also see in the video how fast he was breathing, and how he was unable to stay stuck to the glass and kept sliding down. It was very sad 😞 It happened very quick too, they looked really good when I first got them home. 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/19/2022 at 6:21 AM, Hannah Parker said:

Yes there is, it almost looked like the top layer of skin peeled away in white strips on that blotch. It also had little skin-things "flaking" off from it's underside, and you can see them around it's outline on the glass. It's hard to explain because it was very bizarre, I've never seen anything like it.

 sounds like a PH or ammonia burn thing that led to some bacterial / fungal issues.

On 7/19/2022 at 6:21 AM, Hannah Parker said:

We have very hard water in my area.

ah, interesting.  I'm sure there's a rachel video on it, but perhaps the borneo loaches might work better in your water?

On 7/19/2022 at 6:21 AM, Hannah Parker said:

You can also see in the video how fast he was breathing, and how he was unable to stay stuck to the glass and kept sliding down.

That's really tough, I'm very sorry you and the fish had to suffer through that.  When they breathe rapidly like that I generally tend to add salt and to add oxygenation.  Otos having redness and loaches having the fast heartrate, corys having the rapid breathing like that (and it's not from breeding) always bothers me when I see it.  I always tend to "overdo it" and try to make sure temp is good (cooler) and to make sure that they have added oxygenation for a few days.

Edited July 19, 2022 by nabokovfan87