Guppysnail Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 My little LFS has these guys. Have had for a few weeks. They don’t know much in the aquatic ID department as they are mainly fur pets and reptiles. They looked and the invoice says pagoda snails. These do not look like any pictures I have found. I seen the pictures @OnlyGenusCaps posted in their journal and these do not look like those to me. I know @Odd Duck commented about pagoda. 3 weeks ago they had 2 that were twice this size but looked the same with no spinet spikes on the shell. The foot and face were Hershey kiss solid milk chocolate brown on the larger that were sold. I did not have my phone then. These are the smaller I just took pictures of but could not see the face. I really like the look of these and they act like mystery snails but are not. I don’t want to get them knowing nothing about them. They are in with guppies at the store. Can someone help ID please? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 (edited) Hercules snail? It came up when I looked up what pagoda snails looked like (Brotia pagodula). the scientific name for the other one is Brotia herculea Edited July 9, 2022 by nabokovfan87 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 9, 2022 Author Share Posted July 9, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 4:13 PM, nabokovfan87 said: Hercules snail? It came up when I looked up what pagoda snails looked like (Brotia pagodula). the scientific name for the other one is Brotia herculea Thanks but I do not think so. The larger one was rounder not long and came out of the shell like a mystery snail. That is why it is confusing me. Im almost wondering though it looked the shell wise perhaps the larger one was a different snail. But these also seem larger around than long. Maybe they are just babies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dkshadowwolf Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 (edited) This looks like a Nerite snail to me. If you find many white eggs on your glass that do not hatch then that is likely what it is. They have many different pattern varieties. The eggs will not hatch in freshwater. Edited July 9, 2022 by Dkshadowwolf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 9, 2022 Author Share Posted July 9, 2022 (edited) @DkshadowwolfI actually picked up the last two zebra and tiger nerite snails they had to add to my group of them. These are not nerite. The large one looked sort of like a Japanese trap door but not quite. The others were on the spider wood they had crawling and arctic like mystery snails though they definitely are not those either. Edited July 9, 2022 by Guppysnail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer V Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 (edited) I think you're right, some kind of Japanese Trapdoor Snail, hence the pagoda misnomer. Very cool! Edited July 9, 2022 by Jennifer V 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 1:46 PM, Guppysnail said: Thanks but I do not think so. The larger one was rounder not long and came out of the shell like a mystery snail. That is why it is confusing me. Im almost wondering though it looked the shell wise perhaps the larger one was a different snail. But these also seem larger around than long. Maybe they are just babies. That's where my mind was at too. I don't know if the shell gets different over time. I would think, based on what it is and what it could be, it might. Maybe if you had a picture of the snail with it's body out of the shell too might help? I don't know if there's other features that might narrow down the results. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 (edited) Looks like a Japanese trapdoor snail. @Cinnebuns has some of those and maybe could offer care advice? Link <————————<-<— Edited July 10, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnebuns Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 The shape looks like a Japanese trapdoor but the stripes have me confused. I haven't seen a JTS with that coloring before. I sent a pic to a friend who is into some of the more unusual colors of JTS than I am and I'll see what he thinks. The care for a JTS is the same as a mystery snail. The major difference is in their reproduction. JTS are live bearers who give birth to 2-20 babies every 9 months. Since they don't lay eggs, unless you catch them giving birth, you won't know you have babies until they pop up. I have fun hunting them down. After I find the first one the hunt is on and I keep my eyes out for the rest over the next few weeks! For reference. This is the only striped JTS type I know of. The shape is def that of a young JTS tho. This is one of my young JTS at 4 months old. The 2nd is of a newborn next to a 4 month old. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 (edited) @Cinnebuns yes the larger one looked like that. It was still small but bigger than the one hubby took a pic of today for me. I really should start carrying my phone 🤣 when I got home a few weeks ago I started looking at JTS but the body/foot though same shape face Amanda antenna structure etc was a solid milk chocolate color beautiful and unusual. Not a drop of white or grey on the flesh. Your pics definitely make me think it was JTS. I could not find many baby JTS pics. I should have just impulse bought and brought her home. I do not think these little ones had that same chocolate body. the shells definitely were not conical in shape the way pics of pagoda snails are. Edited July 10, 2022 by Guppysnail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnebuns Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 7:49 PM, Guppysnail said: @Cinnebuns yes the larger one looked like that. It was still small but bigger than the one hubby took a pic of today for me. I really should start carrying my phone 🤣 when I got home a few weeks ago I started looking at JTS but the body/foot though same shape face Amanda antenna structure etc was a solid milk chocolate color beautiful and unusual. Not a drop of white or grey on the flesh. Your pics definitely make me think it was JTS. I could not find many baby JTS pics. I should have just impulse bought and brought her home. I do not think these little ones had that same chocolate body. the shells definitely were not conical in shape the way pics of pagoda snails are. That definitely speaks to part of the issues with identifying young JTS is that they change so much at different ages. Almost every pic you will find online is of adults but babies and juveniles almost look like a different species. Part of the reason for this is that JTS have 2 layers to their shell. The inner layer is colored and becomes exposed as they age. That is why my young one is all brown. They also have a unique way to sex them. A male will have 1 long, straight antenna and 1 short, curled one like this. A female will have 2 straight, long antenna like this If you look at the newborn in that pic, you can see why they are often confused with ramshorn snails. An easy way to tell the difference is a ramshorn spiral will stay flat while a JTS baby will stick out. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torrey Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 I came to say definitely not Brotia herculea. The Hercules looks more like a really chunky MTS. If the shell ended in a sharper point, it actually reminded me of my dullest colored assassin, but their foot doesn't look anything like a Mystery snail. Reading through, and taking side research rabbit holes, juvenile JTS looks the most promising. Since they have made their way onto the banned list in 13 states so far, it makes sense they would be mislabeled as Pagodas.... I think they are adorable, are you going to go pick them up tomorrow? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnebuns Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 8:28 PM, Torrey said: reminded me of my dullest colored assassin I briefly had the same thought but usually assassins are more elongated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 (edited) On 7/9/2022 at 9:28 PM, Torrey said: I came to say definitely not Brotia herculea. The Hercules looks more like a really chunky MTS. If the shell ended in a sharper point, it actually reminded me of my dullest colored assassin, but their foot doesn't look anything like a Mystery snail. Reading through, and taking side research rabbit holes, juvenile JTS looks the most promising. Since they have made their way onto the banned list in 13 states so far, it makes sense they would be mislabeled as Pagodas.... I think they are adorable, are you going to go pick them up tomorrow? I’m not certain I will be as fond of the ones with the multicolored foot. I’m so kicking myself for not bringing her (two long antenna thanks @Cinnebuns) home. I can’t stop thinking of her. I did not buy her because for no reason I can logically explain I do not care for conical shaped snails ie. Mts, rabbit etc. I’m not certain though. I picked up those 2 lone nerites so now I’m up to 39 🙄 sounds extreme but perfect number to spread in proportion to each tank. But my QT has panda fry in it I did not realize actually hatched and 18 of those nerites as well as my magenta’s started laying and i have the one clutch the snails ran over in. And Angel and Lefty’s bn pleco clutch and dad is 5 days into raising him and moms clutch. so NO I should not bring them home. I have no room. I go to get crickets Wednesdays for frog so if they are there and even one has a milk chocolate body they are most likely coming home….😁 Edited July 10, 2022 by Guppysnail 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 The link I posted above has the same coloration as the original photo you posted @Guppysnail, ID’d as Japanese trap door snail. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 9:42 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said: The link I posted above has the same coloration as the original photo you posted @Guppysnail, ID’d as Japanese trap door snail. Awesome I have not had a chance to check out the link. But I will! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnebuns Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 8:42 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said: The link I posted above has the same coloration as the original photo you posted @Guppysnail, ID’d as Japanese trap door snail. Oh I didn't notice the link before. Ty for that! I've never seen that coloration. There's always something new out there! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 9:42 PM, Guppysnail said: do not care for conical shaped snails ie. Mts, rabbit etc Same. But I recently saw a video about the rabbit snails. They hop! The JTDS doesn’t have a lengthy shell though. Looks kinda cute to me. 🙂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 @Chick-In-Of-TheSea thanks for the link. I did not even see it at first. That is definitely them. @Torrey them crawling onto the no go list makes me want them now ha waiting until I have room even more. 😞 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnebuns Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/9/2022 at 9:07 PM, Guppysnail said: @Chick-In-Of-TheSea thanks for the link. I did not even see it at first. That is definitely them. @Torrey them crawling onto the no go list makes me want them now ha waiting until I have room even more. 😞 They aren't the same color, but if later you decide you want some and your LFS no longer has them lmk. I sold all my 4 month olds but I have 2 females so I already have a stock of 1 month olds. They grow slow so may take a couple of months to be ready but it's an option. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyGenusCaps Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 Maybe someone already mentioned this and I missed it above, but have you considered the possibility it might be Asolene spixi? The spiral point is a bit more defined on yours than I am familiar with them being for this species, but an image search suggests they can be more like the one in your photo. The shell patterning is pretty spot on though. Anyhow, I just thought it might be something to consider. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/10/2022 at 9:55 AM, OnlyGenusCaps said: Maybe someone already mentioned this and I missed it above, but have you considered the possibility it might be Asolene spixi? The spiral point is a bit more defined on yours than I am familiar with them being for this species, but an image search suggests they can be more like the one in your photo. The shell patterning is pretty spot on though. Anyhow, I just thought it might be something to consider. Well thank you, I think. I thought they sort of looked that way. I would love to have spixi snails and have wanted them forever! So you just cemented in my going to the pet shop when they open at noon 🤣. Just when I thought my will power would make a solid stand….it crumbles just that fast🤪 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyGenusCaps Posted July 10, 2022 Share Posted July 10, 2022 Glad I could help erode your will power? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppysnail Posted July 10, 2022 Author Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 7/10/2022 at 11:22 AM, OnlyGenusCaps said: Glad I could help erode your will power? You succeeded. They are home with me now. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyGenusCaps Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 Whoa! The mottling on the body! That doesn't look like Asolene spixii to me. It looks more like the body type and coloration from Viviparus viviparus to me now. Here is a photo from a population that reminds me of your snails. If they lay eggs for you that look like Marisa cornuarietis eggs (or any for that matter) then they are likely to be A. spixii, but live birth suggests V. viviparus. The other thin is that A. spixii will supposedly eat some soft-leaved plants, but V. viviparus is a filter feeder, and feeds on algae. I'll be curious about your continued observations with them. I'm quite curious now! Sorry if it turns out some idiot on the internet [me] caused you to go out an buy snails you don't want by misidentifying them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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