Root tabs only?

[GreenCircleGirl]

Since starting a regime of easy Green and root tabs, my nitrates have climbed past 40. I’m thinking of using root tabs only and adding them once monthly. Besides Java ferns and Anubis and ferns which aren’t rooted, will my crypts, swords, Val, and crinum even need easy Green?

[Mmiller2001]

Go the other direction. Root tabs are not necessary and water column dosing is easily controlled.

[lefty o]

i tend to agree, while i like root tabs as you can put them right next to the roots of individual plants. easy green will still fertilize the vals etc that are planted in the substrate.  as long as there is water down in the substrate, and there almost always is in an aquarium, fertilizing the water column works.

[OnlyGenusCaps]

I've had the opposite experience with vals and cyrpts.  Mine got really weak when I went to only water column dosing.  And my sword gave up the ghost real fast.  I'm going to be using root ferts exclusively for my root feeders.  But, I have sand, so maybe that makes a difference? 

[lefty o]

On 4/10/2022 at 6:57 AM, OnlyGenusCaps said:

I've had the opposite experience with vals and cyrpts.  Mine got really weak when I went to only water column dosing.  And my sword gave up the ghost real fast.  I'm going to be using root ferts exclusively for my root feeders.  But, I have sand, so maybe that makes a difference? 

every tank is an individual.

[JoeQ]

I use to only use root tabs, it was definitely a positive for my fish/plant keeping abilities to add liquid ferts to my arsenal of knowledge as well. I still use root tabs but only in the area of plants that are root feeders, or ones showing deficiencies. 

[Scapexghost]

I would try cuttibg back on easy green before cutting it out entirely

[lefty o]

On 4/10/2022 at 9:25 AM, JoeQ said:

I use to only use root tabs, it was definitely a positive for my fish/plant keeping abilities to add liquid ferts to my arsenal of knowledge as well. I still use root tabs but only in the area of plants that are root feeders, or ones showing deficiencies. 

thats about what i do. i target those that need it with root tabs, but for the most part im running on liquid fert.

[sumplkrum]

On 4/9/2022 at 4:25 PM, GreenCircleGirl said:

Besides Java ferns and Anubis and ferns which aren’t rooted, will my crypts, swords, Val, and crinum even need easy Green?

I use easy green weekly. Root tabs I only apply to the Amazon Swords once a month or so.

I have basic gravel as a substrate and the swords are root hogs. If you're using a fertilized substrate, you might not need root tabs.

If your nitrates are too high, try halving your dosage and track how things go from there. In my tanks, plant density is high so I actually double-dose.

[GreenCircleGirl]

This is my second year in the hobby, and I’ve always done well with the fish, but I am a plant killer…all plants. I can keep a few alive now that I’ve started using the tabs and easy Green, but now my nitrates are over 50 or maybe 100 (I can’t tell difference on chart) where they were under 40 always. I have to do something. I just added root tabs around the swords and crypts and just 1 tab. I am going to stop the easy green until I’m back to nitrates at 40 with my usual 20% weekly water change, then I will start dosing 1/2 pump per 10 gallons and see how plants respond. I will also put root tabs every other month. Does this sound like a plan?

[lefty o]

sounds like a plan. skip a dose or two, then sneak back up on it.

[Kurt Brutting]

I add root tabs every other month just for the heavy root feeders and dose easy green in small increments all throughout the week and I keep an eye on my parameters. I like your plan and I find it helpful to keep a small journal with how much I dose, what I dose, and when. 

[Mmiller2001]

I would read this.

https://www.2hraquarist.com/blogs/fertilize-planted-tank/root-or-water-dosing?_pos=2&_sid=9fb2ae013&_ss=r

 

Bottom line, there's no substitute for a rich aqua soil (or dirt). Root tabs can't replace this reality and more often than not, root tabs are going to leach right into your water column. You will ask yourself, "why are my Nitrates so high?" You will stop dosing your all in one fertilizer solely based off a nitrate reading. Your plants will deteriorate and you will get algae. You will most likely blame the high Nitrates as most new comers fail to recognize that stopping fertilization eliminated the required levels of Potassium, Phosphorus, and Micro nutrients available in the all in one fertilizer.

If you find yourself in a high Nitrate situation after adding root tabs; just increase water changes but continue dosing proper amounts of fertilizer.

I will disagree with the article when he mentions water column dosing is complicated. Estimative Index removes any complication and only takes a few minutes to calculate. For low energy tanks "Low Tech", you simple drop EI levels down to 25-33%. Easy! 

Sorry for the rant. 😁 Can you tell I think root tabs are the devil?

 

Here's an older picture of my inert substrate, no root tabs and EI dosing modified to be a bit less on the dosing. GDA is controlled by lowering Nitrates a bit.

I want to add this. Root tabs won't make things better, there's more to it. Honestly, increasing your water changes to 50% per week and mildly dosing your tank will offer a much bigger improvement over a root tab.

 

Edited April 11, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[DaveO]

On 4/11/2022 at 10:32 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

Can you tell I think root tabs are the devil?

I knew your response before I read it.🤣

[OnlyGenusCaps]

On 4/11/2022 at 10:32 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

Bottom line, there's no substitute for a rich aqua soil (or dirt). Root tabs can't replace this reality and more often than not, root tabs are going to leach right into your water column.

Okay this bit got my attention.  I am just about to fill a 75 gallon tank with plans to grow rooted plants.  Right now, I have added a ton of root tabs under the sand in the area I want the plants to grow.  Though it would be a lot of work, I can still change this at the moment.  What would you recommend?

You can see what I am talking about over here (and if you reply - perhaps you should do it on the thread as not to pull too far off topic from this one):

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

[Mmiller2001]

If it was me, I'd remove them. But everyone's mileage is different.

On 4/12/2022 at 1:57 AM, DaveO said:

I knew your response before I read it.🤣

😁

[Minanora]

Okay, okay, okay. So I've just read through all this information. I'm going to highjack for a moment, sorry.

@Mmiller2001 My 75 and I are fighting algae; hair algae and staghorn algae. What is a good micro fert to use to omit Nitrate addition?

I have Flourish Advance, and I also have fluval Gro+ Micronutrients liquid. I'd like to use a liquid micro supplement for now, at least until we're back from a two week vacation that is coming up very soon.

[Mmiller2001]

On 4/12/2022 at 9:55 AM, Minanora said:

Okay, okay, okay. So I've just read through all this information. I'm going to highjack for a moment, sorry.

@Mmiller2001 My 75 and I are fighting algae; hair algae and staghorn algae. What is a good micro fert to use to omit Nitrate addition?

I have Flourish Advance, and I also have fluval Gro+ Micronutrients liquid. I'd like to use a liquid micro supplement for now, at least until we're back from a two week vacation that is coming up very soon.

You don't want to omit Nitrates. If you are generating nitrates from stocking loads, then increase water changes so you can dose properly.

That said, for micros anything will work. Flourish is fine. Some will work better than others with certain pH's do to various chelates.

[Minanora]

On 4/12/2022 at 9:09 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

You don't want to omit Nitrates. If you are generating nitrates from stocking loads, then increase water changes so you can dose properly.

That said, for micros anything will work. Flourish is fine. Some will work better than others with certain pH's do to various chelates.

The nitrates are coming from the fish. The plants aren't established yet. I'm scooting them along with CO2 injection.

So I should be changing water out to get to a lower nitrate level and then dosing something like easy green to add a broad spectrum? I was thinking I could let the nitrates be from the fish, and only add micros and supplement the P and K values for macros as needed.

Or are you saying just change out water and add micros with something like regular Flourish?

[josephnoctum]

I personally have gone the aqua soil route, I typically will do layers with the aqua soil sandwiched in between and capped with sand (personal preference). I will rarely add root tabs unless I have a heavy root feeder that is struggling after it's initial melt and then re-establish. 

I'll take the easy green and actually split the dosing out for the week. This was an idea I got from Bentley Pascoe. 
For example a 30 gallon would get three pumps of Easy Green a week but instead of all three at once, I'll split that every other day with a day off for water change day. (i.e. Sunday 1 pump, Monday nothing, Tuesday 1 pump, Wednesday nothing, Thursday one pump, Friday nothing, Saturday water change) 

[Mmiller2001]

On 4/12/2022 at 10:29 AM, Minanora said:

The nitrates are coming from the fish. The plants aren't established yet. I'm scooting them along with CO2 injection.

So I should be changing water out to get to a lower nitrate level and then dosing something like easy green to add a broad spectrum? I was thinking I could let the nitrates be from the fish, and only add micros and supplement the P and K values for macros as needed.

Or are you saying just change out water and add micros with something like regular Flourish?

You can do that, but this style usually has problems. Nitrate production from fish load also brings excess organics (soluble and insoluble). This can complicate things quite a bit.

Definitely up water changes (by percentage) to keep nitrates down. Best scenario is to reduce fish load.

Edited April 12, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Patrick_G]

@GreenCircleGirl, you don’t have to use Easy Green. There are liquid fertilizers that contain little or no nitrogen. I’d like to see this product from Aquarium Co-op. 

[OnlyGenusCaps]

On 4/12/2022 at 8:49 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

If it was me, I'd remove them.

So then I am left with sand.  That has turned out poorly for plant establishment in the past.  Should I be using a specialized aquarium soil underneath a sand cap?  Also, I'm given to understand those soils, for lack of a better term, wear out over time.  If I put that in capped with sand, does that give the system a lifespan, or is there a way to maintain it long-term?  These are the questions I have.  And probably more.

[Minanora]

On 4/12/2022 at 9:53 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

You can do that, but this style usually has problems. Nitrate production from fish load also brings excess organics (soluble and insoluble). This can complicate things quite a bit.

That is a valid, and good, point.

Alright. Thank you. End of hijacking.

[Patrick_G]

On 4/12/2022 at 10:12 AM, OnlyGenusCaps said:

So then I am left with sand.  That has turned out poorly for plant establishment in the past.  Should I be using a specialized aquarium soil underneath a sand cap?  Also, I'm given to understand those soils, for lack of a better term, wear out over time.  If I put that in capped with sand, does that give the system a lifespan, or is there a way to maintain it long-term?  These are the questions I have.  And probably more.

I’d consider Safe T Sorb for an economical solution. It has a high CEC and can be combined with some cheap Osmocote granules. I haven’t used it but I’m planning on using it in a future tank. @Seattle_Aquaristhas posted images of his results using it, and I’m sold. 
Commercial aquasoil is very expensive, but also has a reported high CEC capacity, so theoretically it should hold onto nutrients over time. I’ve mixed it with gravel and used it under sand, both for aesthetics and to save some money.