Guppy breeding

[Fishkeeper1010]

Does anyone know what you get when you cross a koi guppy with a dumbo ear red tail guppy? 
i was hoping to get the koi trait onto the dumbo ear red tail. So they would have the dumbo ear and the koi pattern.

I have 1 male dumbo ear red tail and two female koi.

[TheSwissAquarist]

Around 25% would be pure koi, 50% a mix of koi and dumbo ear, and 25% pure dumbo ear; if I’m getting my punnet squares right. @Fish Folk

Both strains however are quite inbred, so be prepared for some weird variations. 

[Fish Folk]

In this situation, the best plan is to breed, put fry into a separate tank, grow out, separate desired fish to a new tank, spawn together or spawn back to parents. Then repeat. Eventually you’ll get some of what you’re looking for. Guppies can inbreed about 7x generations before major deformities corrupt the line. Ideally, you’d run about 6x 20-gal long tanks, each divided by a matten sponge, separate sponge filters running in each corner. This gives you 12x tanks to develop two lines.

I doubt that a single Punnett Square will help very much because of the number of variables.

Edited October 23, 2023 by Fish Folk

[Fish Folk]

For what it’s worth, I like just breeding mine in a colony…

 

[Cinnebuns]

On 10/23/2023 at 6:28 AM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Around 25% would be pure koi, 50% a mix of koi and dumbo ear, and 25% pure dumbo ear; if I’m getting my punnet squares right. @Fish Folk

Both strains however are quite inbred, so be prepared for some weird variations. 

They would all be mutts. Punnet square doesn't apply here. 

On 10/23/2023 at 5:55 AM, Fishkeeper1010 said:

Does anyone know what you get when you cross a koi guppy with a dumbo ear red tail guppy? 
i was hoping to get the koi trait onto the dumbo ear red tail. So they would have the dumbo ear and the koi pattern.

I have 1 male dumbo ear red tail and two female koi.

You would end up with a variety but if you cull that and keep the ones similar to what you are going for, then over time it would create what you want. You may get one very close if not exactly what you want but that would not breed true for awhile. You can make it happen but it won't happen in the first batch you get.

I did something similar to this for a couple of years before I had to give them up because of health problems. I really enjoyed it. I did it in a colony setup but you could line breed it if you want to have more control but that requires more tanks and work. 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Cinnebuns

[sumplkrum]

Any time you do a cross between strains you are effectively scrambling the genetics.
You might get something you like, but most of the time you get trash. It's never as simple as A + B = C.

And like Cinnebuns said, the children won't breed true. You might get one fish that looks good, but you're basically ruining your original strains.

That's something you can try to experiment with, but no one can tell you what will happen.
Even if someone else has similar looking fish, the genetics in their fish may be very different from what's in your fish depending on where they came from and who breed them.

[PineSong]

This YT channel has lots of videos that show the results of crossing different colors of guppies and Endlers. You might find they've used some of the same types as yours, or you might just enjoy seeing the results 🙂

 

 

[Fishkeeper1010]

That’s pretty cool. Ive seen a video from Alberts guppy adventure and when he crossed a dumbo ear red tail female to a koi male, he got half the babies being koi and half being non kois. They were still young when he showed them but they did not have dumbo ears either. Anyways, they look good so I will still attempt to keep and breed them!

[sumplkrum]

I can tell you that the koi 'orange nose' trait is recessive. To have it show up consistently you need to breed two orange-nose fish together, otherwise it only shows every other generation.

If it doesn't show up on a dumbo-earred fish, don't just toss it. The fish might have it as recessive. So it doesn't show on this fish, but it's babies might have it.
You're basically trying to find these fish that have one trait you want and carry the recessive for the other. (although they may not be compatible genes at all)

It comes down to careful notes and several generations of testing pairs to find out which fish can reproduce the trait and which fish are dead ends for what you're trying to do.

[Fishkeeper1010]

Are the dumbo traits in guppies recessive too? Dumbo bettas are. 

[Matt B]

It can get out of control fast! 

[rgb_aquarium]

The ‘Dumbo Koi Guppy’ line is already available in Vietnam. It pretty new 1-2 years. Some U.S. imported also started selling them. You basically get them by crossing a Koi Red Ear male with a Dumbo Red Tail female with dark pectoral fin. The key is the dark pectoral fin with the female, and big red ear with the male.
 

 

[Fishkeeper1010]

Jeez that’s one big family right there! What size tank is that?

Yes, I know that this strain existed somewhere it’s just a bit hard to get my hands on here in Australia. So I’m trying to make some!

Does it have to be a male koi and a female dumbo or can it be the other way around?

Edited November 8, 2023 by Fishkeeper1010