Mystery Illness in Peppered and Bronze Corydoras

[tetra]

Hello all,

About one month ago, I bought some Peppered and bronze corydoras from Aquahuna. They all came alive and well. Unfortunately they were left in the mail box for some time (maybe around 12 hours) But no deaths. The box was warm so nothing should have stressed them too much. But I did notice the peppered and the bronze corydoras breathing fast (I didn’t suspect too much of it as I thought they were just stressed from being shipped a long way) so I followed the Aquahuna acclimation process (as I did it the last time I bought from them) and it worked for me so I did it again. After the acclimation process I netted them and put them into a 10 gallon quarantine tank. A day later, I checked on them and saw all the peppered corydoras were breathing heavy, but the bronze were breathing normally. So I feed them Xtreme Nano in hopes maybe they were just stressed or hungry. They all eat the pellets up and no food is left behind.

 

Note: I bought some neon tetras from Aquahuna about 2 weeks before the corys and they’ve been in there with them ever since.

 

Detailed version:

Fast forward 1 week later, the peppers are still breathing heavy, and the bronze aren’t. since then, I’ve been doing 50% water changes every other day to reduce ammonia levels in the tank (as I added 6 peppered and 6 bronze and also 10 neon tetras and 5 adult bronze corydoras before) and I know my quarantine is over stocked but most of the fish were juveniles (about 1 inch or a little more) except for the adult bronze corydoras (they were about 2.5 inches or 3 inches I think.) I soon removed the adult bronze Corydoras to a 75 gallon planted tank (and are still in there now.) and now the 12 corys and 10 neon tetras are the current occupants. Fast forward another week later, peppers still breathing heavy and the bronze were breathing normally. They eventually started to sit at the surface and gasp for air instead of going up in short bursts and coming back down including the bronze corys (neon tetras weren’t gasping though.) Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, etc. Everything was stable but were still doing it. Sometimes they would be lethargic and stay at the bottom and just breathe heavy, and sometimes they would kinda lay on their side but not all the way, twirling their left or right pectoral fin like someone helicoptering their arms when they are about to fall. Only the bronze would not helicopter their pectoral fins and not lay on their side. 
 

Another week later, I decide to treat for parasites. I dosed a packet of expel-p and blacked out the tank for 24 hours, then I did a 50% water change and added paracleanse. A day later I did another 50% water change as I didn’t see improvement. So then a day later, I do another 50% water change and add the strongest treatment of salt, (1 tbs per one gallon of water) I know corys can’t handle that level of salt. But at that point, I was getting pretty desperate to figure out what’s happening. A few hours later, I see a bronze cory barely holding on behind the filter. So I did a partial water change and the cory was swimming again. But stayed in place head down like a headstander down on the bare-bottom glass. Eventually the bronze cory was swimming again and everyone was acting fine. Peppers were still breathing heavy though which bothered me. 3 days later after letting some of the salt sit, I did a 50% water change after I saw flashing as they were irritated by the salt and didn’t see improvement at all. Still gasping at the surface sometimes, lethargic and breathing heavy usually. Finally, fast forward to now. Earlier this morning I did a quick 50% water change after I saw a peppered cory floating at the surface laying in dead position breathing heavy. When I saw the Cory laying like that, I tapped on the glass and the cory swam back down. I then added maracyn in hopes it was some sort of bacterial infection and would cure it. A few hours later, I now saw one laying in the corner next to the bio rings gasping laying on its side and saw another one laying on its side against the glass. I tapped the glass next to the one leaning against the glass and and got back up again, but didn’t move much and started breathing fast. When I tapped the glass near the one with the bio rings it didn’t move. I then added Ich-X and the ones laying on their side got back up again and start swimming around. After that, I feed them blood worms and they all ate them. A few hours later, back up at the surface again gasping and one of the peppered are just sitting there. Not really leaving until I tap the glass. Ever since then, I’ve been testing the water and everything’s been okay. I thought it may have been ammonia burn but I’m not sure what it actually is.

 

a couple days ago I saw white spots on them but it didn’t act like Ich, so I assume it was stress ich cause it didn’t spread to the other fish. And it didn’t get larger on the corys who had it. But then I saw just one bronze cory flashing but nobody else was doing it. I still treated with ich-x Just in case. No deaths yet fortunately but right now it looks like the pepper is not gonna make it by tomorrow.

 

 

(Adult bronze Cory Issue)

Before I added the neon tetras, I got some bronze corydoras from my local mom and pop pet store and we’re a decent size at about 3 inches. They looked relatively healthy and were active in the display tank. So we got them and put them in the 10 gallon quarantine tank when there was only 1 neon tetra in there (from the outbreak disease in the 29 gallon that killed the other 9, I eventually got 11 more but one died from getting sucked up from the filter but nothing else happened after that.) At around evening. I saw the largest bronze cory swimming super fast then started breathing really fast. I didn’t see the other corys doing this and I started getting worried. She continued to do this ever since I got them. I also forgot to mention that I accidentally cross-contaminated a syphon when I was doing a water change the first day I got them. And the largest cory started swimming fast after I did cross contaminate I didn’t have another syphon at the time so I assumed they picked up what ever the other tank had going on. A 3 weeks later I used the quarantine med trio to just take out what ever they had as I couldn’t Identify what was happening it didn’t help unfortunately. And they all started flashing and are still flashing today. I suspected it was flukes as I saw a lot of symptoms of it. So I treated with paracleanse but no effect. Eventually I put them in the 75 gallon and they started getting really skittish even though there were loads of hiding places nobody’s really around that area so nothing could be scaring them so much. They began flashing and breathing fast and are scared of me even though I’m around there a lot and not doing sudden movements and something that could scare them. I did see after 3 weeks of them being in there start started becoming more active than usual and then I saw cory eggs on a Amazon sword and the glass. One cory ate all the eggs on the sword though. I did manage to get some eggs into the breeder box but them eventually the eggs in the box started disappearing which was bizarre. I didn’t see anything swimming around and the box wasn’t collapsed. There was only 2 eggs left now. But back to what I was saying. The corys started getting pale and I thought it might have been the sand being white. But then they started getting darker and were still flashing and breathing fast. I feed them paracleanse in their food but it only help a little but then they were back to flashing, breathing fast, etc.

 

I’m not sure what to do at this point. I’ve tried Expel-p, paracleanse, maracyn, salt, ich-x, even medicated food. But nothing is helping.

I thank you in advance if someone could figure this out.

 

[nabokovfan87]

@tetra Can you please give us full details of tank setup, parameters, including temp.

If they are breathing rapidly, add an airstone asap.

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/11/2023 at 8:40 PM, tetra said:

Earlier this morning I did a quick 50% water change after I saw a peppered cory floating at the surface laying in dead position breathing heavy. When I saw the Cory laying like that, I tapped on the glass and the cory swam back down. I then added maracyn in hopes it was some sort of bacterial infection and would cure it. A few hours later, I now saw one laying in the corner next to the bio rings gasping laying on its side and saw another one laying on its side against the glass. I tapped the glass next to the one leaning against the glass and and got back up again, but didn’t move much and started breathing fast. When I tapped the glass near the one with the bio rings it didn’t move. I then added Ich-X and the ones laying on their side got back up again and start swimming around. After that, I feed them blood worms and they all ate them. A few hours later, back up at the surface again gasping and one of the peppered are just sitting there. Not really leaving until I tap the glass. Ever since then, I’ve been testing the water and everything’s been okay. I thought it may have been ammonia burn but I’m not sure what it actually is.

When you did the WC did you accidentally forget to dose dechlorinator?  Adding salt is a good idea to help soothe/prevent damage from ammonia or nitrite issues.  Among other things it's helpful for, salt is specifically good with that.

I've had my corydoras on a plethora of salt levels.  I recommend for the 1 tbsp per 2 gallons as a safer level, but they definitely can handle 1 tbsp per gallon.

I would recommend verifying temp is ok, adding more air and more surface agitation when possible. When you add salt too, add more air.  When you add meds, add more air. 

Right now it seems like there's a lot going on and I would just focus on daily testing, good aeration, and clean water.  Once we have an idea of what you're dealing with it'll be easier to advise moving forward and next steps.  Right now, try to run carbon, remove meds, keep the tank clean, and proceed with a high quality water.

[tetra]

On 9/11/2023 at 8:48 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

@tetra Can you please give us full details of tank setup, parameters, including temp.

If they are breathing rapidly, add an airstone asap.

Currently the ph is 6.8, the hardness is 25 or soft, the Kh is 0, nitrites are 0, the nitrates are 0 or 10 (the co-op strips aren’t the easiest to read.) and haven’t read for ammonia yet. But I have been doing loads of water changes lately at about 50% every time.

I also added an air stone already before I got them. I put the flow up a bit to add more oxygen, and there should be more than enough oxygen in the tank. But right now one is laying on its side, looking as if it’s gonna die.

 

On 9/11/2023 at 8:57 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

When you did the WC did you accidentally forget to dose dechlorinator?  Adding salt is a good idea to help soothe/prevent damage from ammonia or nitrite issues.  Among other things it's helpful for, salt is specifically good with that.

I've had my corydoras on a plethora of salt levels.  I recommend for the 1 tbsp per 2 gallons as a safer level, but they definitely can handle 1 tbsp per gallon.

I would recommend verifying temp is ok, adding more air and more surface agitation when possible. When you add salt too, add more air.  When you add meds, add more air. 

Right now it seems like there's a lot going on and I would just focus on daily testing, good aeration, and clean water.  Once we have an idea of what you're dealing with it'll be easier to advise moving forward and next steps.  Right now, try to run carbon, remove meds, keep the tank clean, and proceed with a high quality water.

I haven’t forgotten to add dechlorinator when I did a water change this noon. I have been running the air stone when I add meds too and I haven’t taken it out as I want to keep the oxygen high.

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/11/2023 at 10:27 PM, tetra said:

Currently the ph is 6.8, the hardness is 25 or soft, the Kh is 0, nitrites are 0, the nitrates are 0 or 10 (the co-op strips aren’t the easiest to read.) and haven’t read for ammonia yet. But I have been doing loads of water changes lately at about 50% every time.

I also added an air stone already before I got them. I put the flow up a bit to add more oxygen, and there should be more than enough oxygen in the tank. But right now one is laying on its side, looking as if it’s gonna die.

KH being 0 is likely an issue for stability. Any amount of waste, your PH shoots down pretty hard.

GH, you're saying 25 or "soft" but do you mean 25 ppm or 25 degrees?  I would recommend going to get a KH/GH test kit (liquid) to verify what is really going on.  From what you're saying, you have RO water out of the tap and it would be pretty tough on some fish to thrive in that.

What is your temperature?

https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=271

https://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/corydoras-paleatus/
 

Quote

Temperature: 72 – 78°F (22 – 26°C)

pH: 6.0 – 7.0

Hardness: Up to 12°H

My recommendation would be:
Temp: 72-74
pH: 6.8-7.4
GH: 6-8 degrees <--- Double your KH value
KH: 3-4 degrees  <--- Gives you PH stability

On 9/11/2023 at 10:27 PM, tetra said:

I haven’t forgotten to add dechlorinator when I did a water change this noon. I have been running the air stone when I add meds too and I haven’t taken it out as I want to keep the oxygen high.

given what you're seeing, I would recommend adding another.

[tetra]

On 9/12/2023 at 12:43 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

KH being 0 is likely an issue for stability. Any amount of waste, your PH shoots down pretty hard.

GH, you're saying 25 or "soft" but do you mean 25 ppm or 25 degrees?  I would recommend going to get a KH/GH test kit (liquid) to verify what is really going on.  From what you're saying, you have RO water out of the tap and it would be pretty tough on some fish to thrive in that.

What is your temperature?

https://www.planetcatfish.com/common/species.php?species_id=271

https://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/corydoras-paleatus/
 

My recommendation would be:
Temp: 72-74
pH: 6.8-7.4
GH: 6-8 degrees <--- Double your KH value
KH: 3-4 degrees  <--- Gives you PH stability

given what you're seeing, I would recommend adding another.

Apologize for not being clear. The Gh is 25PPM on the Co-Op strips I have previously tested before with the Gh and Kh test kit and the Kh and Gh were on point with the strips. The Kh was higher previously at around 4-5ppm, it’s Just I haven’t cleaned the filter for about a month in there so all the waste shot out and probably brought the Kh down.

The temperature was between 77F-78F so not too much fluctuation really I have tested the temperature several times and it has been exactly the same since.

I rose the oxygen output into the air pump and they mostly stopped going to the surface and gasping so that helped. But the peppers were still breathing heavy and not moving much. 
 

The one that looked as if it was dying in the photo above fortunately got back up and started swimming again yesterday after I added poly-fil straight-after I replaced the sponge and just dropped the sponge in. It was probably the ich-x that was still in there and I did a full dose, too. After the Sponge fell, the corys hid under it and most of the day and will only come out when I throw in some food. Now, the one that was about to die started breathing really fast when it was with the rest of the corys when eating. I know that it looks like their breathing fast when they are chewing sometimes but this looked like genuine breathing and would swim away behind the cholla wood to catch its breathe by breathing really fast, then the cory would come back and repeat the process. I did notice that some of the corys were not interested in the food, but it was Repashy Soilent Green and I know Corydoras mostly like food with protein but I don’t feed this everyday, I mostly feed other protein rich foods. 
 

2 peppers will sometimes lay slightly on their side breathing heavy. They aren’t pale, but I did see a couple of the bronze corys losing just a bit of the black horizontal bar they had on their side.

 

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/12/2023 at 6:21 PM, tetra said:

The temperature was between 77F-78F so not too much fluctuation really I have tested the temperature several times and it has been exactly the same since.

I rose the oxygen output into the air pump and they mostly stopped going to the surface and gasping so that helped. But the peppers were still breathing heavy and not moving much. 

Drop the temps down to 72-74 if possible.  They don't like to be that hot.

On 9/12/2023 at 6:21 PM, tetra said:

Apologize for not being clear. The Gh is 25PPM on the Co-Op strips I have previously tested before with the Gh and Kh test kit and the Kh and Gh were on point with the strips. The Kh was higher previously at around 4-5ppm, it’s Just I haven’t cleaned the filter for about a month in there so all the waste shot out and probably brought the Kh down.

Apart from temp, both KH and GH are very low.  It's likely causing some issues here.  I would encourage you to double check everything by taking a sample of water to the pet store or by using an API liquid test kit.  The kit is very affordable, very quick and easy to use.

Adding GH: Seachem Equilibrium
Adding KH: Seachem alkalinity buffer or crushed coral
 

On 9/12/2023 at 6:21 PM, tetra said:

After the Sponge fell, the corys hid under it and most of the day and will only come out when I throw in some food.

This is very normal for small groups of corydoras.  Some won't come out unless they see dithers or unless it's dawn/dusk.  Having something like logs to provide cover helps as well.  they don't like to feel exposed or in bright lights, especially when in small groups.

[tetra]

On 9/12/2023 at 6:54 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

Drop the temps down to 72-74 if possible.  They don't like to be that hot.

Apart from temp, both KH and GH are very low.  It's likely causing some issues here.  I would encourage you to double check everything by taking a sample of water to the pet store or by using an API liquid test kit.  The kit is very affordable, very quick and easy to use.

Adding GH: Seachem Equilibrium
Adding KH: Seachem alkalinity buffer or crushed coral
 

This is very normal for small groups of corydoras.  Some won't come out unless they see dithers or unless it's dawn/dusk.  Having something like logs to provide cover helps as well.  they don't like to feel exposed or in bright lights, especially when in small groups.

I did have a heater in there, so I unplugged it. The temperature usually drops 72F-73F at night when I tested with a temperature gun and it usually doesn’t fluctuate much.

I forgot to mention, the Gh in the 75G is 150PPM so I’m not sure what brought the Gh down as I’m not adding any minerals to the water other than just Easy Green and Prime.

 

There should be enough hiding spots and they usually hide on the side of the cholla wood where there is the least light at night. Even at night, they aren’t active much, just sitting there for 30 minutes+ and not doing much.

[nabokovfan87]

Keep an eye on things.  Hopefully the fish respond well to the changes. 

[tetra]

I didn’t have equilibrium so I just dosed alkaline buffer and unplugged the heater last night. This morning, I didn’t see any improvement, one bronze cory started to breathe fast and a few of the other ones started just drifting mid-water-column. They only came down when I fed them.

The peppered cory that was breathing fast started to lay on its side again next to the bio rings and didn’t come to eat with the others when I dropped some food in. I do know that pepper likes the Xtreme nano, so I think what ever is going on is getting worse. The pepper eventually got up from there but started to breathe fast again. The other ate all the food so that pepper didn’t get any. Most of the peppers have been lethargic and sometimes freeze in place (though I heard Hoplo catfish will freeze sometimes and they are a cousin to Corydoras.) All the other fish including the neon tetras are eating but over all I have seen no improvement. 

I have also started to see a bronze cory flashing now, and one neon tetra just flashed once. But that Bronze cory has been flashing for about 2-3 days now.

[nabokovfan87]

I would recommend having a liquid GH/KH test kit prior to dosing any buffers in and verify what you're seeing.  Flashing could be a sign of a variety of things.  Mid-level swimming is an interesting issue.  I'm not sure what to make of that.  I assume it's acclimating to temperature swings, but that's difficult to say. 

Can you please retest ammonia, nitrite daily at this point and report back?  There's got to be more going on here and the acclimation process is really causing havoc on these guys, unfortunately.  I would limit feeding too every other day for right now.  This cuts back on waste, ammonia production, and helps them to have enough food to stay healthy, but not too much food to cause more issues.

Are you doing daily water changes?

[tetra]

On 9/13/2023 at 5:13 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I would recommend having a liquid GH/KH test kit prior to dosing any buffers in and verify what you're seeing.  Flashing could be a sign of a variety of things.  Mid-level swimming is an interesting issue.  I'm not sure what to make of that.  I assume it's acclimating to temperature swings, but that's difficult to say. 

Can you please retest ammonia, nitrite daily at this point and report back?  There's got to be more going on here and the acclimation process is really causing havoc on these guys, unfortunately.  I would limit feeding too every other day for right now.  This cuts back on waste, ammonia production, and helps them to have enough food to stay healthy, but not too much food to cause more issues.

Are you doing daily water changes?

I was doing daily water changes when I first introduced them to the quarantine tank to keep ammonia down. But currently, I’ve been doing them 2-3 maybe 4 times a week. The last water change I did was 2-3 days ago I think, it was a 50% water change like the other ones.

I already have the liquid GH/KH test kit it’s just I haven’t used it anymore cause I already got the strips.

Alright, I’ll reduce feeding and test for nitrite and ammonia, hopefully I’ll see improvements. Should I try salt (1 tbs per 3 gallons of water?) Just to reduce stress cause I saw they still have white spots on them but aren’t growing so I’m assuming its stress ich.

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/13/2023 at 7:19 PM, tetra said:

Should I try salt (1 tbs per 3 gallons of water?) Just to reduce stress cause I saw they still have white spots on them but aren’t growing so I’m assuming its stress ich.

1 per 5G or 1 per 3 might not be enough. I would try 1 per 2 gallons. Honestly.

If you can show the white spots that helps a lot. If you're actively seeing ich, then you would need to treat with ich-x as well as the salt.

@Colu do you have that chart for ich vs epistylis? This one seems very fast moving and very high death rate.

[Colu]

On 9/14/2023 at 9:51 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

1 per 5G or 1 per 3 might not be enough. I would try 1 per 2 gallons. Honestly.

If you can show the white spots that helps a lot. If you're actively seeing ich, then you would need to treat with ich-x as well as the salt.

@Colu do you have that chart for ich vs epistylis? This one seems very fast moving and very high death rate.

 

[tetra]

On 9/14/2023 at 1:51 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

If you can show the white spots that helps a lot. If you're actively seeing ich, then you would need to treat with ich-x as well as the salt.

These are the best pictures I could get of one of the peppers.

When I looked a little closer, I realized there was a little red near the tail fin and there was a lot more white spots there too. The pepper in the picture is still breathing heavy and fast.

I tested with the GH/KH test kit and after adding the alkaline buffer, my KH is 11-12 degrees and my Ph is now 8.0-8.4. My GH is 4 degrees. On the test strips, my KH is 300ppm+, the GH is still 25ppm, the nitrite is 0ppm, the nitrate is 10ppm, I tested with liquid ammonia test kit and the ammonia is 0-0.25 ppm its difficult to see the colors on the charts as they look so similar.

[nabokovfan87]

Yeah. That looks like epistylis to me. I'll grab treatment notes. @Colu does that look like Epi to you as well?

Treatment notes:

Ich-x + maracyn 2 (or kanaplex) + salt and the other instructions listed in this post on this thread.

 

On 9/14/2023 at 6:49 PM, tetra said:

I tested with liquid ammonia test kit and the ammonia is 0-0.25 ppm its difficult to see the colors on the charts as they look so similar.

 

Very hard to treat with the bacterial meds given the ammonia. If there's any way to give that tank stability it would help.

Edited September 15, 2023 by nabokovfan87

[tetra]

Unfortunately, the pepper in the photo above passed this morning. I saw it near the bio rings in the corner with its tail fin curved to the left. I put the corpse in a ziplock bag so I can save it for maybe identifying something though I don’t have a microscope. Another pepper started staying at the surface and laying on its side. It only went back down when I tapped the glass. And I also saw a bronze cory laying on its side and it would only move when I tapped the glass. When the pepper died, I did a 50% water change. At the time, I thought the pepper might have been alive still but it still wasn’t moving so I netted it out and it still wasn’t moving in the slightest.

I only have ich-x and salt right now. I don’t have Kanaplex/maracyn 2. Is it okay to just dose ich-x and salt until I could get it? And in what directions?

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/15/2023 at 7:18 PM, tetra said:

Is it okay to just dose ich-x and salt until I could get it? And in what directions?

Yes.

Ich-x. Dose it per the bottle instructions after a water change indicated on the bottle. Salt, I would recommend 1 TBSP per 2 gallons.

I'm sorry about all the losses and struggles. I really empathetize and wish there was more we could do.

[tetra]

On 9/16/2023 at 2:53 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

Yes.

Ich-x. Dose it per the bottle instructions after a water change indicated on the bottle. Salt, I would recommend 1 TBSP per 2 gallons.

I'm sorry about all the losses and struggles. I really empathetize and wish there was more we could do.

Thanks, I did a 1/3 water change and dosed ich-x. Unfortunately I saw a bronze cory laying on its side covered in white spots this morning when before I turned the lights on. It was still breathing but a little faster.

An hour after the water change I saw the bronze that was laying down had an extremely sunken belly. Almost like it didn’t have a stomach at all. Even though I fed them 2 days ago. I’ve went a week without feeding them once and I haven’t seen it this bad before. I tried feeding the bronze, but it didn’t get up it just sat there until I gave it a little push with a net. Eventually it got back up but it was lethargic and it wasn’t eating. I don’t think the bronze is gonna make it tomorrow if it doesn’t eat.

The remaining 5 peppers are mostly staying at the surface gasping for air. Some of the bronze ones are also going up there just not as much.
 

 

[nabokovfan87]

On 9/16/2023 at 12:40 PM, tetra said:

The remaining 5 peppers are mostly staying at the surface gasping for air. Some of the bronze ones are also going up there just not as much.

How are the temps doing?  Have you ever used paracleanse on the fish?

Unfortunately I don't know if it's prudent to focus on the internal parasites as an issue, the epistylis, or the severe oxygenation issues. I can't really say what's going on and it seems like everything is quickly becoming a moving target.

Monitor them daily for a few things. If it helps to have a record, please post the details here.

1. What is the temp? Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate tests.

2. We're any meds added or water change completed (and how much).

3. Did they eat?

4. Any weird behaviors?

5. Status of white spots on the fish. (Same, more, less, etc.)

If you have the ability to do so, add another air stone.

[Colu]

That looks like epistylis that feed's off of the gram negative bacteria on the slime coat of your fish and spreads more quickly at higher temperatures the most effective treatment is a combination of ick x to dose the tank and maracyn2 in food feeding a small amount twice a day for upto 7 days if there not eating dose the tank with maracyn2 or kanaplex @tetra

Edited October 20, 2023 by Colu

[JE47]

@tetra how are your fish doing?

[tetra]

On 9/16/2023 at 2:08 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

How are the temps doing?  Have you ever used paracleanse on the fish?

Unfortunately I don't know if it's prudent to focus on the internal parasites as an issue, the epistylis, or the severe oxygenation issues. I can't really say what's going on and it seems like everything is quickly becoming a moving target.

Monitor them daily for a few things. If it helps to have a record, please post the details here.

1. What is the temp? Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate tests.

2. We're any meds added or water change completed (and how much).

3. Did they eat?

4. Any weird behaviors?

5. Status of white spots on the fish. (Same, more, less, etc.)

If you have the ability to do so, add another air stone.

I just did a water change about 30 minutes ago so the temperature dropped 1-2F. I usually do colder water changes but I do my best to keep the temperature the same. But right now it’s at 72-73F but usually sits at 74F once it warms up.

Yes, I have used paracleanse and expel p on them. No improvement after, but they stopped getting skinny. So I’m not sure what happened. I have started feeding them a lot now because I’ve been using medicated food. They still seem to eat it even though I don’t use garlic guard. I didn’t use Seachem focus either. I accidentally forgot to dose ich-x in the kanaplex-medicated food, but I dosed it in the water column. A night before, I also dosed kanaplex in the main tank just so when they or if they improve, I feed them the medicated food as some of them were not eating.
 

The weirdest behavior I’ve seen is the bronze corys drifting mid water column and sometimes the peppers sit at the surface face-first at the surface breathing heavy. Their fins were rotting away a bit and had this white stuff on the end. I’m not sure if it’s the epistylis or fungus.

The good news is they are improving though, but not too much. But I have seen the fins getting better, less breathing heavy though a lot of them still are a bit, white spots going away more and more, less going to the surface, and no more deaths (unfortunately, I did lose 4 corys, 2 bronze, 2 peppered.) but over I seen a bit of improvement. (Note: the bronze corys are still drifting in the water column.)

haven’t tested the water for a couple days, so I did a water change cause I saw the peppers gasping at the surface. And the tank clouded a day after I added the kanaplex.

I also placed the sponge filter in the middle of the tank, so I can try to get less dead spots in the tank as I only had one right now, and a aqueon hob filter also placed in the center.

 

[tetra]

Update: I have good news and bad news.

The good news is that they have stopped breathing fast, and that is pretty much it. There was improvement before, but then it just got worse again.

The bad news is that they are still going to the surface and just sit there breathing. It doesn’t look heavy or fast when I look at their gills. I’m starting to question if they have an injury or they just don’t know how to do short burst to the surface. They are occasionally flashing here and there but it isn’t excessive. I saw a little bit of buildup of “epistylis” on a couple of the pepper and bronzes pectoral fins. The medicated food hasn’t helped much really. I even added erythromycin to their food and it helped a bit but didn’t do much after a bit. But I attempted to treat with salt. And salt has been the most effective treatment right now. I would do salt baths, 1tbs per 0.5ish gallons of water and once they floated belly up or started drifting, I would put them back in the tank immediately. They would breathe fast for some time but after an hour or so I would see most of the white spots would disappear. But the next day, they would just get some white spots back. I did this for about 5-6 days I think. But after seeing the spots would come back, I decided to treat the tank with salt so the source would be killed. So I added 1tbs per 2 gallons of water after I drained 50% of the tank and just left the sponge filter running in their. Didn’t see much improvement next morning, so the following day, I did 1tbs per 1 gallon of water. It helped more, but it didn’t go away 100% another following day, I added an extra 2 table spoons and dissolved it partially in a measuring cup and poured it in. Next day, I saw they looked a little better, more white spots were gone, but this stuff is extremely stubborn. I think it got acclimated to the concentration of salt from the salt baths and is now extremely resistant of death from salt. I forgot to mention that during these salt baths, during the 4th salt bath. When a bronze cory was starting to float belly up I was trying to fish it out. But since it’s a round Home Depot bucket there was a slight gap in between the bucket and the rim of the net and when I was trying to get the bronze in the net, it got in between the rim and the bucket and repeatedly hit its head multiple times on the bucket (not too aggressively) so I placed it back in the water. I thought I may have caused an injury cause a day after putting it in the tank, im not sure if it’s the right cory, but the next morning I saw the bronze with black thing on its caudal fin and it was a bit ripped up.

I tested the water yesterday when I added the most recent treatment of the salt. Everything was the same, the ph is 7.2 or 7.4, the nitrate is 10, the nitrite is 0, the GH is 25, the Kh is 0 (I know it’s low but it hasn’t effected them much even after raising the Kh and ph. So I just decided to keep it stable instead of chasing the Kh since I didn’t want to stress them more than they already are with this “epistylis”.)

I’m still feeding the medicated food, it just hasn’t done much at all. I’m starting to question if it even is epistylis or a rarer disease that looks similar to it.

Note: The tank is still drained 50%

[Colu]

On 10/7/2023 at 3:15 AM, tetra said:

Update: I have good news and bad news.

The good news is that they have stopped breathing fast, and that is pretty much it. There was improvement before, but then it just got worse again.

The bad news is that they are still going to the surface and just sit there breathing. It doesn’t look heavy or fast when I look at their gills. I’m starting to question if they have an injury or they just don’t know how to do short burst to the surface. They are occasionally flashing here and there but it isn’t excessive. I saw a little bit of buildup of “epistylis” on a couple of the pepper and bronzes pectoral fins. The medicated food hasn’t helped much really. I even added erythromycin to their food and it helped a bit but didn’t do much after a bit. But I attempted to treat with salt. And salt has been the most effective treatment right now. I would do salt baths, 1tbs per 0.5ish gallons of water and once they floated belly up or started drifting, I would put them back in the tank immediately. They would breathe fast for some time but after an hour or so I would see most of the white spots would disappear. But the next day, they would just get some white spots back. I did this for about 5-6 days I think. But after seeing the spots would come back, I decided to treat the tank with salt so the source would be killed. So I added 1tbs per 2 gallons of water after I drained 50% of the tank and just left the sponge filter running in their. Didn’t see much improvement next morning, so the following day, I did 1tbs per 1 gallon of water. It helped more, but it didn’t go away 100% another following day, I added an extra 2 table spoons and dissolved it partially in a measuring cup and poured it in. Next day, I saw they looked a little better, more white spots were gone, but this stuff is extremely stubborn. I think it got acclimated to the concentration of salt from the salt baths and is now extremely resistant of death from salt. I forgot to mention that during these salt baths, during the 4th salt bath. When a bronze cory was starting to float belly up I was trying to fish it out. But since it’s a round Home Depot bucket there was a slight gap in between the bucket and the rim of the net and when I was trying to get the bronze in the net, it got in between the rim and the bucket and repeatedly hit its head multiple times on the bucket (not too aggressively) so I placed it back in the water. I thought I may have caused an injury cause a day after putting it in the tank, im not sure if it’s the right cory, but the next morning I saw the bronze with black thing on its caudal fin and it was a bit ripped up.

I tested the water yesterday when I added the most recent treatment of the salt. Everything was the same, the ph is 7.2 or 7.4, the nitrate is 10, the nitrite is 0, the GH is 25, the Kh is 0 (I know it’s low but it hasn’t effected them much even after raising the Kh and ph. So I just decided to keep it stable instead of chasing the Kh since I didn’t want to stress them more than they already are with this “epistylis”.)

I’m still feeding the medicated food, it just hasn’t done much at all. I’m starting to question if it even is epistylis or a rarer disease that looks similar to it.

Note: The tank is still drained 50%

What I would do is stop the medicated food and dose the tank with kanaplex do one full course then give an update