Cichlids...both South American & Africans

[Shadow]

So, educate me a little...I am doing research on a future curveball project as my interests have been peaked for a while now. 

SA I can do a Blackwater tank, but not sure I want to go too Blackwater as I want the fish to pop still and not be muddled. Africans prefer more clean, clear tanks. Curious to get more info on both sides of the Cichlid coin & also your favorite fish, tanks you have done...any advice really. I like to dip heavily into the research and I trust this community the most. Google is great and all, but getting it direct beats that any day. 

[AllFishNoBrakes]

With my soft, lower pH, and little to no buffer water, SA cichlids make most sense for me personally as I don’t want to “make” water. Making water would be required for fish that like hard water/higher pH. 
 

I love my 55 gallon Angelfish tank, and also recently converted my 20 long to a blackwater tank. The blackwater has been so much fun that I’m about to covert the 29 gallon tank next to it as a second blackwater tank! The 29 will only be as dark as the Aquaneat light will allow. The 20 long is as dark as I can get it! 
 

Both types of tanks are super fun. I love my planted tanks (currently 12 of 13 are planted) but the darker water, wood, and very little planting has been a lot of fun, too. 

Edited July 27, 2023 by AllFishNoBrakes

[Lennie]

I've kept some african cichlids when I was a teen but never kept them again. Now I have angels, discus, apistogramma erythrura and black rams.

Your water parameters would play a big role to make a decision on this one. Secondly, you gotta decide if you want a breeding project, a community tank with your cichlid being a planted community tank centerpiece fish, or if you are willing to invest a whole tank to african cichlids. Also deciding what sort of a tank look you want is also important.

To be fair, I even keep my blackrams in high kh/ph-8.0-/gh environment and haven't observed any side effect myself as long as I met their temperature needs. The only thing I can tell is, they weren't breeding in those parameters. And they instantly bred when I moved them to 6.0ish ph softwater tank.

 

I guess I personally love SA cichlids more, as they are more flexible when it come to planted tanks, having tankmates and so on. Also usually, the aggression is fairly lower here if we don't including the breeding behavior. And I love all my SA cichlids, apistos being my least favorite right now because they are shy. I love the puppy behavior or ram, discus and angels and see how they react when they see me. 

 

 

[Shadow]

On 7/27/2023 at 5:14 PM, Lennie said:

I've kept some african cichlids when I was a teen but never kept them again. Now I have angels, discus, apistogramma erythrura and black rams.

Your water parameters would play a big role to make a decision on this one. Secondly, you gotta decide if you want a breeding project, a community tank with your cichlid being a planted community tank centerpiece fish, or if you are willing to invest a whole tank to african cichlids. Also deciding what sort of a tank look you want is also important.

To be fair, I even keep my blackrams in high kh/ph-8.0-/gh environment and haven't observed any side effect myself as long as I met their temperature needs. The only thing I can tell is, they weren't breeding in those parameters. And they instantly bred when I moved them to 6.0ish ph softwater tank.

 

I guess I personally love SA cichlids more, as they are more flexible when it come to planted tanks, having tankmates and so on. Also usually, the aggression is fairly lower here if we don't including the breeding behavior. And I love all my SA cichlids, apistos being my least favorite right now because they are shy. I love the puppy behavior or ram, discus and angels and see how they react when they see me. 

 

 

I am super nervous about keeping Discus, heard they are incredibly difficult to keep. I definitely am into Rams, German Blues specifically. Also like Acaras and of course Angelfish as I have several in my main tank. What size tank do you keep your Discus in and how hard are they to keep?

On 7/27/2023 at 4:23 PM, AllFishNoBrakes said:

With my soft, lower pH, and little to no buffer water, SA cichlids make most sense for me personally as I don’t want to “make” water. Making water would be required for fish that like hard water/higher pH. 
 

I love my 55 gallon Angelfish tank, and also recently converted my 20 long to a blackwater tank. The blackwater has been so much fun that I’m about to covert the 29 gallon tank next to it as a second blackwater tank! The 29 will only be as dark as the Aquaneat light will allow. The 20 long is as dark as I can get it! 
 

Both types of tanks are super fun. I love my planted tanks (currently 12 of 13 are planted) but the darker water, wood, and very little planting has been a lot of fun, too. 

That Blackwater tank is super cool and I love that Angelfish!

[AllFishNoBrakes]

@Shadow Thanks! That Angel tank has been up and running for 3 years at this point. Blackwater tank started as a shrimp only tank 3 years ago and got converted to a blackwater tank a couple of months ago. So, while the tank isn’t new, being a blackwater tank is still new to me. Holler if you have any questions! Happy to help if I can!

[Lennie]

On 7/28/2023 at 5:30 AM, Shadow said:

am super nervous about keeping Discus, heard they are incredibly difficult to keep. I definitely am into Rams, German Blues specifically. Also like Acaras and of course Angelfish as I have several in my main tank. What size tank do you keep your Discus in and how hard are they to keep?

My experience wouldn't reflect the truth as I got me a confirmed breeding pair and only a month ago. I would not like to inform you wrong until I gain more experience. But I do indeed stuggle to make them eat and transition to a new diet. I can say that for sure.

But you can check this out:

If you have any questions about GBR, I can try my best to respond

Edited July 28, 2023 by Lennie

[madmark285]

Never kept Discus but I would not put these guys in a tank smaller than 55 gallons, they are quite large when fully grown. My issue with discus is the high cost, my LFS sells them for $75-100 per fish.

My favorite is a Mbunas and I hope to convert my 75 gallon tank to these guys. Positive attributes to Mbunas, they are very hardy fish and fun to watch. And typically most people have hard/high PH water which Mbuna's love. On the negative side, breeding male can terrorize a tank. I had a breeding pair of auratus, the male just dominated that tank. No deaths just pissed off fish 🙂

[OnlyGenusCaps]

I'll second the mbuna!  Some are saltwater colorful (a term that gets tossed around too blithely on the FW side, in my opinion)!  There are more peaceful species, but they are all wonderfully active.  As mentioned above, they love my hard water.  You don't have to grow plants (sorry folks, that's a plus for me) - because they would eat them anyhow.  And as herbivores, they love algae; meaning you don't see a lot of folks with serious algae problems in a tank of mbuna.  Lastly, mine are trained to come to the surface to eat nori from my hand.  They eat it with such fervor and roiling enthusiasm, my family have called them my "vegan piranhas".  They are just loads of fun! 

[Odd Duck]

I have a sort of SA cichlid tank in my 75 G, Jack Dempsey tank.  It also has 7 tiger silver dollars and now 2 festivums and a single, large male bristlenose pleco.  If I can catch the other male out of my 100 G (they’re both “lemon drops - brown crossed with blue eyed lemon) I would have 2 in there, then I would probably add at least one of my female blue eyed lemon, maybe a long fin, haven’t decided if I want to risk a long fin in this tank.  My Jack tank isn’t planted SA but my 100 G angelfish tank is.  I have loads of emerse plants growing from the Jack tank.  Barely any emerse from the angel tank.  Both tanks have links in my sig.  the angel tank is fairly conventionally SA planted because they aren’t that hard on plants.  The Jack tank is planted specifically for fish that are hard on plants.

[Fish Folk]

Cichlids are fascinating. Many aquarists have a love-em / hate-em polarity of attitude towards keeping them. For me, I adore them all!

There are several well known Cichlid clubs I read info from now and then: Greater Chicago Cichlid Association, snd Capital Cichlid Association. American Cichlid Association may host events too.

Broadly, Cichlids can be divided into meta categories of “Old World Cichlids” (Africa), and “New World Cichlids” (Americas). Personally, I like to also think of size spectrum from large Tank-Busters to small Dwarf Cichlids. 

OLD WORLD CICHLIDS (AFRICA)

Madagascar…

There are very curious cichlids to be found in Madagascar. Most are “tank-busters” that require ca. 120 gallons or more. My favorite is this one:

Paratilapia polleni / Starry-Night Cichlid

Rift Lake Mbunas and Peacocks…

When people say “African Cichlids,” they generally refer to either the commonly sold mbunas from Lake Malawi, or the ornamentally bred “Peacocks”. We kept a tank of mixed mbunas. As has been stated above, one breeding male will eventually assert dominance and rule the tank. Rule of thumb is stock heavily, buy them young, and provide ample hideouts. Loads of color options:

Shell Dwellers…

These are small, attractive niche-species. Typically kept in species-only groups, they’re a fun breeding project. I’ve never kept them, but enjoy seeing other’s enthusiasm about them. There are a number of varieties. I think this one is Lamprologus occellatus:

West African River Cichlids…

These are favorites of mine! Best known in the hobby are Kribensis. They’re small, but hardy. My son bred these a few years ago:

I have recently gotten a pair of Dwarf Congo Cichlids — related to Kribs:

NEW WORLD CICHLIDS (AMERICAS)

Central American Cichlids are generally feisty, large species-only fish. They’re often just a one-fish-tank scenario:

Jaguar Cichlid:

Green Terror (very interactive!):

Some medium-sized Central / South American species are easier to keep in a _hardy_ community tank.

Firemouth Cichlids:

My son bred these for BAP…

Electric Blue Acaras:

We bred hundreds of these…

Check out Jim Cumming to see HUGE South American species.

Most popular New World cichluds are (1) Dwarf Cichlids — Apistos, Rams, Laetacara, etc. 

Here’s a male GBR we raised:

Here’s a natural-color Apistogramma agassizii my son kept:

(2) Angelfish

We bred some Marbles awhile back:

(3) Discus

Tricky to breed, but not hard to keep:

I’ve had eggs once, but never fry:

Edited July 29, 2023 by Fish Folk

[Lennie]

On 7/28/2023 at 6:24 PM, Fish Folk said:

I have recently gotten a pair of Dwarf Congo Cichlids — related to Kribs:

these look awesome

[anewbie]

On 7/27/2023 at 4:16 PM, Shadow said:

So, educate me a little...I am doing research on a future curveball project as my interests have been peaked for a while now. 

SA I can do a Blackwater tank, but not sure I want to go too Blackwater as I want the fish to pop still and not be muddled. Africans prefer more clean, clear tanks. Curious to get more info on both sides of the Cichlid coin & also your favorite fish, tanks you have done...any advice really. I like to dip heavily into the research and I trust this community the most. Google is great and all, but getting it direct beats that any day. 

Depends on africans - you have several different types - some (west africa) are soft water fishes like kribs; others like rift lake are medium hard water fishes. Conversely while most sa fishes are one of  clear water/white water/blackwater there are ca (central america) cichild which are hardwater fishes. 

[Shadow]

On 7/28/2023 at 10:24 AM, Fish Folk said:

Cichlids are fascinating. Many aquarists have a love-em / hate-em polarity of attitude towards keeping them. For me, I adore them all!

There are several well known Cichlid clubs I read info from now and then: Greater Chicago Cichlid Association, snd Capital Cichlid Association. American Cichlid Association may host events too.

Broadly, Cichlids can be divided into meta categories of “Old World Cichlids” (Africa), and “New World Cichlids” (Americas). Personally, I like to also think of size spectrum from large Tank-Busters to small Dwarf Cichlids. 

OLD WORLD CICHLIDS (AFRICA)

Madagascar…

There are very curious cichlids to be found in Madagascar. Most are “tank-busters” that require ca. 120 gallons or more. My favorite is this one:

Paratilapia polleni / Starry-Night Cichlid

Rift Lake Mbunas and Peacocks…

When people say “African Cichlids,” they generally refer to either the commonly sold mbunas from Lake Malawi, or the ornamentally bred “Peacocks”. We kept a tank of mixed mbunas. As has been stated above, one breeding male will eventually assert dominance and rule the tank. Rule of thumb is stock heavily, buy them young, and provide amble hideouts. Loads of color options:

Shell Dwellers…

These are small, attractive niche-species. Typically kept in species-only groups, they’re a fun breeding project. I’ve never kept them, but enjoy seeing other’s enthusiasm about them. There are a number of varieties. I think this one is Lamprologus occellatus:

West African River Cichlids…

These are favorites of mine! Best known in the hobby are Kribensis. They’re small, but hardy. My son bred these a few years ago:

I have recently gotten a pair of Dwarf Congo Cichlids — related to Kribs:

NEW WORLD CICHLIDS (AMERICAS)

Central American Cichlids are generally feisty, large species-only fish. They’re often just a one-fish-tank scenario:

Jaguar Cichlid:

Green Terror (very interactive!):

Some medium-sized Central / South American species are easier to keep in a _hardy_ community tank.

Firemouth Cichlids:

My son bred these for BAP…

Electric Blue Acaras:

We bred hundreds of these…

Check out Jim Cumming to see HUGE South American species.

Most popular New World cichluds are (1) Dwarf Cichlids — Apistos, Rams, Laetacara, etc. 

Here’s a male GBR we raised:

Here’s a natural-color Apistogramma agassizii my son kept:

(2) Angelfish

We bred some Marbles awhile back:

(3) Discus

Tricky to breed, but not hard to keep:

I’ve had eggs once, but never fry:

WOW! Thanks for all this info! Def going to think on what I want to do now. I haven't set up the big 60 gallon in the foyer as of yet, so I am debating what to keep in it. Maybe its time to try Discus...there's a great breeder/LFS in Chicago(my kiddo lives there) that ships here and its the perfect warm time of year to send em lol! I personally have been super interested in them and GBRs for a while now...Blue Acaras as well. Think I might do the foyer tank with Discus and do the GBRs with something in my offish. 🙂 Regardless, thanks for taking the time to give me such an great response!

Appreciate all the responses...its given me a lot to look into and think about. 

On 7/28/2023 at 3:05 AM, Lennie said:

My experience wouldn't reflect the truth as I got me a confirmed breeding pair and only a month ago. I would not like to inform you wrong until I gain more experience. But I do indeed stuggle to make them eat and transition to a new diet. I can say that for sure.

But you can check this out:

If you have any questions about GBR, I can try my best to respond

Cheers! Reading through it now! 🙂