Cleaning Tanks

[FishRBeautiful]

Hi,

I started fishkeeping in January. My main tank is 20 gallons. I’ve made a lot of changes since I started. In about February, I got a very large decorative vertical rock for the center decor and have a fake coral as well as fake plants and live anacharis and then of course gravel (pea gravel, which I got from Menard’s after lots of research; it’s not sharp and I cleaned it well outside in the winter. LOL Still wondering if pool filter sand would be better). 
Before I got the tank, I found a video on gravel vacuuming but I did not foresee the algae problems I’m facing. I have some plants that grow algae after 1 week and some are just too hard and too much work to clean. (Soaking in hot water/vinegar, using toothbrush) I’ve had no luck cleaning the large rock but I got a Bristlenose pleco who has done spectacular. I also got a Nerite snail to clean the green spot algae and surprisingly he has cleaned the 100% impossible to clean coral. I’ve scrubbed that with a toothbrush. He needs a friend (or 10) to help him clean all that coral because he forgets about it and goes elsewhere. I also got a couple Cory catfish (2 died) and 2 Kuhli loaches (2 days ago). I have 4 female Platys and their two “kids”. 
I’m just wondering how to best clean my tank. I do like a 40% water change (with gravel vac) every 10ish days to two weeks (because I try to wait a month or until my nitrates get to 20 but I can’t stand how gross I know it is in my tank). I have well water so no chlorine. Ph is 7.4-7.8ish because I have a driftwood. My gravel definitely has algae but I don’t think most of it is visible, just slimy. Is your experience that cheap plants (Amazon) or plastic plants are harder to maintain than live plants? I used salt to kill ich a couple months ago and my live plants are brownish so maybe salt killed them? Also, I’m enjoying all the algae eaters but my tank can’t seem to make enough algae on the glass to feed them. And would like to get more catfish or a hillstream loach. Am I over cleaning it? I read not to clean the green algae so you don’t spread it in your tank so I’m leaving it for the snail. Would a hillstream loach clean the plants? (One lady I follow said hers did) Or should I try other plants, live or plastic? Sorry for the unorganized long winded thought but wanted to include all my questions. Any advice for making my tank create lots of algae but not cover all my plants would be appreciated. I don’t have tons of money so affordable suggestions are appreciated. Thanks anyone who makes it through my post and has ideas!

[nabokovfan87]

On 5/17/2023 at 8:09 PM, LoveMyPlatys said:

I do like a 40% water change (with gravel vac) every 10ish days to two weeks (because I try to wait a month or until my nitrates get to 20 but I can’t stand how gross I know it is in my tank).

First, welcome to the forums!

The water changes should be good.  You can always take a day and then go ahead and just scrub algae.  It will help dislodge it into the water column and push that into the filter to be easily taken out later.  Depending on what kind of algae you're dealing with, this is a great method to handle the algae.

My second tip / question would be to ask what your light is set to and is it on a timer?  Considering the algae issues you're having and low demand on the plants you likely don't need it set very high at all.  Cutting that back should help with algae as well as the manual cleaning.

As far as how, they use things like steel brushes on hard surfaces for very persistent algae.  You can do bleach dips on decor and that would kill the algae.  If that's something you're interested in I can track a video down for you.  Another common tool is something like a toothbrush (or vegetable scrubbing brush).  Even electric toothbrushes can be used to help for persistent algae.  I use a fish only dish sponge on a lot of my algae.

If you notice a specific piece of decor that is growing much more algae than many other, it may be worth removing it.  It should not be an issue, but I just wanted to mention it as it does happen based on some of the materials used.  Most often the algae is going to go where you have the most light.

On 5/17/2023 at 8:09 PM, LoveMyPlatys said:

I used salt to kill ich a couple months ago and my live plants are brownish so maybe salt killed them?

Very likely, yes.  The plant you mentioned can be sensitive to salt.

Edited May 18, 2023 by nabokovfan87

[FishRBeautiful]

Thanks for taking time to respond!

When I had too much algae, I cut back on the light to little to none. But I’ve been using the light 8-12 hours and it’s still not making any new algae for the fish to eat (or so I fear) so I’ve used algae wafers. I don’t want my fish to starve and I lost 2 catfish for some reason (I’ve had them less than 2 weeks so maybe they were sick but who knows.) The fish don’t eat algae off the plants too much. That’s where I heard hillstream loaches come in. Not sure though. 

99% of the algae on the glass is green algae that the snail eats. I read if you clean it, it releases into the water and may kill all your fish.  It’s from the sun because it’s exactly where the sun shines through the window when I open curtains. Is that the algae that kills fish? You may or may not know. There’s two green algae’s. I think this is green spot? 

i hadn’t thought of steel brushes. Would that harm fragile fake coral? For bleach,  I’m very anti bleach. I’ve bought maybe 10 gallon bottles in my 40 years of life. I’m slightly allergic but sometimes it’s the only way.  I’ve see articles and I’m sure it would work but I’m just not sure I want to risk my fish. The plastic plants start to fall apart in hot water so I’m scared to boil them for sure. 

I should add that I overfeed my fish because I don’t want bottom dwellers to starve. I also have one that never gets fat and she is often so shy, she hides and doesn’t eat until the rest leave. She’s also my favorite that I’ve had the longest. She’s the only fish we’ve name so far. 

[JettsPapa]

Hello,

I'll try to address a few things.  First, you said "But I’ve been using the light 8-12 hours and it’s still not making any new algae for the fish to eat (or so I fear) so I’ve used algae wafers."  I'm a little confused, since you're both talking about how to clean algae, or avoid it, and also about a concern that there isn't enough for your fish.  While the bristlenose pleco will eat algae, the corys are omnivores that need a good amount of protein (and while I haven't kept them I believe the same is true for platys and loaches), so they should be fed something other than algae wafers.  Maybe you are, but algae wafers are the only type of food that I saw mentioned, and corys being algae eaters is a common misconception.

More live plants will likely help with keeping the algae under control.  They will use up some of the nutrients in the water that would otherwise be used by algae.  I keep it under control in my tanks by adding plenty of live plants and restricting light to 8 hours per day.

[FishRBeautiful]

I definitely understand the confusion. What I’m concerned about is that there is not enough algae on surfaces like glass where they do eat but too much on surfaces like fake plants that they do not eat. 

I also thought I posted the following but it didn’t go through.

I should add that I overfeed my fish because I don’t want bottom dwellers to starve. I also have one that never gets fat and she is often so shy, she hides and doesn’t eat until the rest leave. She’s also my favorite that I’ve had the longest. She’s the only fish we’ve name so far. 
 

So I asked the pet store and they said algae wafers are fine. And I assumed my overfeeding and filter that sends food to the bottom worked. Should I get something else for the catfish? The food that gets pushed to the bottom is for omnivores. 

[Miranda Marie]

If you want something that specifically eats the algae on the plants, I'd recommend getting Amano shrimp rather than more fish. Most fish don't really tackle algae that isn't on flat surfaces. The shrimp would eat whatever is growing on the plants while not eating the algae on the tank walls that you want to keep for the fish.

Also, I keep hillstream loaches and have never seen mine eat algae off plants. They barely even eat the hair algae on the big flat rocks LOL. They much prefer the wafers (one every other day) and the leftover fish food that makes its way to the bottom. So I wouldn't necessarily say they'd help the algae problem if you're purposefully overfeeding.

[Guppysnail]

I have several corydora varieties. They primarily carnivores. Here are two good option my kids love. 

 

[FishRBeautiful]

Good to know. I got ghost shrimp in my 5 gallon. I don’t really like them; they remind me of bugs. I’ll probably just have to clean my plants more and find a better way for that issue. Or get real ones. 

Thanks for the Cory food recommendations. I could try sinking Cory food instead of overfeeding so much. It would help. I wonder if that’s what happened to my two Cory’s. Or if they were just bad ones. Not sure. 
 

And I may have read most fish don’t eat hair algae but I can’t recall exactly what it said, but thankfully I don’t think I have that.

[JettsPapa]

On 5/18/2023 at 9:55 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

I definitely understand the confusion. What I’m concerned about is that there is not enough algae on surfaces like glass where they do eat but too much on surfaces like fake plants that they do not eat. 

I'm not aware of any way to have algae in one place and not the other.

On 5/18/2023 at 9:55 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

So I asked the pet store and they said algae wafers are fine. And I assumed my overfeeding and filter that sends food to the bottom worked. Should I get something else for the catfish? The food that gets pushed to the bottom is for omnivores. 

Algae wafers are fine for the pleco, but definitely not for corys.  If you want to target feed them, the two brands in @Guppysnail's post are both good, but they will do just fine on omnivore food that gets past the other fish.  Just make sure there isn't too much.  Overfeeding is one of the biggest causes of problems with water parameters.  If the fish don't eat all the food within 2-3 minutes there's too much.  When in doubt, always feed less.  It's much easier to overfeed than to underfeed.  Many experienced fish keepers recommend fasting fish at least one day each week, and they can go considerably longer without being fed.

I'm not clear on how many corys you have, but the should also be fed sparingly, if you choose to target feed.  For example, for the Xtreme wafers I wouldn't feed a whole one unless you have at least eight, and even then don't do it more than once or twice per week.  For fewer fish the wafers are pretty easy to break into smaller pieces.  If you're concerned about the other fish getting to the wafers before the corys try putting them in the tank after the lights are out.  The catfish are at least somewhat nocturnal, and will find the food even if they can't see it.

[FishRBeautiful]

I don’t think my cories are very nocturnal. They swim all day and hide at night. I had 4 but two left. It’s a 20 gallon. Trying not to overstock but they probably need friends. That’s helpful! Target feeding would prevent me having to vacuum so much food all the time. The algae wafers are just because I don’t want my fish to starve but my pleco doesn’t eat them. He eats the driftwood a lot, and algae off my big rock and gravel. 

My water parameters are pristine. I think the plants and filter do a good job. And the algae eaters help also.

[JettsPapa]

On 5/18/2023 at 11:43 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

I don’t think my cories are very nocturnal. They swim all day and hide at night. I had 4 but two left. It’s a 20 gallon. Trying not to overstock but they probably need friends. That’s helpful! Target feeding would prevent me having to vacuum so much food all the time. The algae wafers are just because I don’t want my fish to starve but my pleco doesn’t eat them. He eats the driftwood a lot, and algae off my big rock and gravel. 

My water parameters are pristine. I think the plants and filter do a good job. And the algae eaters help also.

Maybe nocturnal wasn't the correct word, but they will forage after the lights go out.

[nabokovfan87]

On 5/18/2023 at 5:10 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

When I had too much algae, I cut back on the light to little to none. But I’ve been using the light 8-12 hours and it’s still not making any new algae for the fish to eat (or so I fear) so I’ve used algae wafers. I don’t want my fish to starve and I lost 2 catfish for some reason (I’ve had them less than 2 weeks so maybe they were sick but who knows.) The fish don’t eat algae off the plants too much. That’s where I heard hillstream loaches come in. Not sure though. 

99% of the algae on the glass is green algae that the snail eats. I read if you clean it, it releases into the water and may kill all your fish.

There's definitely a bit of confusion here as I read this....  Let me break down the layers and let's get the key details clarified.

I would suggest by starting here:

Most catfish species are very nocturnal.  They will be a lot more active after the lights are dim and after the lights go out.  Some species as well as individual fish can just be more brave while others are very timid.  You'll almost never see a clown pleco out during the day, same with a lot of the hillstream species, but as soon as the lights go down a little they will instantly pop out and start grazing.  My hillstreams sat on the back glass during the day and I had one that would hide in and around a pleco cave.  If they feel safe, they will be out more, but the main focus here is that a lot of your algae eaters will graze constantly.  Regardless of feeding, you may never see them eat!  Sometimes you will.

Using the light to grow algae for them is a great tip, but do keep in mind that they often ignore algae once it grows in a bit thicker.  Foods like repashy, spirulina, and other omnivore foods are great to supplement them with.  Otos do really well when you have a seasoned tank, but being sure to feed them every few days (almost the same way you care for shrimp) is a good idea.  It gives them the option to get some of those added nutrients and proteins into their diet.

Secondly, when you discussed above the issue of them eating off the glass vs. the plants.  There are plants they will eat on, but they have to be able to support themselves on the leaves.  Otos are very content this way to feed off of larger leaved plants like anubias, S.Repens, ferns, and many other plants.

On 5/18/2023 at 5:10 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

i hadn’t thought of steel brushes. Would that harm fragile fake coral? For bleach,  I’m very anti bleach. I’ve bought maybe 10 gallon bottles in my 40 years of life. I’m slightly allergic but sometimes it’s the only way.  I’ve see articles and I’m sure it would work but I’m just not sure I want to risk my fish. The plastic plants start to fall apart in hot water so I’m scared to boil them for sure. 

I would opt for using those kinds of brushes only on hard surfaces.  Anything delicate definitely can be damaged. 

Given the issue with bleach there are other products you can use in lieu of the bleach.  And yes, please don't boil plastics.  It will cause them to leech chemicals.


 

On 5/18/2023 at 5:10 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

I should add that I overfeed my fish because I don’t want bottom dwellers to starve. I also have one that never gets fat and she is often so shy, she hides and doesn’t eat until the rest leave. She’s also my favorite that I’ve had the longest. She’s the only fish we’ve name so far. 

I feed my tanks once a day.  When I am trying to breed I will feed in the morning and afternoon.  The key being to offer them food, but keep an eye on if they prefer that food, dislike it, or if they just don't want to eat at that time (likely due to light).  You can play with feeding the tank at different times to see if you notice any behavior changes.

On 5/18/2023 at 5:10 AM, LoveMyPlatys said:

It’s from the sun because it’s exactly where the sun shines through the window when I open curtains. Is that the algae that kills fish? You may or may not know. There’s two green algae’s. I think this is green spot? 

It's likely that type of algae yes.   The otos tend to like the brown diatoms and green diatoms algae which GSA would fall into. As it grows it will get long and stringy and they won't touch it.  Scraping the glass once in a while will help them to have that spot for grazing.  You can also add some sort of cover to that side of the tank to block or limit the light.  I use velimax window cling films.  They have black and opaque white.  People use posterboard and other things as well, simply taping them to the tank to help reduce algae issues.

This video might help with how to feed your fish too.

 

[FishRBeautiful]

Wow! This is so helpful and informative. Thanks for taking the time to address my issues. And I do see the cories taking naps often, with their eyes open, during the day.
I imagine anacharis and the plastic plants are too hard to eat off. I’ve thought of getting ottos but if I keep adding algae eating fish to my tank (because I love them so much), it’s eventually going to get overstocked and possibly cause fighting over the algae? And mess up my water parameters.  My cories still need friends. I can see they are lonely. I’m going to read your post in more detail when I have time tonight and then refer to it to help me make decisions. Again, thanks for all your time and info.

[FishRBeautiful]

After looking at your post further and watching the videos, I’m thinking I should play with more types of food, instead of just overfeeding. My filter shoots a lot of food down to the bottom so I almost have to overfeed to be sure Platys get enough. That’s one of the downsides to an HOB filter I guess.
Might consider Otocinclus. They are super cool and could help long term. I’ve found poop and nitrates are easier to clean than algae.

I also have curtains I can close and do sometimes if the sun makes too much algae. (The tank is in my bedroom so closed curtains don’t matter.)

Behaviorally, my fish all seem happy except the cories that hang together but seem to be looking for others. And all my fish hide sometimes but I do have a 4 year old and a cat. It’s feeding time so no one is hiding now. 
 

 

 

 

One more pic

[nabokovfan87]

On 5/18/2023 at 7:39 PM, LoveMyPlatys said:

My filter shoots a lot of food down to the bottom so I almost have to overfeed to be sure Platys get enough. That’s one of the downsides to an HOB filter I guess.

I turn mine off when feeding for 20-30 minutes. I use the kasa timers and the switch buttons.