New Discus Journal

[jwcarlson]

Spawning and only 4" seems a little strange.  If they're growing that much that's good though.  Hope it continues.  Mine were doing about 1/2" per month, maybe a bit more at peak growth.  But that doesn't last too long.

Are you including the tail in the measurement?

Edited March 14 by jwcarlson

[spokanejared]

On 3/14/2024 at 1:19 PM, jwcarlson said:

Spawning and only 4" seems a little strange.  If they're growing that much that's good though.  Hope it continues.  Mine were doing about 1/2" per month, maybe a bit more at peak growth.  But that doesn't last too long.

Are you including the tail in the measurement?

I don't understand what is strange about it? No their bodies are right around 3½ to 4 inches. I had a pair of red covers years back that spawned at 3 inches. 

[jwcarlson]

On 3/14/2024 at 3:30 PM, spokanejared said:

I don't understand what is strange about it? No their bodies are right around 3½ to 4 inches. I had a pair of red covers years back that spawned at 3 inches. 

They shouldn't hit maturity until a year or so, but I know that does vary a bit depending on their sex (males are later than females) and strains as well, I think Blue Diamonds are late bloomers.  Perhaps red covers are early spawners, but a 3" discus should be about 3 months old and shouldn't be spawning and a well cared for discus should be at least 5" at that age (around a year).  But with the hormones they hammer some discus with anymore, anything is possible.  

 

Do you still have the red covers?  How big did they end up or how big are they now?

Pretty much everyone includes the tail in measurements anymore, I know a some time ago they didn't include it, but it gets a little confusing now.  So, your fish are closer to 5" total length, I'd guess.  Which isn't really particularly small for their age, probably.  

Like I said, they look healthy but maybe a tad thin.  I would do a course (three treatments) of levamisole personally.  Especially if you have a feeling that they're not as big as the amount of food they're consuming should be making them which is sounds like might be the case.  They'll probably have a bit of a growth spurt/fattening up after you worm them.  The smallest one I had kind of piddled along not doing as well as the others.  I wormed them and he just ballooned up and know he's probably the thickest fish and one of the biggest overall.  

Edited March 14 by jwcarlson

[spokanejared]

On 3/14/2024 at 1:44 PM, jwcarlson said:

They shouldn't hit maturity until a year or so, but I know that does vary a bit depending on their sex (males are later than females) and strains as well, I think Blue Diamonds are late bloomers.  Perhaps red covers are early spawners, but a 3" discus should be about 3 months old and shouldn't be spawning and a well cared for discus should be at least 5" at that age (around a year).  But with the hormones they hammer some discus with anymore, anything is possible.  

 

Do you still have the red covers?  How big did they end up or how big are they now?

Pretty much everyone includes the tail in measurements anymore, I know a some time ago they didn't include it, but it gets a little confusing now.  So, your fish are closer to 5" total length, I'd guess.  Which isn't really particularly small for their age, probably.  

Like I said, they look healthy but maybe a tad thin.  I would do a course (three treatments) of levamisole personally.  Especially if you have a feeling that they're not as big as the amount of food they're consuming should be making them which is sounds like might be the case.  They'll probably have a bit of a growth spurt/fattening up after you worm them.  The smallest one I had kind of piddled along not doing as well as the others.  I wormed them and he just ballooned up and know he's probably the thickest fish and one of the biggest overall.  

Ok I will do that treatment. Yeah they are close to 5 total. I do in fact think they are a tad thin based on the research I've done but it's confused me since they eat like crazy. My red covers are gone but they bred at 3 inches body length. I had them in a 40 gallon tall planted tank and they went crazy in there. 

[jwcarlson]

Feeling like they should be bigger than they are based on how much they eat is a decent indication that there might be something robbing that nutrition in the gut.  It can be tough to get a handle on parasites in a tank with substrate, but you could move them into something bare bottomed if you have that available.

The red covers look a stunted.  But not wildly so.  Nature is strange. *shrug*

[spokanejared]

On 3/14/2024 at 6:36 PM, jwcarlson said:

Feeling like they should be bigger than they are based on how much they eat is a decent indication that there might be something robbing that nutrition in the gut.  It can be tough to get a handle on parasites in a tank with substrate, but you could move them into something bare bottomed if you have that available.

The red covers look a stunted.  But not wildly so.  Nature is strange. *shrug*

Would they have white poo going on if they had parasites? That's always been my indicator of intestinal issues. They have perfect poop from what I've seen. I'm really wondering if that diet is what's causing my concern. I seem to be the only discus owner not using beefheart. I agree on the red covers being possibly stunted. Theu were at the lfs for quite some time before I got them. 

[jwcarlson]

Not necessarily white poop.  I only had that with hex.  It doesn't have to be a full blown infestation to cause lower level issues.  Parasites are always present at some level and any stress or something like that could cause it to come to the forefront.

You don't need to feed beef heart, there are plenty of people who do not.  But they sure do love it and it packs on size really well.  Again, I would not suggest it with your setup.  It would be a timebomb.  Impossible to keep substrate clean.

[spokanejared]

On 3/14/2024 at 7:48 PM, jwcarlson said:

Not necessarily white poop.  I only had that with hex.  It doesn't have to be a full blown infestation to cause lower level issues.  Parasites are always present at some level and any stress or something like that could cause it to come to the forefront.

You don't need to feed beef heart, there are plenty of people who do not.  But they sure do love it and it packs on size really well.  Again, I would not suggest it with your setup.  It would be a timebomb.  Impossible to keep substrate clean.

Honestly that's exactly why I kept away from it this while time. I still do my waterchanges but I don't want a full blown ammonia spike. Not even kidding my discus female repaired with my blue Cobalt and laid eggs. 

[jwcarlson]

On 3/14/2024 at 10:23 PM, spokanejared said:

Honestly that's exactly why I kept away from it this while time. I still do my waterchanges but I don't want a full blown ammonia spike. Not even kidding my discus female repaired with my blue Cobalt and laid eggs. 

It's really messy and doing it in gravel is just asking for issues.  It's not just parameters, it's overall bacterial load.  You've got way different water than me, so you might be able to get away with a bit more.  But even then, it's going to bite you eventually.  You could maybe put some beef heart into the mix, say... right before you do a WC.  Kind of load them up and then suck everything up.  But unless you're doing WC every day, it will be a mess.  

I made my own beef heart, just 100% beef heart that I trimmed the fat out of and ground my own mix.  

[spokanejared]

On 3/14/2024 at 8:29 PM, jwcarlson said:

It's really messy and doing it in gravel is just asking for issues.  It's not just parameters, it's overall bacterial load.  You've got way different water than me, so you might be able to get away with a bit more.  But even then, it's going to bite you eventually.  You could maybe put some beef heart into the mix, say... right before you do a WC.  Kind of load them up and then suck everything up.  But unless you're doing WC every day, it will be a mess.  

I made my own beef heart, just 100% beef heart that I trimmed the fat out of and ground my own mix.  

Honestly I do 2 water changes a week but I closely monitor my parameters biweekly as well. The second I see nitrates start climbing past 50ppm I'm water changing. I have a really high gh and zero kh in my tank but I have a theory that my old carbon was leeching back into the system so I replaced my carbon and added a bag of crushed coral to help bring up my kh. My tap water tested perfect for kh so I also intend to bump up my water changes but I don't want to change things too fast for obvious reasons hence why I chose the crushed coral since it's a very gradual change to the parameters.