Swamp Sunflower Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Hi all, I just noticed some sort of fungus(?) on the heads of some of my adult neos. I will try to get a picture, but it sort of looks like a pale whitish color in the shape of little ginkgo leaves. These are all cull shrimps but I would still like to save them if possible. Tank: 20 gal long, gravel substrate with some crushed coral, planted with anacharis, water lettuce, guppy grass, salvinia, duckweed and Brazilian pennywort. Some of the plants are in terra cotta pots with Fluval stratum. I recently added some pin oak leaves from my yard, where I do not use any fertilizers or pesticides. Water temp is 80 F. This tank has my aging Betta splendens so I have set up a 5.5 gal, bare bottom hospital tank using tank water for the sick shrimps. Parameters are in the photo below. The meds/additives I have on hand are: -Fritz aquarium salt -Maracyn -Paracleanse -Ich-X -Tetra Lifeguard -SeaChem Stress Guard If anyone has advice or could point me to a thread that might help, I would greatly appreciate it. Please let me know if additional information would be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colu Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 (edited) Can you take a picture of the shrimp if possible it will help with a diagnosis I few thing could to mind scutariella japonica that can cause white stick like growth's on the head or vorticella which looks like fungal or mold growth on the shell of shrimp Edited January 6 by Colu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 @nabokovfan87 @Chick-In-Of-TheSea is this what we were talking on the other day? https://aquariumbreeder.com/shrimp-disease-scutariella-japonica-treatment/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 On 1/6/2024 at 9:03 AM, Shadow said: @nabokovfan87 @Chick-In-Of-TheSea is this what we were talking on the other day? https://aquariumbreeder.com/shrimp-disease-scutariella-japonica-treatment/ We need to see a photo of the issue to say for certain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 6 Author Share Posted January 6 @Colu @Shadow @Chick-In-Of-TheSea I was finally able to get a photo: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 I can’t tell; too blurry. Here is what scutariella japonica looks like. The white thing will wiggle and/or retract and lengthen. You should use a magnifying glass to observe and confirm. @nabokovfan87 do you have any photos? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 On 1/6/2024 at 2:24 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said: I can’t tell; too blurry. Here is what scutariella japonica looks like. The white thing will wiggle and/or retract and lengthen. You should use a magnifying glass to observe and confirm. @nabokovfan87 do you have any photos? There are some in that link I posted...that is the link he dropped on my post. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 6 Author Share Posted January 6 Thanks for the photos, I think scutariella japonica can be ruled out. Here is a sharper/closer photo. I really need to get a macro lens for my phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 (edited) Is this the issue you are referring to? @Biotope Biologist any idea? Seems like an external organism, maybe a polyp of some sort. Edited January 6 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 6 Author Share Posted January 6 (edited) Yes, that is it. It has appeared on a handful of adults and 1 juvenile so far and always on that same area of the body. Edited January 6 by Swamp Sunflower 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 On 1/6/2024 at 4:15 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said: Is this the issue you are referring to? @Biotope Biologist any idea? Seems like an external organism, maybe a polyp of some sort. I think when I read up on it SJ can happen anywhere on the exoskeleton. Maybe vorticella? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/6/2024 at 6:57 PM, Shadow said: I think when I read up on it SJ can happen anywhere on the exoskeleton. Maybe vorticella? It does not look like vorticella or other common shrimp diseases. It seems like some sort of microfauna, similar to hydra, that needs to attach its foot to something for survival. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 (edited) To me, they look a bit like these fungal vesicles. This is from a Texas A&M handbook of shrimp diseases PDF I found through NOAA https://repository.library.noaa.gov/view/noaa/36212/noaa_36212_DS1.pdf Edited January 7 by Swamp Sunflower 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/6/2024 at 6:06 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: This is from a Texas A&M handbook of shrimp diseases PDF I found through NOAA https://repository.library.noaa.gov/view/noaa/36212/noaa_36212_DS1.pdf I'll dig through this. AWESOME find. Thank you for sharing. On 1/6/2024 at 12:43 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: Thanks for the photos, I think scutariella japonica can be ruled out. Here is a sharper/closer photo. I really need to get a macro lens for my phone. *enhance!* It looks like a new one to me. I've seen it before, but it's just not something I am extremely familiar with and I need to dig to find it again. Second thing of note here is that these are Caridina shrimp! This means that there are some things that will be in play that aren't in play for neo shrimp. For basically anything fungal, Salt+Ich-X is a great place to start. I do not recommend anything higher than a 1 tbsp per 5G dose. For ich-X follow the directions on the bottle. So.... let's circle back with type of shrimp, setup, parameters, and verify what all is going on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/5/2024 at 5:17 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: Water temp is 80 F. Just a note that this might be a bit hot for shrimp. 72-74 is a lot more optimal. I understand it's a betta setup. Just something to note. On 1/5/2024 at 5:17 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: I recently added some pin oak leaves from my yard, where I do not use any fertilizers or pesticides. Is there a road nearby? Is there human activity, pets, things walking on the yard regularly? I think this could be a source of the contamination, potentially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 (edited) These are neos but I can see why you thought they were caridina based on that photo. I have never owned caridinas and I think they would die in my water parameters -- I am in a region of the US with extremely hard water. Tank: 20 gal long, gravel substrate with some crushed coral, planted with anacharis, water lettuce, guppy grass, java moss, salvinia, duckweed and Brazilian pennywort. Some of the plants are in terra cotta pots with Fluval stratum. I recently added some pin oak leaves from my yard, where I do not use any fertilizers or pesticides. Water temp is 80 F, I realize that this is a bit hot for neos. Surprisingly, they are breeding pretty prolifically in this tank. There is a photo higher up in the thread of parameters on an ACO test strip. Definitely possible that the oak leaves brought in a contaminant, they fell in a fenced in yard away from the roadway but I do have a dog. I think I will treat with salt + Ich-X and see where that gets me. I really appreciate you helping me troubleshoot! Edited January 7 by Swamp Sunflower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/6/2024 at 7:40 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: These are neos but I can see why you thought they were caridina based on that photo. I have never owned caridinas and I think they would die in my water parameters -- I am in a region of the US with extremely hard water. Yeah! I wasn't sure and they look like some black caridina or something patterned. The first photo looked like neo shrimp, the last one with the "broccoli head" looked caridina-ish to me! I am digging through my stuff trying to find out what this thing might be called or verify with a secondary source from the book provided. On 1/6/2024 at 7:40 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: Water temp is 80 F, I realize that this is a bit hot for neos. They definitely will breed a lot at that temp. It makes things go faster. I mention it off-hand as a concern because maybe it's letting the parasite thrive as well. There are a few studies based on temp where the shrimp are living at 82 degrees, tested hotter, tested cooler. 80-82 is "fine" but it's just not great in the long run. For now, it's perfectly fine and just something to note or keep an eye on going forward with your colony. I'll keep digging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 I just went down to dose and now it has colonized all over the sides of the glass😔 It wasn't like that earlier today, so whatever this is seems to spread quickly and doesn't need to be on an animal. My plan right now is to treat the 20L tank with just Ich-X and the quarantine tank with salt + Ich-X. I also removed all the oak leaves. It might be too late to make a difference, but I figure it can't hurt. I was also thinking of taking the 20L temperature down to 78F. Would you? My betta is my favorite fish and these shrimps are all culls, so I don't want to lower it too much. I think I'll take the quarantine tank down to that 72-74 range you mentioned. I keep my breeding colonies at ~74 and haven't noticed any of them affected. Thanks again for your help. I have been scouring the internet and not having much luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nabokovfan87 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/6/2024 at 6:06 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: Here is a study for this fungus. Lagenidium. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/269701279_A_Fungal_Infection_Caused_by_Lagenidium_sp_and_its_Control_Measures_in_Hatchery_Reared_Shrimp_Larvae_Penaeus_monodon_in_Bangladesh I also found this... might be related, Cladogoniun (ellobiopsidae). Starts one color, ends another color as it grows. https://aquariumbreeder.com/ellobiopsidae-or-cladogonium-ogishimae-green-fungus-in-shrimp-tank/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick-In-Of-TheSea Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 On 1/6/2024 at 9:06 PM, Swamp Sunflower said: To me, they look a bit like these fungal vesicles. This is from a Texas A&M handbook of shrimp diseases PDF I found through NOAA https://repository.library.noaa.gov/view/noaa/36212/noaa_36212_DS1.pdf Item C looks like Eraserhead’s kid. 🤣 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Sunflower Posted January 8 Author Share Posted January 8 The treatment seems to be working! 5 gal quarantine tank (symptomatic individuals) - 1 tablespoon Fritz aquarium salt and 1/2 teaspoon of Ich-X at 75F 20 gal tank - 2 teaspoons of Ich-X at 78F The number of organisms that had colonized the glass of the 20L have been reduced to just a few spots. Only a couple of the QT shrimps still have parasites on their heads. There have been 4 deaths so far, but that is out of hundreds of individuals so I am very pleased. Copernicus (betta splendens) is doing just fine. I'm glad I had the meds on hand (shout out to Cory). Big thanks to everybody on this thread. 🙂 I'll continue to post updates. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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