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Tonina fluviatilis problem


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Hi @Mike K.

Nice looking tank!  What size is it?

First question, how did you determine the nutrient levels?  Especially the Ca, Mg, and Fe.  Did you use test kits or strips?  Or is that just the levels at which nutrients are being dosed?

What specifically are you dosing for nutrients (both macro and micro)?  How much?  How often?

Water changes?

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Hello, tests by drop checkers. Daily dosed salts to hold parameters in the water column. (like adding 1ppm N, 0.2ppm P, 0.15ppm K Daily and K after water change to level of 20+-) using different micros for tests (tropica premium, profito, csmb Daily, changed bottles weekly for check is that micro problem) 30 galons tank. Weekly water changes. What else... Everything seems somewhat okey beside tonina fluviatilis. 

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On 5/17/2022 at 8:57 PM, Mike K. said:

Hello, tests by drop checkers. Daily dosed salts to hold parameters in the water column. (like adding 1ppm N, 0.2ppm P, 0.15ppm K Daily and K after water change to level of 20+-) using different micros for tests (tropica premium, profito, csmb Daily, changed bottles weekly for check is that micro problem) 30 galons tank. Weekly water changes. What else... Everything seems somewhat okey beside tonina fluviatilis. 

Hi @Mike K.

Drop checkers are used to check CO2 levels not nutrient levels.  Are you using any test kits to determine the actual nutrient levels in your tank?  Knowing how may ppm of nutrients you are dosing is nice but it doesn't tell me what is actually what nutrient levels are present in the water column.

Based upon the nutrients you are using I am assuming you are in Europe?  You mentioned what you are using for micro-nutrients.......what are you using for the N, P, and K?

I need the following information to be able to help you further.
pH =
dKH =
dGH =
nitrates (NO3 ppm) =

Actually several plant species in the tank seem to be having issues.  The new growth on the taller background plant (Rotala) appears to be almost white, also the Pogostemon (?) in the right rear.  The leaves of the Tonina fluviatilis show a progression of chlorosis (yellowing) as they mature with small spots of necrosis (holes) developing shortly thereafter.  -Roy
589450670_CARETonina2arrows.jpg.94d158729f8cff0f5abd4a17edf097c7.jpg

 

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On 5/18/2022 at 8:29 AM, Torrey said:

I'm in awe of your tank. Bottom picture, red plant bottom center, what is that?

I'm sure Seattle_Aqarist will help you get your plants healthy, I'm just going to appreciate your tank.😁

IT May be ludwigia mini Sp. Red you are asking of or althernathera rosanervig. (not sure which one you asking of) Maybe add circle around the plant you are interrested in so I can tell you. 🙂

Edited by Mike K.
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On 5/18/2022 at 6:11 PM, Seattle_Aquarist said:

Hi @Mike K.

Drop checkers are used to check CO2 levels not nutrient levels.  Are you using any test kits to determine the actual nutrient levels in your tank?  Knowing how may ppm of nutrients you are dosing is nice but it doesn't tell me what is actually what nutrient levels are present in the water column.

Based upon the nutrients you are using I am assuming you are in Europe?  You mentioned what you are using for micro-nutrients.......what are you using for the N, P, and K?

I need the following information to be able to help you further.
pH =
dKH =
dGH =
nitrates (NO3 ppm) =

Actually several plant species in the tank seem to be having issues.  The new growth on the taller background plant (Rotala) appears to be almost white, also the Pogostemon (?) in the right rear.  The leaves of the Tonina fluviatilis show a progression of chlorosis (yellowing) as they mature with small spots of necrosis (holes) developing shortly thereafter.  -Roy
589450670_CARETonina2arrows.jpg.94d158729f8cff0f5abd4a17edf097c7.jpg

 

My friend thanks and sorry for not immediate reply and missundersnanding. I was few days out from home.

Yes Im using drop checker. 

Yes I agree and saw pogostemon erectus strange color at the upper parts. 

I did increased Fe and micro and It seems to be Little but better on fluviatilis tonine (Photo) what do you think? 

Now I got KH2 and GH 7, ph not measured. 

I had kh 0-1 but increased to 2 by adding NaHCO₃. To not have Co2 levels so unstable. 

Actually I have 10ppm of No3, 1.1ppm of Po4 and 17ppm K. 

I did some plants rotation and put polygonum sao Paulo at the middle back. 

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Hi @Mike K.

Actually I am concerned that there is insufficient available iron (Fe), not too much.  That does not mean that you are not dosing enough iron but some types of iron (there are several the most common type EDTA chelated iron) become less unavailable to plants as the pH increases above about 6.4.  That is why I keep asking you for your pH reading.  Since iron is an immobile nutrient and the problem you are experiencing is with your newest leaves I am suspect that iron is the most likely cause.

The other issue could be insufficient available magnesium which typically causes curled leaf margins and interveinal chlorosis in older leaves but I don't see too many issues with the older leaves on your plants.  -Roy
 

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On 5/20/2022 at 5:43 AM, Mike K. said:

I had kh 0-1 but increased to 2 by adding NaHCO₃. To not have Co2 levels so unstable.

I agree with @Seattle_Aquarist, that said my strategy, if this was me, would be to increase my micro does to .4ppm Fe as proxy (CSMB). I would then add .1ppm Fe DPTA 11% for a total of .5ppm Fe.

I would also discontinue any Na addition and move the tank back to 0dKH. Low KH does not affect CO2 levels nor does the rise and fall of pH. Most plants enjoy lower pH and as such, 0dKH helps here. If you really want to maintain a higher KH, I'd recommend potassium carbonate vs any sodium addition.

I would also lower GH to 5dGH at most and 3.5dGH at the low-end. Personally, I've found 4:1 and 3:1 Ca:Mg to work better than 2:1. 

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Thanks for reply. Well Im Using micro fert with FE  (EDTA) and addition of 13% Fe HEEDTA helate. I INCREASED the doses Just some days ago so Maybe plants not fully reacted yet. Daily dose od Fe is around 0.7ppm. It gives 0.49 weekly. 

I See Mmiller dislikes my experiment with sodium to raise kh xD first time I did that cause I red kh is ph buffer which is unstable with kh 0. 

I had 4:1 ca:mg ratio before, but due to some experiments I get 2:1. I need to tell you im curious Why you all prefer gh 5 and lower 😛 in my country Poland (Europe) the planted tanks mostly are at gh 8 and people here Recommend it as the best.

As you See I like experiment some 😛

The WRGB light I did myself also 😛 and cover from foamed PCV. :P, 

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