Thoughts on adding Angels

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

My main display is a 45 g tall (36x12x24). It’s main inhabitants are a large male festivum, a large female 3 spot pearl gourami, hoards of tetras and a breeding colony of 7 BN plecos and 5 aneaus corys. The smallest tetras are green neons who stay with the hoard and are over a year and a half old, the largest are diamond tetras who are getting to a full 2-3”. 
I over filter this tank - Eheim 2217, Ziss biobubbler, and a penguin 400. I’m probably changing out the penguin for another Eheim or Fluval equivalent soon. 
Substrate is stratum, 3 large Amazon swords, large dwarf tiger lotus, large Crinum and a large piece of wood vertically and horizontally.tons of Java fern, bolbitis, crypts etc.  
So after burying the headline I am going to The Wet Spot tomorrow. I’ve heard that they have a pair of nearly full grown Peruvian angels not Altums just angels.

Thank you to Pinterest for this photo. My understanding is these are most likely a Rio Nanay variant, not Manacaparu or Altum. 

I’ve kind of dreamed about owning angels my whole life. I’ve had many excuses as to why I haven’t bought them but I think I need these fish. Lately my main problem/ reason/excuse for not getting them was I’d have to buy 5-7 youngsters and then whittle them down to 1 pair.  Well this is a pair. No whittling just managing their eventual breeding aggression which with the sight breaks and hard scape I think it’s manageable.

How the Festivum Spikey Feathers and the 3 spot gourami will react is another consideration. In the wild festivums and angels are found together and when you look up tank mates for each of them you find the other. I honestly don’t have another tank for them. If I get these angels (and at this price they’re an investment) I would need to consider making changes ie rehoming or finally getting some 40 breeders for the garage. I’m really liking that idea!I do have some 30 g totes and cycled filters I could use in a pinch as well. 

#1 thought I’d had was to do a hard scape redesign moving the wood a bit to change the space and cause a little imbalance with the dominant fish to allow the angels to settle in. That and feeding heavy with lots of water changes which I’ve been doing anyway. 
 So I guess I’m asking my Nerm family to help me decide to take a big leap or talk me off the edge. 

[2000tetras]

I own wild Rio Nanay Angels. Thr picture you posted is a rio nanay angel. Most wild angels imported from Peru are Rio Nanay. The easy tells are:

Yellow (not red) eyes

Their bodies will look more goldish than silver and will have yellow spots

Pinkish tails

Intense blue iridescence on gill plates in proper lighting

they should be 2x tall as they are long.
 

I would get 3 for a 45 tall but keep the temp at around 72-74 degrees most of the time to reduce aggression. I would re-home flag cicclid and gourami as they will distract from the angelfishes as the centerpieces. A black background on your tank will help them pop.

Most important thing with Rio Nanay is to get lighting right to get constant iridescent blue on gill plates  and ventral fins so they look like they are glowing. This requires a dimmer brightness with enough blue to be reflected. Here is a video example showing what I mean. 

They will eat your green neon tetras. 
Good luck

Edited December 27, 2021 by 2000tetras

[anewbie]

I'm not sure i would get three - unless they are the same sex; chances are pretty good with 3 you will have 1 male and 1 female and one odd duck who will get beat up. 

 

On temp I'm not sure about these specific fish and you should check with wetspot; but generally speaking wild angels expect the temp to be above 80 and if these are from warmer regions 72-74 would be unhealthy long term.

Edited December 27, 2021 by anewbie

[Siett88]

The green neons are likely to be eaten, especially if you are adding full grown (and wild caught) angels. But if they're surviving the festivum, they might be ok.

That being said, I totally get the appeal of angelfish. Those pics are beautiful. I am trying to talk myself out of getting one for my 75 that has ember tetras as I don't want to have to fight through hundreds of plants to catch out...

[anewbie]

On 12/27/2021 at 9:44 AM, Siett88 said:

The green neons are likely to be eaten, especially if you are adding full grown (and wild caught) angels. But if they're surviving the festivum, they might be ok.

That being said, I totally get the appeal of angelfish. Those pics are beautiful. I am trying to talk myself out of getting one for my 75 that has ember tetras as I don't want to have to fight through hundreds of plants to catch out...

Good catch - yes it is nearly 100% they will eat the green neon; even larger cardinals are at risk of being eaten by adult angels.

[2000tetras]

This is not true. The waters they are in go down to 60F at night. Most of my Angels are wild or F1 and I keep them in the low 70s. In one of Cory's videos about fish keeping secrets he recommends the same thing because they are far more peaceful in the low 70s than they are at 80< when they are in breeding mode.

Edited December 27, 2021 by 2000tetras

[Prochaska]

Adding a full grown angel let alone a wild one to an already established community tank could be an issue imo and ime, especially with the tetras you have.

I had a full size mature wild angel that literally ate everything smaller than him. Rasboras, barbs, tetras and even corydoras. It honestly blew my mind because I have kept A LOT of angels over a very long time and never had one that aggressive and it was wild to watch him go after and eat fish 2.5"+

I've also never had Angels, Festivums or Gouramis get along. They all always wanted to be the bigger, flashy, trailer show fish over the other "look a likes" 

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

Well thank you all for the input. I decided on an Electric Blue Acara and a couple sweet larger rare crypts. Appreciate the Nerm Hivemind!