Schooling Fish Issue, need the schools advice.

[RogueAquarium]

Let's get the sad part out of the way first, I FINALLY got a pair of fish I had been wanting for a long time. 1 male and 1 female Pseudomugil Luminatus.  They are supposed to be in schools of at least 6, but my local store only had those 2, so I got them. It's been 3 days now, in a 2 year established planted 10G tank with a colony of Neocardinia shrimp, 3 nerite snails and 5 pygmy cory I tossed in as a hopeful known peaceful schooling fish that might help them feel less alone without a school and thus less stressed out.


Well, 4 hours ago I checked in and did feedings, everybody seemed to be doing fine, boy was flipping his little pom-pom flippers around happily, so I vacuumed out the remains of an algae wafer the cory didn't eat and went about cleaning my office/fishroom and setting up a new rack and a couple of new tanks.

Turned around about 20 min ago, male was belly up, all color gone, dead. Got him out and into a bag/fridge to preserve for diagnosis/return (that's the most I have ever spent on fish... I want more now) but what do I do for the female in the mean time? I'm worried by what I view as potential missing scales on the male that make me suspect the pygmy's could potentially not be as peaceful as they are made out to be?

Tested water, and I did have a bit of an ammonia spike from that algae wafer, but it was nothing horrendous (between .25 and .5) and the female still seems fine...... nothing else is out of whack water wise that I can test for, so IDK what to think....

 Should I move the female over to one of my guppy tanks for now just so she has somebody to school with, or would the male guppy's give her too many problems? 

Any and all help appreciated

 

Edited July 6, 2021 by RogueAquarium

[Bobbie]

Did you quarantine or medicate any of the fish before mixing them?

It could just be that you got a fish that already had something dormant in it’s system, and the stress of the new environment let the disease take over - or maybe one of the other fish were carrying stuff that they’re immune to but the wee fella wasn’t. 
 

Also how long did you leave them to assimilate before adding them to the tank? It could be that they water they came in was very different from your current water, and his body couldn’t cope with the change. 
 

Oh and you said the tank was established, but are the corycats and the forktails both new fish or have the corycats been in there for a while? If the tank was only used to dealing with the waste from some shrimp & snails, then adding too many fish too quickly could’ve easily overloaded the filter. 

Edited July 6, 2021 by Bobbie

[Fish Folk]

On 7/6/2021 at 5:02 AM, RogueAquarium said:

Let's get the sad part out of the way first, I FINALLY got a pair of fish I had been wanting for a long time. 1 male and 1 female Pseudomugil Luminatus.  They are supposed to be in schools of at least 6, but my local store only had those 2, so I got them. It's been 3 days now, in a 2 year established planted 10G tank with a colony of Neocardinia shrimp, 3 nerite snails and 5 pygmy cory I tossed in as a hopeful known peaceful schooling fish that might help them feel less alone without a school and thus less stressed out.


Well, 4 hours ago I checked in and did feedings, everybody seemed to be doing fine, boy was flipping his little pom-pom flippers around happily, so I vacuumed out the remains of an algae wafer the cory didn't eat and went about cleaning my office/fishroom and setting up a new rack and a couple of new tanks.

Turned around about 20 min ago, male was belly up, all color gone, dead. Got him out and into a bag/fridge to preserve for diagnosis/return (that's the most I have ever spent on fish... I want more now) but what do I do for the female in the mean time? I'm worried by what I view as potential missing scales on the male that make me suspect the pygmy's could potentially not be as peaceful as they are made out to be?

Tested water, and I did have a bit of an ammonia spike from that algae wafer, but it was nothing horrendous (between .25 and .5) and the female still seems fine...... nothing else is out of whack water wise that I can test for, so IDK what to think....

 Should I move the female over to one of my guppy tanks for now just so she has somebody to school with, or would the male guppy's give her too many problems? 

Any and all help appreciated

 

Aw bummer... this has happened to just about everyone at some point. Hang in there!

I think it’s unlikely that the corys are responsible for injuries. And I doubt that having just the two fish versus a school would matter that much at the outset. My guess is that one of two things happened: either (1) he was sick when you got him, or (2) something in your water did not agree with him. You’d need to share a comprehensive parameter run down for me to diagnose...

tank size?

temp?

filtration & flow?

plants?

pH?

Ammonia?

Nitrite?

Nitrate?

KH?

GH?

[Fish Folk]

On 7/6/2021 at 7:39 AM, Bobbie said:

Did you quarantine or medicate any of the fish before mixing them?

It could just be that you got a fish that already had something dormant in it’s system, and the stress of the new environment let the disease take over - or maybe one of the other fish were carrying stuff that they’re immune to but the wee fella wasn’t. 
 

Also how long did you leave them to assimilate before adding them to the tank? It could be that they water they came in was very different from your current water, and his body couldn’t cope with the change. 

^exactly^

[RogueAquarium]

Must have been the "overload" I suppose. The tank HAD been home to a very large and slow beta (and snails and shrimp) before the Cory and rainbow. I moved him over to a new tank specifically built for him the day before I got the Rainbow and Cory. And this tank WAS supposed to be their quarantine tank. Didn't think anything they potentially had would bother the inverts, or vis-versa, and it's the closest to my desk and easiest to observe for anything going wrong.

Tank size 10 G

Temp 79 

Filter/Flow: It's a 2 arm sponge filter with a media ball container on each arm. It's built to filter "up to 55 Gal". I have one of those 50 gal air pumps that have 2 output's. It has one output hose dedicated to it. The flow is extremely minimal, which is what I was told these fish need (they are swamp dwellers)

Plants: Amazon Sword, Couple of small crypts, a tiger lotus, some "4 leaf clover" that is finally starting to spread, and a couple of moss balls.

ph: 7.4

Ammonia: When I tested after pulling him out I had a spike up between .25 and .5. That has gone this morning. I SUSPECT it's from an algae wafer the Cory didn't touch that I t didn't see until it was all come apart. 

Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: it hovers around 5 ppm

KH: haven't run the test after it passed, but my tank generally runs about 6 dKH

GH: Also didn't test this today, but it generally hovers around 100-200 ppm, and I have to reason to suspect this. Ill run these tests if asked, but I don't think that had anything to do with it.
 

Edited July 6, 2021 by RogueAquarium

[RogueAquarium]

As far as assimilation time (by which I think you mean "how long did I float the bag") They where in there for about an hour before I did the ole "pour them into a net over a bucket" trick to get them in.  Both the Cory and the Rainbow where new to the tank at the same ish time (The cory went in about a half hour later, if that matters)

[Fish Folk]

On 7/6/2021 at 12:27 PM, RogueAquarium said:

Must have been the "overload" I suppose. The tank HAD been home to a very large and slow beta (and snails and shrimp) before the Cory and rainbow. I moved him over to a new tank specifically built for him the day before I got the Rainbow and Cory. And this tank WAS supposed to be their quarantine tank. Didn't think anything they potentially had would bother the inverts, or vis-versa, and it's the closest to my desk and easiest to observe for anything going wrong.

Tank size 10 G

Temp 79 

Filter/Flow: It's a 2 arm sponge filter with a media ball container on each arm. It's built to filter "up to 55 Gal". I have one of those 50 gal air pumps that have 2 output's. It has one output hose dedicated to it. The flow is extremely minimal, which is what I was told these fish need (they are swamp dwellers)

Plants: Amazon Sword, Couple of small crypts, a tiger lotus, some "4 leaf clover" that is finally starting to spread, and a couple of moss balls.

ph: 7.4

Ammonia: When I tested after pulling him out I had a spike up between .25 and .5. That has gone this morning. I SUSPECT it's from an algae wafer the Cory didn't touch that I t didn't see until it was all come apart. 

Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: it hovers around 5 ppm

KH: haven't run the test after it passed, but my tank generally runs about 6 dKH

GH: Also didn't test this today, but it generally hovers around 100-200 ppm, and I have to reason to suspect this. Ill run these tests if asked, but I don't think that had anything to do with it.
 

Sounds like a well-kept aquarium. Sometimes fish just do not adjust. Again, sorry about your loss. 

[Brackon]

Did you ask any questions about those particular fish at the store?

I typically frequent my local stores enough to know what is new but a few questions might be; are they eating, how long have they been in the store, any medication, were there more and they died or were bought and if so have those people reported their fish are fine. Stuff like that is useful just so you know what type of fish you are getting into.

It sounds like everything was fine though and you just got unlucky and got a stressed out fish 

[RogueAquarium]

So, all of this is great, and I am glad to hear it probably wasn't negligence that killed the poor thing (always good to hear)

But I still need advice on what to do with the girl. She is all alone now. I have 2 (about to be 3) tanks of a guppy breeding program I could toss her in with to school with, but I am worried the male guppies might bother her more than it's worth. Anybody have any opinions on that?

She's still in with the Cory for now. I notice she is trying to stay near them. This whole thing just makes me incredibly sad.


Additional question. Aquatic Arts seems to be the only online retailer who has them in stock. I have never ordered fish online before, Do they have a reputation (good or bad)?

[GameCzar]

I can sympathize with fish loss and being puzzled over what I did wrong.   Being here with more experienced aqua-buddies has taught me it happens to everyone.   

I believe the rules of the forum forbid discussing specific merchants beyond aquarium co-op, or AquaHuna.  @RogueAquarium

[RogueAquarium]

On 7/6/2021 at 11:40 AM, GameCzar said:

I can sympathize with fish loss and being puzzled over what I did wrong.   Being here with more experienced aqua-buddies has taught me it happens to everyone.   

I believe the rules of the forum forbid discussing specific merchants beyond aquarium co-op, or AquaHuna.  @RogueAquarium

Checked AquaHuna. They have them, but they aren't in stock :( 

not sure why I asked though, because if it's the only place I can find them I'm kinda stuck. I can either chance it or chance the girl stressing her self to death before my local store can get more in.