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Need advice on new set up.


Potterygal
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3 weeks ago I began cycling a new 10 gal planted tank also with spiderwood. I asked this forum for advice when I got a big brown algae outbreak. I got good advice here on all that. 

Well, it’s cycled according to many tests however a new issue has appeared. Many little white ( approx 1/8” or smaller) worms crawling all over glass. I took the one nerite snail out of the tank and put it in a small tank I’ve had going. Done much reading and I’m guess these are Planaria?????  They are not big enough to plainly see the triangle head shape. Maybe they got in from the big rock I weighted the spiderwood with?? I washed it very well with lots of hot water.

so I have Expel P on the way from ACoop. Does this sound possible? I’d like to deworm the tank BEFORE i add some shrimp and then later some chili rasboras. I tried to photograph them but too small. They are white colored. I do not see them IN water column.

is Expel P the best treatment since I’m not treating actual  fish/ shrimp at this point? Should I put the snail back in for the treatment time??? I also see some tiny dot sized critters flitting around in water column. SHEESE!

sorry so long, just trying to give detail. 

Edited by Potterygal
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Sounds like detritus worms. Those along with the seed shrimp/cyclops/whatever the little critters in the water column are, are all a good sign that the tank is coming alive, which is exactly what you want. 
 

Personally, I wouldn’t medicate the tank. Those are all just great fish snacks. 
 

I’ve had confirmed planaria once, at it was super easy to spot the triangle head on them. 

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Detritus worms are possible before fish are added? One snail had been in tank only about 10 days. I have not spotted the white crawlers on substrate. These look like very tiny slugs. How big are planaria? All photos I look up are laboratory views with no context.

thank you and I’ll hold off meds until certain. 

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In my experience, yes, worms can be present before fish. It’s not like the detritus worms come from the fish or anything like that. To me it just seems like your tank is coming alive. Once you put fish in there they will munch on the snacks and you probably won’t notice many more detritus worms or seed shrimp. 
 

The confirmed planaria I had were decently big. It was obvious what they were. No second guessing. They popped up in a shrimp tank after I moved out the only fish in there. It was a Pygmy Cory that was hatched and raised in the tank. I think I didn’t see any prior to the fish being removed as they were eating them. Remove the fish, no more predators, so then I was able to see them. 

Edited by AllFishNoBrakes
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I’ve determined these are planaria so I plan to use the Expel P after all. I want to have a snail / some shrimp when I stock( tank now empty of fish/ anything else) and Planaria seem deadly to snail/ shrimp. 
I see nothing that looks like round detritus worms- only these flat white long things on the glass. 
I should get meds today in mail. 
 

Should I put the new plants in also getting today in the tank to “ treat “ them today? 
my gut says yes but would like others views.

ps- pretty sure the planaria came in with some pond water lettuce I ordered and broke off some 1” babies to float in tank. I’d rinsed but now well enuf apparently. 

what’s your Fave “ New plant Cleansing”

formula??? Many thanks. I cannot capture pic of them on glass but here’s the set up regardless. image.jpg.bfb639fb424b153fd203863811e7d63f.jpg

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On 6/12/2024 at 11:16 AM, Potterygal said:

I’ve determined these are planaria so I plan to use the Expel P after all. I want to have a snail / some shrimp when I stock( tank now empty of fish/ anything else) and Planaria seem deadly to snail/ shrimp. 
I see nothing that looks like round detritus worms- only these flat white long things on the glass. 
I should get meds today in mail. 
 

Should I put the new plants in also getting today in the tank to “ treat “ them today? 
my gut says yes but would like others views.

ps- pretty sure the planaria came in with some pond water lettuce I ordered and broke off some 1” babies to float in tank. I’d rinsed but now well enuf apparently. 

what’s your Fave “ New plant Cleansing”

formula??? Many thanks. I cannot capture pic of them on glass but here’s the set up regardless. image.jpg.bfb639fb424b153fd203863811e7d63f.jpg

Reverse respiration is a method of using ordinary seltzer water to kill basically anythig eccept for vascular plants: 

https://reverserespiration.com/

(A lot of us here are something like evangelists for it.)

If you want to quarantine your plants (or sterilize hardscape, equipment, substrate, or whatever else you've got), reverse respiration is hard to beat.

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Wow, who knew!! Wish I’d learned this about a month ago/ fewer headaches for sure now! 
I’ll do this method now on with additions of plants. 
Thank you!

maybe I should buy 10 gallons of seltzer and do the whole tank. I guess that would totally undo the cycling I’ve accomplished however. Duh

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On 6/12/2024 at 1:26 PM, Potterygal said:

Wow, who knew!! Wish I’d learned this about a month ago/ fewer headaches for sure now! 
I’ll do this method now on with additions of plants. 
Thank you!

maybe I should buy 10 gallons of seltzer and do the whole tank. I guess that would totally undo the cycling I’ve accomplished however. Duh

Yes, you could do the whole tank with reverse respiration, but yes, it would wipe out your beneficial bacteria, too, and you'd be restarting your cycle/tank seasoning. And anyway if you really wanted to start over, you could pull everything out and use reverse respiration and/or sunlight/drying out, then wipe the now-empy tank down with vinegar or hydrogen peroxide, which would be quicker and cheaper.

To be clear, I think that would be overkill (no pun intended), but you could do it.

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Well I plan to do the Expel P when it arrives. AquarCoop said ExpelP will not harm the beneficial bacteria. Too bad these planaria got in but I learned a lesson . A week ago I had not even heard of planaria. Mine are all tiny still so hopefully the treatment will be very effective. 
 

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Planaria are extremely easy to identify, due to their motion.  They will just smoooothly glide across the surface of the glass like magic, with no visible form of locomotion, ie no twisting or snaking, no inching, nothing.  They just "go".   This is the flatworm way.   I'm not sure how they swim in the water column, I've only ever seen them on a surface.

Detritus worms will typically twist and spin if in the water column because they cant usually swim with any efficiency at all, lots of times they make a S shape back and forth, that doesn't really get them anywhere.  Once on a surface, they will move like snakes or earthworms, and often they will end up partially burrowed with their heads poking out.  

Leeches, if you get them, do the inch-worm thing when moving on a surface.  And when free-swimming in the water column, they swim like sea-snakes with big undulating S waves that rapidly move them forward.  On surfaces, they can also hang on with sucker on the back end, and stretch waaaay out with their entire body and wave their head around waiting to latch onto prey.  Note that they dont do this partially burrowed, like detritus and other roundworms, its almost always all or nothing.   The leech wants to bump into something, whereas the other worms want to be able to quickly retract to safety.

Edited by daggaz
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Even if there are planaria what is the problem? Not all planaria are harmful and their numbers would be controlled by adding fish. There's no need to use medicine on a tank that is having no problems just because a forum post says planaria are bad. Usually planaria are only a problem in shrimp only tanks where there is no predatory pressure on their numbers. 

Your tank is alive and this is good! Many of the creatures you're seeing now are exploding in number because no one is around to eat them. Once you add fish there will be a better balance of prey and most of these little creatures will hide in the substrate during the day and only come out at night and you will hardly see them again. 

 

Again most of the problems people have with worms and planaria and leeches and scuds are in shrimp and snail tanks that lack predators to control their numbers. 

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