Aquarium Light Help

[miketoms21]

I have a 10 gallon tank with Vallisneria and one amazon sword, I seem to struggle with the vallisneria not growing tall, though I get many runners, they stay pretty short. I use easy green liquid Fert and some root tabs that are not from ACO. I am starting to wonder if it is the light? I typically just turn the light on in the morning and turn it off at night before bed. I have this 18-24in Nicrew light from Amazon, do I need a better or different light? if its not the light can anyone offer some advice as to why I feel like my vallisneria is not growing well? TIA

link to my current light https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08SCBLN8L/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1

[anodyne99]

I don't have any advice, but I have the same thing happening, lots of runners but the taller plants don't seem to be doing well or are outright fading and being eaten by snails. I have heard that some plants may focus energy on sending out runners before they focus on growing tall, but I don't know whether to trust that. I hope someone will chime in with more experience with this plant. This is my second try, last time I think I gave up too soon. 

[Whitecloud09]

On 5/6/2024 at 6:41 PM, miketoms21 said:

I have a 10 gallon tank with Vallisneria and one amazon sword, I seem to struggle with the vallisneria not growing tall, though I get many runners, they stay pretty short. I use easy green liquid Fert and some root tabs that are not from ACO. I am starting to wonder if it is the light? I typically just turn the light on in the morning and turn it off at night before bed. I have this 18-24in Nicrew light from Amazon, do I need a better or different light? if its not the light can anyone offer some advice as to why I feel like my vallisneria is not growing well? TIA

link to my current light https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08SCBLN8L/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1

I dont have any experince with this plant, but i know possibly the problem. How bright is your light? Is it considered a high low medium light? Is it new to the tank?

Those are some Qs i would like to see you answer please first, before i start throwing out ideas. @miketoms21. @anodyne99.  

Another thing, how long is your light on because Vallisneria can grow under a wide range of lighting conditions, but moderate to bright light is the best if you want good  growth. Providing 8 to 10 hours of light per day will help it grow taller and you wont have a lot of extra  excessive algae growth.

[anodyne99]

On 5/7/2024 at 4:41 AM, Whitecloud09 said:

I dont have any experince with this plant, but i know possibly the problem. How bright is your light? Is it considered a high low medium light? Is it new to the tank?

Those are some Qs i would like to see you answer please first, before i start throwing out ideas. @miketoms21. @anodyne99.  

Another thing, how long is your light on because Vallisneria can grow under a wide range of lighting conditions, but moderate to bright light is the best if you want good  growth. Providing 8 to 10 hours of light per day will help it grow taller and you wont have a lot of extra  excessive algae growth.

Thanks Whitecloud09! Can you tell me how I would know whether a light is considered high, medium or low on my tank? Of course the manufacturer sold it as "super bright!", and it looks bright to me,  but I'm not sure I trust that to be true by anyone else's standards!

[miketoms21]

On 5/7/2024 at 7:41 AM, Whitecloud09 said:

I dont have any experince with this plant, but i know possibly the problem. How bright is your light? Is it considered a high low medium light? Is it new to the tank?

Those are some Qs i would like to see you answer please first, before i start throwing out ideas. @miketoms21. @anodyne99.  

Another thing, how long is your light on because Vallisneria can grow under a wide range of lighting conditions, but moderate to bright light is the best if you want good  growth. Providing 8 to 10 hours of light per day will help it grow taller and you wont have a lot of extra  excessive algae growth.

I have to say the same as @anodyne99 I keep on the brightest setting when it is on for about 8-12 hrs a day. Had the light for almost a year and the initial val bunch I had did very well but after i had to move locations twice and I trimmed them once as well due to them reaching water line. Since then they grown a little but seemed to stagnant. Was thinking they just maybe needed time? I linked the light I have in the original post, so maybe you could tell if it’s considered high, moderate or low light? Is it also possible that I am just overthinking all the factors and simply just need to wait longer for them to take off? Thanks in advance

[Whitecloud09]

On 5/7/2024 at 5:52 PM, anodyne99 said:

Thanks Whitecloud09! Can you tell me how I would know whether a light is considered high, medium or low on my tank? Of course the manufacturer sold it as "super bright!", and it looks bright to me,  but I'm not sure I trust that to be true by anyone else's standards!

Could I see a picture of the tank light and the plants and in general your tank? Because usually 0.5 watts  can be described as medium light. Some ground-covering plants or stem plants do well in medium  light. 1 watt per liter or more = a high light aquarium. A picture would be huge if possible @anodyne99. 

 

On 5/7/2024 at 7:39 PM, miketoms21 said:

I have to say the same as @anodyne99 I keep on the brightest setting when it is on for about 8-12 hrs a day. Had the light for almost a year and the initial val bunch I had did very well but after i had to move locations twice and I trimmed them once as well due to them reaching water line. Since then they grown a little but seemed to stagnant. Was thinking they just maybe needed time? I linked the light I have in the original post, so maybe you could tell if it’s considered high, moderate or low light? Is it also possible that I am just overthinking all the factors and simply just need to wait longer for them to take off? Thanks in advance

Might need time, I will look at the picture. Are your water paremeters staying stable? Like ph and nitrates. Also do you do root tabs and liquid ferts? Do you have a timer in the tank? 12 hours is kinda long, but does not have anything to do with this situation at the moment.

Goodness, 14 watts! Wow, that’s bright, could I see a picture if possible of your tank and the brightness of it? That helps maybe more than you think.

[gardenman]

Watts aren't a terribly accurate way of measuring light output with LEDs but fourteen watts in a ten-gallon tank isn't excessive. The Aquarium Coop 20" light consumes 22 watts and the 18" Hygger I have on my ten-gallon consumes 26 watts. It's more how the LEDs use the wattage that matters. Some produce more light and less heat. Some produce more heat and less light. Some divert some of the wattage to a timer. My Hygger puts out 1290 lumens while the Coop light puts out a reported 1800 lumens. (Bear in mind my Hygger is 18" to Coop's 20".) I opted for the Hygger as I like a whiter light (6500K) to the more yellow light of the Coop's light (5700K). And it was less than half the price ($44-$110) and I won't be using my light as a hammer, so durability isn't as much of an issue. The Hygger PAR rating in 12" of air is just 77 while the Coop's light has a reported 177 PAR. So, despite my light using more watts, there's an apparent lesser light output. High-light plants want a 40-50 PAR so either light is fine in that regard. Though PAR readings through water will be less than PAR readings through air.

I tend to find that plants grow how they want to grow, and we have little say in the matter. If a plant isn't getting enough light it'll tend to get leggier and reach for the light. If it's getting enough light it'll tend to stay more compact, bushier, and spread more. I have dwarf sag and dwarf hairgrass in my tank that's maybe an inch tall, but nearly covering the whole bottom of the tank. I see other tanks with those plants and they're two, three, or more inches tall, but not covering the whole bottom of the tank. I wanted both plants as a carpeting plant so they're growing perfectly for me. If I reduced the light, they might grow taller, reaching for the light, but not spreading as much as quickly. If my plants are happy, spreading, and looking good, that's all I care about. They'll grow how they want to grow. 

 

[gabdewulf]

Is the plant from a short family of val?

[Whitecloud09]

On 5/8/2024 at 8:35 AM, gardenman said:

Watts aren't a terribly accurate way of measuring light output with LEDs but fourteen watts in a ten-gallon tank isn't excessive. The Aquarium Coop 20" light consumes 22 watts and the 18" Hygger I have on my ten-gallon consumes 26 watts. It's more how the LEDs use the wattage that matters. Some produce more light and less heat. Some produce more heat and less light. Some divert some of the wattage to a timer. My Hygger puts out 1290 lumens while the Coop light puts out a reported 1800 lumens. (Bear in mind my Hygger is 18" to Coop's 20".) I opted for the Hygger as I like a whiter light (6500K) to the more yellow light of the Coop's light (5700K). And it was less than half the price ($44-$110) and I won't be using my light as a hammer, so durability isn't as much of an issue. The Hygger PAR rating in 12" of air is just 77 while the Coop's light has a reported 177 PAR. So, despite my light using more watts, there's an apparent lesser light output. High-light plants want a 40-50 PAR so either light is fine in that regard. Though PAR readings through water will be less than PAR readings through air.

I tend to find that plants grow how they want to grow, and we have little say in the matter. If a plant isn't getting enough light it'll tend to get leggier and reach for the light. If it's getting enough light it'll tend to stay more compact, bushier, and spread more. I have dwarf sag and dwarf hairgrass in my tank that's maybe an inch tall, but nearly covering the whole bottom of the tank. I see other tanks with those plants and they're two, three, or more inches tall, but not covering the whole bottom of the tank. I wanted both plants as a carpeting plant so they're growing perfectly for me. If I reduced the light, they might grow taller, reaching for the light, but not spreading as much as quickly. If my plants are happy, spreading, and looking good, that's all I care about. They'll grow how they want to grow. 

 

Very knowledgeable @gardenman. I appreciate someone who makes sense and has tons of info. @gabdewulf put out another great Q as well. There is variations of this plant i see.

 

On 5/8/2024 at 9:11 AM, gabdewulf said:

Is the plant from a short family of val?

 

[Cory]

Do you have a picture of your tank? I couldn't find any PAR specs on the amazon listing.  We've tried to make this as easy as possible by listing PAR recommendations on our plants and having PAR values for our light. As well as recommended dosing with easy green based on PAR value. https://www.aquariumcoop.com/products/aquarium-co-op-easy-plant-led

You could totally have enough light with your current light and something else is the problem. As you initially posted, you've got fertilizers, and you've got light, co2 would be another one. But Most often we find it's light.

Also highly recommended that you have your light on a timer to prevent algae problems.

[Whitecloud09]

Whoops, I read past the fertilizer part, Corys right, light can be a problem if you don’t have a timer, and if it’s random from 8-12 per day that could be an issue.

 

[miketoms21]

On 5/8/2024 at 1:43 PM, Cory said:

Do you have a picture of your tank? I couldn't find any PAR specs on the amazon listing.  We've tried to make this as easy as possible by listing PAR recommendations on our plants and having PAR values for our light. As well as recommended dosing with easy green based on PAR value. https://www.aquariumcoop.com/products/aquarium-co-op-easy-plant-led

You could totally have enough light with your current light and something else is the problem. As you initially posted, you've got fertilizers, and you've got light, co2 would be another one. But Most often we find it's light.

Also highly recommended that you have your light on a timer to prevent algae problems.

Thank you for the reply Cory! So I was in the middle of moving when I posted this initially. I had to take down the tank and when I set it up again I decided to switch to sand substrate instead of the black aquarium gravel I had, so I just kept the few tallest val that I had and the sword plant to clear out the mess of tiny Val runners I had going. I am going to give some time for the plants to adapt to the new substrate and will reach out if things do not change. 

I had the tank set up in the new house with the new sand for a little over a week, but I feel like my plants are getting worse (starting to blacken and look awful), could this be part of the adaptation period and I just need to let time do its thing? I am worried that the sand I got is too fine and the roots are not doing well for either plant (here is the sand I used https://www.amazon.com/Estes-28199-Aqua-Sand-White/dp/B002DRCTTS/ref=sr_1_2?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.GG039Bvn6o2PoIOzvnUFyskpdeAyOW2tXwrlxV6IgIJT8D2UAN1uwRjTuNPXO_T3pLYqpDil5JJgsgklLl02A8ILXzod-4Q88Qazs1aXf5ACqJShXeuxOvYo6FYW2lpU3mtelQ5Dry84qScUEtvPkiLqKJT6JEBRPVyvI4J33GZs4t5-lr4Yf9yN_f53gwi9IEicHmhVV8WohvCVifRrZTrao6g5kfb33Jv59Z9-PoUwh31WX63UYlM2bJrbBVOdcpanIllYUITBHn5rJldmWqXvZzXjG3UjFTTK7D1idBs.R_nBd2laYvDS_M-o_jZ2ft14z9PHFlYNTFmYJEttD0A&dib_tag=se&keywords=Stoney+river+aquarium+sand&qid=1715637411&s=pet-supplies&sr=1-2)

I had a gourami that died due to iridovirus not long before I moved, so I figured it would be a good time to switch substrates before I restock. Let me know if I do need to change anything or if I just need to wait. TIA!

[Cory]

Sand isn't as easy to grow plants as a more coarse substrate. However val is definitely one that can be done. I'd wager the die back is from the lack of gunk in the substrate to keep the plant fed. Did you use a bunch of root tabs in the sand where the val is @miketoms21

[miketoms21]

I used 3 root tabs when I planted them, 2 were about 4-5 inches apart in the middle of the small group of Val I kept and the third was right under my Sword. Should I have put more? Also should I just go back to a more coarse substrate to save myself trouble? @Cory

Edited May 13 by miketoms21
forgot to tag Cory

[Cory]

@miketoms21 I'm not switching substrates again in the short term is gonna save you much trouble.  For now I'd say it's a deal with it situation. I'd put a few more root tabs around the plants. They'll likely melt back some more, but hopefully in the next couple of weeks start putting some new growth on. How long have they been in the new sand?

[miketoms21]

@Cory Almost two weeks, figured they would be stagnant due to the new substrate, but got concerned when they started dying and some parts turning brown/black.