tetra Posted May 11 Share Posted May 11 I have a similar problem in my 75g, where my API test kit is detecting 0.25ppm of ammonia all the time, and I just bought that ammonia test kit when I checked the ammonia in the tank earlier this year, and it’s not expired either. I did some research, and found out the API ammonia test kit tests for total ammonia, NH3 (free ammonia) and NH4 (ammonium) NH3 (free ammonia) is significantly more toxic to fish than NH4 (ammonium.) I think free ammonia is the problem, not ammonium. So I figured I’d buy a test to test for NH3 (free ammonia) which was Seachem Ammonia Alert. I let the test sit in the tank for a few hours, and saw that I had less than 0.02ppm of free ammonia, which meant my tank was safe according to the test. So in theory, the 0.25ppm of “ammonia” that my API test kit was detecting may actually be ammonium, which is much less toxic unless in large quantities. My tap water has “ammonia” in it according to my API test kit, so there is not much I could do to remove it, but I’ve never had a problem and my fish are doing just fine. So I don’t worry about it anymore. In fact I have some bronze Corydoras in the tank and they would breed multiple times in there! And I currently have 3 cory fry growing in there. But I do see them flash, but nothing more, and it’s not excessive either. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 11 Author Share Posted May 11 On 5/10/2024 at 9:46 PM, Tony s said: as far as I remember, yes, you had a good cycle at one point. and usually a cycle just doesn't disappear. but, it's not impossible either. I guess we'll see when you do that nitrate test. You do enough water changes it should be low, but if it comes back negative, then it's a failed cycle. which is okay, you could just do a fish in cycle without a whole lot of extra work. you've been watching and doing water changes anyway. You know, maybe it's best if we think of as having failed anyway. See if you can find some Fritz7 and redose the tank with it. I would still like to see what the coop strips say though On that bottle of Fritz7 that froze on me, it took me forever to figure it out. when I went to use it it was already thawed out. so no traces Ok I will test nitrates soon. But I am having company right now so that explains my late reply, sorry everyone On 5/11/2024 at 1:33 AM, DBrown918 said: Just read through this fully and thought I'd offer my take. It sounds to me like you may not have been fully cycled in the first place or you broke your cycle by washing a cartridge out or replacing a cartridge with a new one. Did you ever observe a high nitrite reading followed by a certain day where the nitrites just seemed to disappear or almost disappear overnight? Also, were you doing as many water changes during cycling as you are now? I don't know how to gauge if your tank was ever fully cycled without more info. Is a cartridge the only thing you have in the filter or did you add a sponge? It's all about surface area media in the filter and letting the tank mature slowly. I personally use filter floss/sponges and fluval biomax in a mesh bag in my HOBs. My tank is overstocked slightly and I feed excessively some days and never see ammonia still. It is moderately planted and I have several high nutrient uptake plants like anacharis and hornwort that also help. Honestly sounds to me like you are in the process of cycling again. The hard part about that is you have fish so you're going to want to do tons of water changes which will make it take a bit longer as you're going to remove the ammonia that kicks the cycle off. Are you seeing any nitrites? What are your typical nitrate readings? If you're seeing ammonia spikes without an increase in either nitrites or nitrates then you aren't cycled. Edit: If you are seeing ammonia spikes without an increase in ONLY nitrates then you aren't cycled. If you see nitrites at any point you are definitely not cycled My nitrite is 0, not even close to the slightest bit @DBrown918. My nitrates are 15 usually. But yeah 0 i mean 0 nitrites. I test every 2 days too. Just did a 25% again this morning, they (my white cloud minnows) yawn and go for air at the top of the water but I can’t get a airstone till Monday for very good unspoken reasons. Sadly…. I don’t know how to increase oxygen without pump and airstone…… On 5/11/2024 at 2:33 AM, Tony s said: Actually, that’s a myth. It can take the chlorine in tap water up to an hour to kill bacteria. A quick rinse in tap is often the easiest way to rinse filters out. Running water makes a ton of difference. Jason Adams, who’s a microbiology professor near Chicago and host of Primetime aquatics has done a video explaining this. I especially find it makes cleaning canister sponges sooo much easier. Yes, you will lose a small amount of bacteria, but not enough to damage a cycle Yeah I am subscribed, he’s a good YouTuber I love his channel! @Tony s. @AllFishNoBrakes, thanks for the info!!! @tetra, thx a lot! Daily water changes and testing every day is wha to am doing now…. On 5/11/2024 at 2:56 AM, Tony s said: This is it exactly. I think I came to this sometime yesterday. He did the typical new keeper thing and panicked about something. And changed his cartridge out a couple weeks after it finished the first cycle. Sometime towards the end of February. Yes, we’ve been doing this that long. So it was a new tank, with a new cycle. I think a fresh bottle of bacteria would help enormously. And patience. He’s been diligent on keeping his fish healthy for so long. Hopefully we can get this solved. I know right! I always heard that and always followed it. Doing it in tank water, but oh so much easier in tap. But possibly not for a new tank. Ranks right up there with using a mister clean magic eraser to clean algae inside the tank. Who knew🤣 I don’t lol!!!! But I saw something about it a couple of days ago tho but good video!! Yeah I panic, it’s not good to do that in this hobby, but hey I mean I have been doin this for 2 years, and I think I know a lot. But not EVEN close, I learn multiple things daily on this forum! I am so glad I joined, just wondering where I would be without it 😉 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 11 Share Posted May 11 If you don't have enough air and fish are gasping that could be another thing slowing you down as the nitrification cycle requires aeration to take place. If the level of dissolved oxygen in the water decreases, so does the rate of nitrification. Don't touch the filter media for a while. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyxxl Posted May 11 Share Posted May 11 You shouldn't have an oxygen level issue with the fish and tank size you have though, that's strange. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 11 Share Posted May 11 On 5/11/2024 at 6:19 PM, johnnyxxl said: You shouldn't have an oxygen level issue with the fish and tank size you have though, that's strange. They may be gasping for air due to ammonia toxicity, which is more likely in this situation. Hope he's dosing with prime. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 12 Author Share Posted May 12 Yes I know, ammonia poisoning. Might be the issue. I am dosing prime, have been for 2 months now, with every water change @DBrown918. @johnnyxxl, it is strange why all of this is even happening…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 It's happening because your tank was either never fully cycled or the cycle was damaged somehow. Treat it like you are starting over with cycling. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 12 Author Share Posted May 12 (edited) Ammonia is 0 at the moment. The nitrite is 0. Nitrates is between 5 and 19 ppm @DBrown918. @Tony s. Edited May 12 by Whitecloud09 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 Did you change water before you took those readings? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 12 Author Share Posted May 12 On 5/12/2024 at 4:40 PM, DBrown918 said: Did you change water before you took those readings? No, I’m about too tho. A 25% prob. Here is the pictures btw. The lighting is kinda ruff. But it’s 0 guaranteed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony s Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 Okay, so theoretically you’re still cycled. You change a lot of water, if you weren’t cycled I’d expect the nitrates to be zero. Okay. That’s good. Maybe @tetra has got the right idea. But what bothers me about that is you’re getting 0 ammonia at the tap 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macdaddy36 Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 Test the water for ammonia again after you change and use dechlorinator 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 12 Author Share Posted May 12 On 5/12/2024 at 4:48 PM, Tony s said: Okay, so theoretically you’re still cycled. You change a lot of water, if you weren’t cycled I’d expect the nitrates to be zero. Okay. That’s good. Maybe @tetra has got the right idea. But what bothers me about that is you’re getting 0 ammonia at the tap Yes that is true. The ammonia 0 at tap is scaring me. But it’s gotta be something in my water that was not originally there, and now it is. On 5/12/2024 at 4:50 PM, macdaddy36 said: Test the water for ammonia again after you change and use dechlorinator Got it, I use prime for conditioner btw, about to do one, thanks @macdaddy36. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 Looking better but keep testing every day for the next few days to be sure. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 12 Author Share Posted May 12 When can I feed again, I don’t want more ammonia but they haven’t been fed in 5 days but don’t worry I am not a beginner thinking that I need to feed every day but just wondering. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyxxl Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 I am happy to see this. Looking good, and forward to seeing some stability for you. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBrown918 Posted May 12 Share Posted May 12 On 5/12/2024 at 5:04 PM, Whitecloud09 said: When can I feed again, I don’t want more ammonia but they haven’t been fed in 5 days but don’t worry I am not a beginner thinking that I need to feed every day but just wondering. I don't see why you can't feed now. Just only feed very little amounts let them eat a little then feed a little more. Try to make sure none gets wasted by giving small portions. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony s Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 On 5/12/2024 at 5:04 PM, Whitecloud09 said: am not a beginner thinking that I need to feed every day but just wondering. Actually every day is better, but just a tiny bit. I mean really tiny. I have a harlequin tank instead of wcmm and they really don’t take much at all. I find myself doing too much also. So possibly the smallest amount you can grab would be about right. That would also keep the algae down. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 13 Author Share Posted May 13 On 5/12/2024 at 11:03 PM, Tony s said: Actually every day is better, but just a tiny bit. I mean really tiny. I have a harlequin tank instead of wcmm and they really don’t take much at all. I find myself doing too much also. So possibly the smallest amount you can grab would be about right. That would also keep the algae down. Keep the algae down? Wow…. Thanks! I will, since pellets works best for me in smaller amounts, how many pellets would really be a tiny amount? @Tony s, learn something knew every day lol, less food = less algae in tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyxxl Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 I feed what the fish typically eat in a few minutes. And add something to sink for my cories etc. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony s Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 On 5/13/2024 at 7:18 AM, Whitecloud09 said: I will, since pellets works best for me in smaller amounts What kind of pellets? and more food equals more nutrients in your water. Which leads to more algae 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 13 Author Share Posted May 13 (edited) On 5/13/2024 at 9:43 AM, Tony s said: What kind of pellets? and more food equals more nutrients in your water. Which leads to more algae The micro pellets, I mean micro too, but today I fed them some bug bites from AC. Barely any, I made sure not one spec got down to the gravel. Well, they made sure lol! They were fighting for it lol. But they aren’t skinny or anything. They got every morsel I could see. @Tony s, @johnnyxxl. Thanks So I tested the water, 0 ammonia. Should I continue water changes daily? I have a airstone/air pump/ tubing on the way and it’s coming tomorrow from Amazon, @Tony s, @johnnyxxl, thoughts? Edited May 13 by Whitecloud09 Added pictures 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony s Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 The bug bites are good if they can get them down. The ones I use end up being spit out if too big. The micro pellets would be the right size. But I find they can sink really fast. If wcmm are like rasboras, once they hit the bottom they won’t get them. Maybe feed just a couple of pellets at a time to keep them at the surface 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitecloud09 Posted May 13 Author Share Posted May 13 About the water changes @Tony s? Any thoughts on that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony s Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 Coop bug bites may be perfect. Haven’t tried them. I use tetra micro pellets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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