German Blue Swimming Top of Surface

[Shadow]

I have one GBR that is swimming a lot at the top of the water, staying with mouth at the surface. All other fish seem fine, water parameters on test strip look perfect. Going to test with liquid kit momentarily for more accurate readings. 

Any ideas?

Happened overnight, everyone was A OK when lights went out last night. 

[Fish Folk]

That doesn’t sound good. In my experience, GBRs are more benthic. Sometimes a “night-knock” can occur when a fish is suddenly startled after lights are low, and crash into something. If the swim bladder is harmed, there’s sometimes nothing that can be done but wait. Maybe dim lights to relieve stress.

Always double check temperature. A sticking heater is deadly.

Add air. If dissolved O2 has plummeted, an air stone always helps.

I advise against feeding any bloodworms whatsoever. For some reason, bloodworms mess up GBRs G. I. Health. I’d also avoid large, hard, dry cichlid pellets of any kind.

[Shadow]

On 8/26/2023 at 8:05 AM, Fish Folk said:

That doesn’t sound good. In my experience, GBRs are more benthic. Sometimes a “night-knock” can occur when a fish is suddenly startled after lights are low, and crash into something. If the swim bladder is harmed, there’s sometimes nothing that can be done but wait. Maybe dim lights to relieve stress.

Always double check temperature. A sticking heater is deadly.

Add air. If dissolved O2 has plummeted, an air stone always helps.

I advise against feeding any bloodworms whatsoever. For some reason, bloodworms mess up GBRs G. I. Health. I’d also avoid large, hard, dry cichlid pellets of any kind.

Not sure if you have looked at my journal and how the tank is set up...I have 2 air stones plus 2 sponge filters plus a 4 chamber Oase filter rated for 75 gal(this is a 55 gal). I have two heaters on either side and check temps with parameters each morning. I think I am going to add one more heater I bought that isnt Co Op plus has an alarm feature when the temps drops. I have an Inkbird as well that I need to install this weekend. As far as food, I am feeding them a combo of Tetra Flake, Fluval Bug Bites Tropical Small to Medium granules and Sera Tropical Flake. I haven't fed them bloodworms but once, when I fed my other tanks frozen ones after tank cleanings on Saturdays. I didnt today yet however as I am watching the United match then water change time. 

Parameters:

Temp: 82-83 F

Ammonia 0

Nitrite .20(maybe...barely tinged the water and didnt even register on test strip)

Nitrate 20 ppm

pH 6.8-7.0

Currently been water changing at 25% each day until nitrites are gone. Like I said they are barely showing today. Only feeding twice a day, not a ton. They seem to like the bug bites and tolerate some of the flake. Any ideas on feeding changes or anything else I might be missing here?

Also, this seems to be the one that is the smallest of the four that came in, also didn't color up as much as the others have. So not sure if it was an underlying thing but now its hiding under sponge filter for over an hour now, ignored feeding and fins are clinching. Prob not going to make it. Others all feeding, happy as a lark and nothing adverse seeming. 

I have had an algae issue but that is due to me forgetting to adjust the light settings properly, then also not having fed the tank with EZ Green as I wanted it to cycle and with daily water changes didnt think the plants would get the benefit besides raising the water nitrates higher. 

[Fish Folk]

On 8/26/2023 at 11:21 AM, Shadow said:

I didnt today yet however as I am watching the United match then water change time. 

That's a good lad!

Fish give way to Footy ⚽ 🐟 😎

On 8/26/2023 at 11:21 AM, Shadow said:

Currently been water changing at 25% each day until nitrites are gone.

So is the tank not yet fully cycled? 

On 8/26/2023 at 11:21 AM, Shadow said:

this seems to be the one that is the smallest of the four that came in, also didn't color up as much as the others have

I've recently experienced this with some E-blues. Minimal culling from breeders. Weak stock sometimes "hides" when hormones are added. Juiced fish don't show their weaknesses for a bit.

On 8/26/2023 at 11:21 AM, Shadow said:

now its hiding under sponge filter for over an hour now, ignored feeding and fins are clinching. Prob not going to make it.

I had one do this for . . . weeks . . . looking worse and worse . . . eventually I euthanized it.

[Shadow]

On 8/26/2023 at 12:16 PM, Fish Folk said:

That's a good lad!

Fish give way to Footy ⚽ 🐟 😎

So is the tank not yet fully cycled? 

I've recently experienced this with some E-blues. Minimal culling from breeders. Weak stock sometimes "hides" when hormones are added. Juiced fish don't show their weaknesses for a bit.

I had one do this for . . . weeks . . . looking worse and worse . . . eventually I euthanized it.

So I had it running for almost 2 weeks. Seeded the filter, added Fritz 7 and ghost fed as I have before with no issues. Got readings back without nitrites and steady nitrates(20 ppm). Decided then it was good and got the first fish. Everything seemed fine then I did a test a week into fish being added and there was a small nitrite spike, tested for ammonia, nothing...was weird. Did water change, gone but has returned slightly(.50 or less for a few days until today when the water on the test tube barely changed color(dark blue not even purple) then the AOC test strip faintly turned I mean real faint. So I am assuming it was below .25 maybe .20 or less IMO. Never been signs of ammonia ever. Nitrates haven't super spiked, maybe up to 30. Temps have held strong with 2 heaters between 82-83. Only thing I can think is maybe it banged itself like you said or maybe as @Guppysnail suggested maybe the nitrite spike did some gill damage to it. Regardless, it started looking real bad then didnt make it. Had to remove it. 

Water change and overall tank cleanup done. Gonna give them a minimal feeding possibly tonight and see how parameters are tomorrow. Think its just about to normal if not normal now. Also added one extra portable USB air stones I had to give it three now for extra oxygenation. 

[nabokovfan87]

It's a bit counter to what you have in process with the cycling, but barring squeezing some other tank filtration gunk into this one....  Salt, botanicals, and air would be the place to start just for sake of trying to help the ram's immune response.  Something as simple as depth of the tank, you might need to have a stronger pump or more of them in order to get the water churning.  Especially at that temp, if it was in my fishroom, I would have a wall of bubbles all along the back of the tank.

I found this, measurements from a water resource in nature at various temperatures.  (depth also plays a role too) 

It is part of a longer, more detailed document, but this is just something to visually clarify what could be going on here.  I don't know if oxygenation and nitrite correlate to an issue here, but i can't imagine adding the above 3 items would do anything but help the situation.

[Shadow]

On 8/26/2023 at 3:34 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

It's a bit counter to what you have in process with the cycling, but barring squeezing some other tank filtration gunk into this one....  Salt, botanicals, and air would be the place to start just for sake of trying to help the ram's immune response.  Something as simple as depth of the tank, you might need to have a stronger pump or more of them in order to get the water churning.  Especially at that temp, if it was in my fishroom, I would have a wall of bubbles all along the back of the tank.

I found this, measurements from a water resource in nature at various temperatures.  (depth also plays a role too) 

It is part of a longer, more detailed document, but this is just something to visually clarify what could be going on here.  I don't know if oxygenation and nitrite correlate to an issue here, but i can't imagine adding the above 3 items would do anything but help the situation.

Thanks for the feedback as usual! Little update, according to readings last night and this morning, tank is cycled. Not sure what happened early in the week to make nitrite spike up, very weird. 

Parameters same from last night and this morning...

0 ammonia 0 nitrite 20-30 nitrate 6.8-7.0 pH and with addition of new high end heater with the 2 AOC heaters now holding strong at 82 F. Installing Inkbird today.