Quarantine and medication

[Gregs_Gal]

Hello. I ordered 9 female guppies and they're on their way to me. I have never ordered fish online before. Only purchased from big box stores but their fish looked unhealthy or they had dead fish in the tanks. 😱😱 NO THANKS!!  I have a quarantine tank set up and waiting. My question is should I dose them with meds right away? I have API General Cure on hand and Ich X as well. Is Fritz Paracleanse the same thing as General Cure? Do I need to use anything else?  Nothing at all? I know that Cory recommends to use Fritz Maracyn as well and I have some on the way. Also, I have a separate quarantine "tank" set up because I ordered some snails (from a different company so I didn't think I should put them together). How should I treat them? With anything? I know that certain medications can harm them. Sorry for all the questions and thank you for any help you can give me!!!

Edited July 21, 2022 by Gregs_Gal

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/20/2022 at 8:13 PM, Gregs_Gal said:

My question is should I dose them with meds right away?

I would give them at least 24 hours before you do anything.  A lot of times people will recommend to observe for a week and then treat.  If you're doing the med trio, this is a different situation and you're essentially letting the fish "soak" in the meds so to speak as a preventative treatment and not an active treatment (active being, following the directions on the packages). 
 

On 7/20/2022 at 8:13 PM, Gregs_Gal said:

I have API General Cure on hand and Ich X as well. Is Fritz Paracleanse the same thing as General Cure? Do I need to use anything else?  Nothing at all? I know that Cory recommends to use Fritz Maracyn as well and I have some on the way.

yes you can use general cure in place of paracleanse.

The only other thing you might consider adding is typically aquarium salt.

On 7/20/2022 at 8:13 PM, Gregs_Gal said:

Also, I have a separate quarantine "tank" set up because I ordered some snails (from a different company so I didn't think I should put them together). How should I treat them? With anything? I know that certain medications can harm them.

@Guppysnail How would you handle this?

[Guppysnail]

@nabokovfan87 thank you for thinking of me.  I however don’t use medication preemptively in quarantine.

However what I do for guppies incoming is salt.  Folks struggle with guppies these days because they have been heavily bred. Many big sources and overseas sources often breed them in slightly brackish water. This means they have no exposure to most freshwater parasites and diseases. That causes them to have no natural immune system built up to deal with freshwater things. They then hit freshwater wholesalers and retailers tank and are exposed to things and can’t fight them.

from that info I gathered after having a miserable time keeping any guppy from any source alive I came up with the thought using a salt QT would give them a bit of a reset hopefully.  Instead of my normal plop and drop in qt I added slowly introducing salt.  It’s been a few years so I do not remember the amounts I used.  I think ACO has a 1-2-3 level guide. Start at 1 and up as needed is where I would start. After 2 weeks I would slowly start lowering the salt by not adding it at water change.  Then I would observe and medicate only for symptoms. This made a huge difference in my incoming survival rate.  The females still never did well past 2-3 fry drops but the fry were dynamo’s. 
 

I still found I ended up needing either antibiotics or parasite meds. However ick was never a problem so I assume the salt preemptively knocked out ick. 
 

All that being said. Medication is hard on and stressful to fish.  Shipping, transport, new water, improper food and amounts from pet stores, fasting for shipping etc is hard on fish.  I would introduce them to the QT.  Use salt if they seem to not settle in to happy go lucky or if you agree with my thought process.  I’m not a vet just a hobbyist so can’t guarantee it’s sound logic but it worked for me when other stuff failed. Feed them up well for at least a week and let them de-stress (stress is the #1 fish killer). The run whatever meds you choose. I’m not great with meds so I’m not the one to ask on that stuff. I rely on folks here for that type of info.  
 

My friend actually does salt in all his QT fir all incoming fish, lower levels for salt sensitive and only treats for symptoms. He has good luck (better than not using salt) and after talking to him I have decided all future incoming fish will be run through the salt treatment as it sheds all external parasites.  Again check coop blogs for therapeutic levels.  
 

Best of luck I hope you share photos of your new friends. 

If your fish come with acclimation instructions gpfollow them or live arrival guarantees are voided. 

[Gregs_Gal]

On 7/21/2022 at 3:26 AM, Guppysnail said:

@nabokovfan87 thank you for thinking of me.  I however don’t use medication preemptively in quarantine.

However what I do for guppies incoming is salt.  Folks struggle with guppies these days because they have been heavily bred. Many big sources and overseas sources often breed them in slightly brackish water. This means they have no exposure to most freshwater parasites and diseases. That causes them to have no natural immune system built up to deal with freshwater things. They then hit freshwater wholesalers and retailers tank and are exposed to things and can’t fight them.

from that info I gathered after having a miserable time keeping any guppy from any source alive I came up with the thought using a salt QT would give them a bit of a reset hopefully.  Instead of my normal plop and drop in qt I added slowly introducing salt.  It’s been a few years so I do not remember the amounts I used.  I think ACO has a 1-2-3 level guide. Start at 1 and up as needed is where I would start. After 2 weeks I would slowly start lowering the salt by not adding it at water change.  Then I would observe and medicate only for symptoms. This made a huge difference in my incoming survival rate.  The females still never did well past 2-3 fry drops but the fry were dynamo’s. 
 

I still found I ended up needing either antibiotics or parasite meds. However ick was never a problem so I assume the salt preemptively knocked out ick. 
 

All that being said. Medication is hard on and stressful to fish.  Shipping, transport, new water, improper food and amounts from pet stores, fasting for shipping etc is hard on fish.  I would introduce them to the QT.  Use salt if they seem to not settle in to happy go lucky or if you agree with my thought process.  I’m not a vet just a hobbyist so can’t guarantee it’s sound logic but it worked for me when other stuff failed. Feed them up well for at least a week and let them de-stress (stress is the #1 fish killer). The run whatever meds you choose. I’m not great with meds so I’m not the one to ask on that stuff. I rely on folks here for that type of info.  
 

My friend actually does salt in all his QT fir all incoming fish, lower levels for salt sensitive and only treats for symptoms. He has good luck (better than not using salt) and after talking to him I have decided all future incoming fish will be run through the salt treatment as it sheds all external parasites.  Again check coop blogs for therapeutic levels.  
 

Best of luck I hope you share photos of your new friends. 

If your fish come with acclimation instructions gpfollow them or live arrival guarantees are voided. 

Thank you so much for the advice. My guppies are coming from North Carolina. Do you still recommend the salt treatment if they weren't raised in brackish water? I have aquarium salt so i will add some of that to the tank. Also I have never had snails before. Should I just do water changes for them and nothing else? Thank you I truly appreciate the help!

Edited July 21, 2022 by Gregs_Gal

[Guppysnail]

On 7/21/2022 at 10:31 AM, Gregs_Gal said:

Thank you so much for the advice. My guppies are coming from North Carolina. Do you still recommend the salt treatment if they weren't raised in brackish water? I have aquarium salt so i will add some of that to the tank. Also I have never had snails before. Should I just do water changes for them and nothing else? Thank you I truly appreciate the help!

Do not use salt if you are putting snails and fish together. Salt will harm your snails. I have no idea where they originate from. Purchasing from NC unless they tank raise them themselves they could just be a redistribution place. Use your judgement but unless the come in needing immediate medication at least give them a week of plenty of good food, and stress free environment to recover from their ordeal. Starving fish from fasting to ship  do not have the resources to fight illness or heal they would if you beefed them up first. 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 7/21/2022 at 10:31 AM, Gregs_Gal said:

Thank you so much for the advice. My guppies are coming from North Carolina. Do you still recommend the salt treatment if they weren't raised in brackish water? I have aquarium salt so i will add some of that to the tank. Also I have never had snails before. Should I just do water changes for them and nothing else? Thank you I truly appreciate the help!

Here's the guidelines for salt treatment, but as @Guppysnail advised, make sure there are no snails in the tank before using it. Also the post mentions a certain catfish that cannot tolerate salt.

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/aquarium-salt-for-sick-fish#:~:text=Level 1 Treatment&text=Add 1 tablespoon (Tbsp) of,small cup of water first.

[Gregs_Gal]

On 7/21/2022 at 7:45 AM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Here's the guidelines for salt treatment, but as @Guppysnail advised, make sure there are no snails in the tank before using it. Also the post mentions a certain catfish that cannot tolerate salt.

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/aquarium-salt-for-sick-fish#:~:text=Level 1 Treatment&text=Add 1 tablespoon (Tbsp) of,small cup of water first.

Thank you so much! I haven't kept fish for over 25 years and so many things have changed from medicine to methods. I appreciate it!

On 7/21/2022 at 7:45 AM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Here's the guidelines for salt treatment, but as @Guppysnail advised, make sure there are no snails in the tank before using it. Also the post mentions a certain catfish that cannot tolerate salt.

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/aquarium-salt-for-sick-fish#:~:text=Level 1 Treatment&text=Add 1 tablespoon (Tbsp) of,small cup of water first.

Thank you so much! I haven't kept fish for over 25 years and so many things have changed from medicine to methods. I appreciate it!

[Gregs_Gal]

Thanks for all the advice! I have a separate tank set up for the snails. I purchased them from Flip Aquatics. Should I run a sponge filter or is just an air stone enough with daily water changes? I knew that salt would hurt them as well as other invertebrates but didnt realize it would kill them. I'm so glad I found this forum! It's been such a huge help!  

On 7/20/2022 at 11:18 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I would give them at least 24 hours before you do anything.  A lot of times people will recommend to observe for a week and then treat.  If you're doing the med trio, this is a different situation and you're essentially letting the fish "soak" in the meds so to speak as a preventative treatment and not an active treatment (active being, following the directions on the packages). 
 

yes you can use general cure in place of paracleanse.

The only other thing you might consider adding is typically aquarium salt.

@Guppysnail How would you handle this?

Thank you so much for the info and reaching out to Guppysnail. It's truly appreciated!

[Guppysnail]

You will want to run a sponge filter. They need the same clean water as fish. They are messy. They eat a lot. Steamed veggies are a fan favorite. 

[Gregs_Gal]

I will add one now. Thanks!

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/21/2022 at 3:26 AM, Guppysnail said:

@nabokovfan87 thank you for thinking of me.  I however don’t use medication preemptively in quarantine.

All good!  I have no idea how to treat snails.  Have you ever done it before?

On 7/21/2022 at 7:37 AM, Guppysnail said:

Do not use salt if you are putting snails and fish together. Salt will harm your snails.

This is exactly why you'd want to QT them separately.

[Vince C]

On 7/21/2022 at 6:26 AM, Guppysnail said:

@nabokovfan87 thank you for thinking of me.  I however don’t use medication preemptively in quarantine.

However what I do for guppies incoming is salt.  Folks struggle with guppies these days because they have been heavily bred. Many big sources and overseas sources often breed them in slightly brackish water. This means they have no exposure to most freshwater parasites and diseases. That causes them to have no natural immune system built up to deal with freshwater things. They then hit freshwater wholesalers and retailers tank and are exposed to things and can’t fight them.

from that info I gathered after having a miserable time keeping any guppy from any source alive I came up with the thought using a salt QT would give them a bit of a reset hopefully.  Instead of my normal plop and drop in qt I added slowly introducing salt.  It’s been a few years so I do not remember the amounts I used.  I think ACO has a 1-2-3 level guide. Start at 1 and up as needed is where I would start. After 2 weeks I would slowly start lowering the salt by not adding it at water change.  Then I would observe and medicate only for symptoms. This made a huge difference in my incoming survival rate.  The females still never did well past 2-3 fry drops but the fry were dynamo’s. 
 

I still found I ended up needing either antibiotics or parasite meds. However ick was never a problem so I assume the salt preemptively knocked out ick. 
 

All that being said. Medication is hard on and stressful to fish.  Shipping, transport, new water, improper food and amounts from pet stores, fasting for shipping etc is hard on fish.  I would introduce them to the QT.  Use salt if they seem to not settle in to happy go lucky or if you agree with my thought process.  I’m not a vet just a hobbyist so can’t guarantee it’s sound logic but it worked for me when other stuff failed. Feed them up well for at least a week and let them de-stress (stress is the #1 fish killer). The run whatever meds you choose. I’m not great with meds so I’m not the one to ask on that stuff. I rely on folks here for that type of info.  
 

My friend actually does salt in all his QT fir all incoming fish, lower levels for salt sensitive and only treats for symptoms. He has good luck (better than not using salt) and after talking to him I have decided all future incoming fish will be run through the salt treatment as it sheds all external parasites.  Again check coop blogs for therapeutic levels.  
 

Best of luck I hope you share photos of your new friends. 

If your fish come with acclimation instructions gpfollow them or live arrival guarantees are voided. 

Such great info - Wanted to piggie back on the thanks for the insight. I have never done the Salt QT - will definitely be trying that on my next batch of guppies/livebearers I get in.

[Guppysnail]

On 7/21/2022 at 3:18 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I have no idea how to treat snails.  Have you ever done it before?

I don’t. I I rinse in a cup of tank water and let them crawl in a bucket with a bit of water for a few hours and plop them in. Only the exterior could carry parasites/diseases because of whatever water is on them. They are not host to things that infect fish. If it is a source I’m not familiar with I let them in a tank for 30 days. I also do that with any snail going into a main display tank. I let them live in a guppy fry grow out for a month. The guppy fry act as my sentinel fish. 

Edited July 21, 2022 by Guppysnail

[Gregs_Gal]

@Guppysnail So you think it's safe to just rinse them off and leave them in a bucket of treated water for a bit before putting them in my 2 tanks (separate from my QT tank)? That would be so much easier! Thanks!

[Guppysnail]

On 7/21/2022 at 4:18 PM, Gregs_Gal said:

@Guppysnail So you think it's safe to just rinse them off and leave them in a bucket of treated water for a bit before putting them in my 2 tanks (separate from my QT tank)? That would be so much easier! Thanks!

That is what I do. But they stay in small tanks 10g or 20long where I can see them and monitor them and just in case can easily treat problems. I have never had an issue doing that. There is of course always a risk. I’ve purchased over 80+snails😳 over the years  and never had issues. yes I’m the crazy snail lady. 🤣

[Gregs_Gal]

On 7/21/2022 at 1:41 PM, Guppysnail said:

That is what I do. But they stay in small tanks 10g or 20long where I can see them and monitor them and just in case can easily treat problems. I have never had an issue doing that. There is of course always a risk. I’ve purchased over 80+snails😳 over the years  and never had issues. yes I’m the crazy snail lady. 🤣

I appreciate the info! I only have a 20 and a 5 gallon so I think I will follow your advice with the snails and then just have the new guppies QT until they are ready. Thanks for all the insight! I hope you have a great afternoon!