Stressed Tank Woes

[Anjum]

I've been doing a lot of lurking & searching & I see my problems are common. You guys are saints for fielding the same questions & issues over & over.. 

I moved my established 10 gallon a couple weeks ago, swapped an internal filter for a sponge filter & removed a pothos cutting (that had rooted into the gravel). Now my parameters have gone sideways & my betta is suffering. 

A few days ago when I tested, the KH was at 0, GH was at the highest level on the strips (upwards 180ppm), pH was 6.0 & nitrates were around 80, nitrites & ammonia 0. I did a 20% water change & added some neutral regulator & the levels were slightly improved. 

My test strips are old & I suspect inaccurate. I have the liquid ph, GH & KH tests; I have a master rest kit coming, should be here Friday. 

Last night, test strips showed Nitrates up to 100 ppm. This was a marked increase. Before I moved the tank, they were around 60. Liquid tests showed pH 6.5, KH 36 ppm & GH 161 ppm. Did another 20% wc & retested. 6.7 pH, kh same, GH 143ppm, nitrates 80 ppm. Did another 20% wc this morning but didn't have time to do all the tests. Just did a quick strip test but didn't see much conclusive change. 

I just picked up a used 5 gal w/ a hob. I also have a new sponge filter & air stone at home. Going to set up a triage tank when I get home in an hour. 

My betta had gotten fat & so I've been careful to feed him sparingly while still trying to get food to the 5 rasboras. But he's also gotten lethargic & lays on the bottom or in plants most of the time. He still has a good appetite though. I thought maybe just stress from the move, but now I see he's probably suffering from the poor parameters. Just last night I noticed some possible pinecone-ing in his scales on his side. 

I plan to get him moved to the 5 gal & start with mild salt treatments. Input on filtration? HOB, sponge or air stone alone w/ daily wc? 

I've always kept temp at 80F. I feed Xtreme Betta Pellets & Hikari freeze dried blood worms. 

Any other input, I'd greatly appreciate. 

[Anjum]

The saga continues... everyone is alive though.

Put the betta in his new 5 gallon tank last night. Got it all set up & put him right in (temps were the same). And as soon as I put him in, I realized I didn't test the parameters on the new tank *doh*! So I did the tests & the pH was 7.6! IDK how it's so high, my tap is only about 7.2??? I used API aquarium salt, which isn't supposed to change the pH. I boiled a small clump of alder cones for the tannins & hoping that would lower the pH a little, but so far it's about the same.

Got up this morning & everything looked the same. Checked the temp & it was down to 75F! *Doh!* The 25w heater wasn't keeping up. Swapped some heaters around & he perked up a bit once the temp started coming up. It was at about 80-82 when I left for work. Rest of the parameters looked good. My master test kit arrived right before I was to leave, so I did a high-range pH test real quick & it looks to be between 7.4-7.6. I'll do a wc when I get home tonight & see if that pH comes into line. I did end up using the sponge filter.

I gravel vaccd the 10 gal & it was indeed pretty dirty. Also did a significant wc, maybe close to 50%. I put the internal filter back in, along with the sponge filter & the water looked good this morning & the rasboras were quite active. Didn't get a chance to test that tank, but I'll test everything tonight.

[Anjum]

If this Betta makes it through me trying to "help" him, he's a survivor. He looks good today though. Ate 2 pellets & was swimming around a bit. 

Got home from work last night & the water temp was up to 85°F. This poor fish endured a 10° temperature fluctuation in one day. Ugh. Took out a gallon of water & slowly started adding back in clean cool water. Also added 1 tsp of salt to replace what I took out. I think I have the heat dialed in now; it's stayed at 80-82. But I'm going to pick up a 50w heater tonight. I'm finding I have to oversize my heaters a bit, assuming because our house is on the cooler side, around 65° these days. 

I also did some water testing & everything looks good except the pH is staying at 7.5 or so. I'm going to see if the LFS has IAL tonight. I don't want to do anything too drastic, lest it stress him out more. But would changing out a greater volume of water, say 2 gallons (in the 5 gal tank) be too much? 

[CalmedByFish]

It's a lot of info to keep up with (as you know!), but my initial impression is that a more hands-off approach might help. Maybe a paradigm of stabilizing parameters, rather than changing parameters. Maybe your ambient room temp would be warm enough instead of using a heater? Maybe you could only do water changes if you see ammonia or nitrite? I might've missed this, but I'd definitely add bottled bacteria if you haven't. I was told on this forum to keep pH stable instead of "chase" it, so maybe just let it be. And at least for now, consider sticking with liquid test kits, since they're more accurate than strips.

Edited April 29, 2022 by CalmedByFish
typo

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Hi @Anjum. I agree with @CalmedByFish maybe once the temp is stabilized (8-82) and ammonia/nitrite is staying 0, and nitrates start testing in a reasonable range, I wouldn't do anything further (the IAL is fine). Poor guy has gone through a lot of changes in a short period of time- very stressful. Ph of 7.6 is fine. Overall to stabilize the ph you could put some crushed coral in your tanks- it's slower acting when first put in but better than chemical additives that you have to constantly add/keep up with. Less fluctuation and stress for your fishy folk. 

Edited April 29, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX
to clarify

[Anjum]

On 4/29/2022 at 10:41 AM, CalmedByFish said:

It's a lot of info to keep up with (as you know!), but my initial impression is that a more hands-off approach might help. Maybe a paradigm of stabilizing parameters, rather than changing parameters. Maybe your ambient room temp would be warm enough instead of using a heater? Maybe you could only do water changes if you see ammonia or nitrite? I might've missed this, but I'd definitely add bottled bacteria if you haven't. I was told on this forum to keep pH stable instead of "chase" it, so maybe just let it be. And at least for now, consider sticking with liquid test kits, since they're more accurate than strips.

I know 😅 this has been a roller coaster. I've always had a hands off approach. But since I've moved this tank, everything's gone sideways. But I've learned a lot about how seemingly small changes can have large impacts, so I think I'll be better prepared in the future. But I feel bad my betta boy has had to suffer through my learning curve. 

I did forget to mention, I did add an aqueon pure beneficial bacteria ball when I 1st set up the qt tank. 

On 4/29/2022 at 10:57 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Hi @Anjum. I agree with @CalmedByFish maybe once the temp is stabilized (8-82) and ammonia/nitrite is staying 0, and nitrates start testing in a reasonable range, I wouldn't do anything further (the IAL is fine). Poor guy has gone through a lot of changes in a short period of time- very stressful. Ph of 7.6 is fine. Overall to stabilize the ph you could put some crushed coral in your tanks- it's slower acting when first put in but better than chemical additives that you have to constantly add/keep up with. Less fluctuation and stress for your fishy folk. 

I'll leave the pH alone now. It should slowly come down with the plants & botanicals. 

I do have crushed coral on my list of things to look for tonight. It would be good for all my tanks. 

Thanks to you both! 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

On 4/29/2022 at 12:36 PM, Anjum said:

I know 😅 this has been a roller coaster. I've always had a hands off approach. But since I've moved this tank, everything's gone sideways. But I've learned a lot about how seemingly small changes can have large impacts, so I think I'll be better prepared in the future. But I feel bad my betta boy has had to suffer through my learning curve. 

I did forget to mention, I did add an aqueon pure beneficial bacteria ball when I 1st set up the qt tank. 

On 4/29/2022 at 10:57 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Any small change can send a tank sideways so this isn't unusual. Any time I move tanks I look at it as a fish in cycle until the tank proves me otherwise. The sad part is Bettas are very sensitive fish so I understand your concern entirely. 

Watch that Aqueon ball.....I used them and none of the times did the ball actually burst or dissolve...

Edited April 29, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[Anjum]

On 4/29/2022 at 1:31 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Any small change can send a tank sideways so this isn't unusual. Any time I move tanks I look at it as a fish in cycle until the tank proves me otherwise. The sad part is Bettas are very sensitive fish so I understand your concern entirely. 

Watch that Aqueon ball.....I used them and none of the times did the ball actually burst or dissolved...

Oh shoot! It did look like it was still intact yesterday.. I'll add a different liquid bacterial start up product to my shopping list for tonight. I could use it in the 29 gal I'm about to set up too.

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Yeah I'm really not sure what is supposed to happen with those- I ended up throwing all mine away because I went a different direction anyway- but you might be able to poke a hole in it and squeeze the contents out. 

[Anjum]

On 4/29/2022 at 2:22 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Yeah I'm really not sure what is supposed to happen with those- I ended up throwing all mine away because I went a different direction anyway- but you might be able to poke a hole in it and squeeze the contents out. 

huh, so the product page on Aqueon's website makes it sound like they're not supposed to dissolve right away 🤷‍♀️

https://www.aqueon.com/products/water-care/pure-aquarium-gel-balls

In the interest of not over-complicating things, I think I'll just leave it alone & monitor parameters closely. I did put in some plants & decor from my other tanks, so that should've also introduced some BB.

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Sounds like a good plan. Mine never dissolved. In one case it was in the tank a month or more. There was still the same amount of liquid in it when I pulled it out and tossed it- was funny to me because the inside of the package had condensation from what I presume was leaking. 

[Anjum]

On 4/29/2022 at 4:40 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Sounds like a good plan. Mine never dissolved. In one case it was in the tank a month or more. There was still the same amount of liquid in it when I pulled it out and tossed it- was funny to me because the inside of the package had condensation from what I presume was leaking. 

huh, yeah, it's kinda a weird product. I guess I'll use what I have, but in the future I plan to go w/ the ACO's suggestion of running extra sponge filters in my tanks that I can use to cycle new set-ups.

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

I was doing that on my own for some time (because I wasn't sure if 1 sponge was enough for my tanks)- I've since learned it's very good practice to jumpstart tanks and/or quarantines so I've done it ever since. I keep a couple of extra sponge filters on hand for this purpose- it's saved me many times.