Bloated fish..help

[Danabana]

Something is happening to "big blue"...he looks bloated this morning and lethargic.  I have antibiotics ordered but it will take days to get here.  Should I treat the display tank with aquarium salt?  HELP...why is this happening?  

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Have you done anything different to the tank? Fed him different foods? Is the bloat on both sides and symetrical or is it just 1 side and/or asymetrical? What are your water parameters. Does he usually hang out by the heater?

My first thought is since you don't have meds on hand and waiting on further responses or ideas is trying plain Epsom salt soaks to help with the bloat. If it's constipation or something similarly "benign" it may help. 1 tablespoon per gallon dissolved in a QT or container 15-20 minute soak. 

I'm not criticizing you at all so please don't take it that way, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to have a few basic medications on hand as a "fish first aid" kit. It takes a LOT of stress off of you and treating fish sooner rather than later they have a better chance of recovery. 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 11:48 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Have you done anything different to the tank? Fed him different foods? Is the bloat on both sides and symetrical or is it just 1 side and/or asymetrical? What are your water parameters. Does he usually hang out by the heater?

My first thought is since you don't have meds on hand and waiting on further responses or ideas is trying plain Epsom salt soaks to help with the bloat. If it's constipation or something similarly "benign" it may help. 1 tablespoon per gallon dissolved in a QT or container 15-20 minute soak. 

I'm not criticizing you at all so please don't take it that way, but I cannot stress enough how important it is to have a few basic medications on hand as a "fish first aid" kit. It takes a LOT of stress off of you and treating fish sooner rather than later they have a better chance of recovery. 

I don't take it as criticism.  I'm fairly new to the hobby that's been lucky to only deal with ich.  I am completely stressed out this morning.  My GT is in use with a newly inquired fish that are going through salt treatment.  

I did a partial water change yesterday.  My water parameters were fine yesterday but this morning isn't ideal.  The bloat is symmetrical on both sides.  He's still moving around the tank but very slowly.  He isn't hanging at the heater.  The other fish in the tank are fine so far.  No new foods introduced.  

pH 6.4 

Nitrates 25

Hardness 250

Nitrites 1

Ammonia 0

Buffer 40

Water temp 79

 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Good, I'm glad you didn't take it wrong, I just like to remind others that might read I don't want them to go through what you are- I know how stressful it is. 

I'd get a container (I have small fish so I use my ziplock containers) mix up some Epsom and let little guy soak. While he's chillin in the bath do a water change to get rid of that 1ppm nitrite ASAP. If you have Prime use that. 🙂 I would continue with daily soaks unless and until 1) it doesn't help 2) a better solution is offered or 3) your meds show up and there is a need to use them. Salt will be your friend in the meantime. 

If you don't have Epsom it is readily available at most stores in the pharmacy section, just make sure it's PLAIN epsom with no scents or other additives. 

Edited February 6, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 12:41 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Good, I'm glad you didn't take it wrong, I just like to remind others that might read I don't want them to go through what you are- I know how stressful it is. 

I'd get a container (I have small fish so I use my ziplock containers) mix up some Epsom and let little guy soak. While he's chillin in the bath do a water change to get rid of that 1ppm nitrite ASAP. If you have Prime use that. 🙂 I would continue with daily soaks unless and until 1) it doesn't help 2) a better solution is offered or 3) your meds show up and there is a need to use them. Salt will be your friend in the meantime. 

If you don't have Epsom it is readily available at most stores in the pharmacy section, just make sure it's PLAIN epsom with no scents or other additives. 

I did have to run out to get epsom salt. Should I set up another quarantine tank just for him?  Can you tell what's wrong just by looking at him?  He's a fav of mine...I just wanna fix him.  Thanks for the help...I hope it works

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

The Epsom is good to have on hand (even for more than fishy) and thankfully it's pretty cheap. I think you'll need to prepare a QT once we figure out whether he NEEDS medication. I totally understand wanting to get him helped. As long as he's not showing signs of something that might spread to others I would keep him in his regular tank to keep his stress low. To me it's only necessary to move him when you have hashed out a treatment plan. @Colu may be able to pipe in to give an opinion. I'll do what I can to try and help you figure it out, what species is mr fishy? 

Edited February 6, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Ok, after much research because of the Nitrite spike I suspect you have a bacterial infection going in little guy. So, without further meds and AQUARIUM salt on hand you have a choice. Treat the tank OR put HIM in QT and treat him (with the aquarium salt). If nobody is showing signs of infection physically or visually this is a choice you can make. Keeping in mind salt can damage plants and hurt some invertebrates if you have them in the main tank. Check your tank parameters again and make sure nitrite is back at zero (well of course ammonia too). Check for issues that might cause spikes, remove any dead or dying plant matter (clean but don't over-clean IME it can sometimes do more damage than good), do a water change if needed. If you need help with dosing Aquarium salt:

https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/aquarium-salt-for-sick-fish

**The Epsom salt soaks for 15-20 minutes should help unless it stresses him out too much you can do this daily or every other day for a week, maybe less. 

Edited February 6, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 2:42 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Ok, after much research I'm thinking because of the Nitrite spike you have a bacterial infection going in little guy. So, without further meds and AQUARIUM salt on hand you have a choice. Treat the tank OR put HIM in QT and treat him. If nobody is showing signs of infection physically or visually this is a choice you can make. Keeping in mind salt can damage plants and hurt some invertebrates if you have them in the main tank. Check your tank parameters again and make sure nitrite is back at zero (well of course ammonia too)

**The Epsom salt soaks for 15-20 minutes should help unless it stresses him out too much you can do this daily or every other day for a week, maybe less. 

I just ran parameters of the water now 

pH 6.8

Nitrates 20

Hardness 75

Nitrite 0

Ammonia 0

Buffer 80

He's back in the tank but I'm worried about the other fish.  I almost want to treat the whole tank incase they are sick but not showing exterior signs yet.  I just wonder what I did wrong to cause this to happen.  I googled bloat...is that what you think he has?

 

 

 

 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Well it's hard to say EXACTLY what he might have at this point but I suspect it's bacterial as bloat is often a sign of a bacterial infection. Sometimes bloat can also be constipation. When it's symetrical it's usually not something like a tumor so we can likely rule that out. So in the case of bloat or a bacterial infection salt will be a good treatment because it can treat both. If you want to treat your main tank out of an abundance of caution that is a judgement call you can absolutely make. 

The reason I lean towards bacterial right is because of your nitrite spike. If your water conditions were perfect I'd lean towards constipation or similar. SALT covers you either way especially in cases where there are no other medications on hand. Make sense? 

Edited February 6, 2022 by xXInkedPhoenixX

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 2:42 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Ok, after much research I'm thinking because of the Nitrite spike you have a bacterial infection going in little guy. So, without further meds and AQUARIUM salt on hand you have a choice. Treat the tank OR put HIM in QT and treat him. If nobody is showing signs of infection physically or visually this is a choice you can make. Keeping in mind salt can damage plants and hurt some invertebrates if you have them in the main tank. Check your tank parameters again and make sure nitrite is back at zero (well of course ammonia too)

**The Epsom salt soaks for 15-20 minutes should help unless it stresses him out too much you can do this daily or every other day for a week, maybe less. 

I just ran parameters of the water now 

pH 6.8

Nitrates 20

Hardness 75

Nitrite 0

Ammonia 0

Buffer 80

He's back in the tank but I'm worried about the other fish.  I almost want to treat the whole tank incase they are sick but not showing exterior signs yet.  I just wonder what I did wrong to cause this to happen.  I googled bloat...is that what you think he has?

Also i have bamboo shrimp and a snail in this tank....can I put them in another tank or could they potentially carry whatever big blue has?  I have 4 different size display tanks in my house. 

 

 

 

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

You didn't necessarily DO anything wrong. As fish keepers we have to run through our minds what if anything has changed in the tank that could have caused it. Maybe it's something you have to search for in the tank, for example with a spike sometimes you have to check for say, dead snails or fish that could cause it. Maybe there's some rotten food. You could be overfeeding. Maybe it needed a water change sooner. It's just something we adapt/adjust to and learn from. 🙂 

If you're going to treat the whole tank remove your invertebrates they typicaly do NOT get the same kinds of illness as our fish friends can and treatment can hurt or kill them. Personally whenever I treat a whole tank I take my invertebrates out even when they say invertebrate safe on medication, that's just MY preference. I would remove a piece of driftwood and some precious plants and put them in the QT with them while you treat. 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 2:33 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

The Epsom is good to have on hand (even for more than fishy) and thankfully it's pretty cheap. I think you'll need to prepare a QT once we figure out whether he NEEDS medication. I totally understand wanting to get him helped. As long as he's not showing signs of something that might spread to others I would keep him in his regular tank to keep his stress low. To me it's only necessary to move him when you have hashed out a treatment plan. @Colu may be able to pipe in to give an opinion. I'll do what I can to try and help you figure it out, what species is mr fishy? 

He's a gourami ...exact species name of him is unknown cause I bought him at chain pet store.  He was my first purchase when I got back in the hobby after 15+ years.  

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

On 2/6/2022 at 12:10 PM, Danabana said:

He's a gourami

Ok that's what I thought. 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:07 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

You didn't necessarily DO anything wrong. As fish keepers we have to run through our minds what if anything has changed in the tank that could have caused it. Maybe it's something you have to search for in the tank, for example with a spike sometimes you have to check for say, dead snails or fish that could cause it. Maybe there's some rotten food. You could be overfeeding. Maybe it needed a water change sooner. It's just something we adapt/adjust to and learn from. 🙂 

If you're going to treat the whole tank remove your invertebrates they typicaly do NOT get the same kinds of illness as our fish friends can and treatment can hurt or kill them. Personally whenever I treat a whole tank I take my invertebrates out even when they say invertebrate safe on medication, that's just MY preference. I would remove a piece of driftwood and some precious plants and put them in the QT with them while you treat. 

Ok...the good thing about this tank is it still has plastic plants.  I started with my small tanks with plants and wood.  Which I can start a whole conversation on that topic...I have a lot going on with my tanks right now.  😆

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Your invertebrates will still benefit from the plastic plants or other decor if you have to stick them in a new QT as they have the biofilm and bacteria from the tank they came from. 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:16 PM, Danabana said:

Ok...the good thing about this tank is it still has plastic plants.  I started with my small tanks with plants and wood.  Which I can start a whole conversation on that topic...I have a lot going on with my tanks right now.  😆

By the way, thank you for helping me.  👍🐡🐟💞

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

You're welcome @Danabana. Hope he gets better. Update if you can 🙂 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:21 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Your invertebrates will still benefit from the plastic plants or other decor if you have to stick them in a new QT as they have the biofilm and bacteria from the tank they came from. 

Can I put them in another display tank or do I set up QT for 2 shrimp and snail?  I'm lacking another heater for QT tank.  My back up one is being used right now.  

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

If the parameters in the other tanks are as good or better than what they came from I wouldn't have any issues putting them in there as long as the tankmates are compatible. 🙂 

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:28 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

If the parameters in the other tanks are as good or better than what they came from I wouldn't have any issues putting them in there as long as the tankmates are compatible. 🙂 

I will double check the parameters before I move them.  I just need to set up a good hiding spot for the shrimp so they are comfortable with the move.  The snail will be fine with the move.  🤗

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

Oh yeah our snail friends are derpy and I love them, they just go with the flow. 🐌 Shrimp are more sensitive and yes need hiding places. I've never been able to keep any shrimp alive so I give you kudos for the Bamboo Shrimp, that's a pretty incredible shrimp.

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:41 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

Oh yeah our snail friends are derpy and I love them, they just go with the flow. 🐌 Shrimp are more sensitive and yes need hiding places. I've never been able to keep any shrimp alive so I give you kudos for the Bamboo Shrimp, that's a pretty incredible shrimp.

The bamboo shrimp have been a challenge and unfortunately lost one but the other 2 are doing great.  They hide so much ...wish we would see them more.  I just started using snails in my tanks so I'm still trying to make sure they are taken care of. I have micro spider crabs in my 10 gallon that are fun to watch when you get the opportunity to see them.  That's my next tank to get live plants and driftwood.  I keep boiling this piece of wood...it's still making the water dark red/brown.  Any tricks?  😂

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

@laritheloud is one of our excellent Gourami keepers she may be able to help us too, if nothing else id'ing what kind of Gourami you have. 😉

😃 to get rid of tannis in a piece of wood? Nope, just what you are doing. Boiling, dumping, boiling dumping @Streetwise would be rolling over in pain to see that though. Tannins ARE good for your tanks, but I get not all of us are going for that look. If you have indoor or outdoor plants I hope you are using that water on them though- they'll appreciate it. 

[laritheloud]

You have a powder blue dwarf gourami and he looks like a bloated male. I'm so sorry you're dealing with this! It's always sad to see a fish suffer under your care. I want to start out by saying this is likely nothing at all that you have done wrong. Dwarf Gouramis tend to be a little genetically weak and prone to illness these days, which is really sad and rarely (if ever) the fault of the fishkeeper.

@xXInkedPhoenixX has given you excellent treatment advice. He looks to be suffering with an internal infection. Depending on the illness your dwarf gourami is suffering from, it's really a 50/50 whether it'll affect your other fish at all. There's a chance it is viral (Dwarf Gourami Iridovirus; if it is iridovirus, he will worsen very quickly, I'm sorry to say), in which case, he is likely the only fish that will be affected. I would attempt to isolate him and treat him on his own first as the other fish may not develop symptoms at all. If you are able to successfully treat him, then I would move on to treating the other fish he lives with.

I really hope for the best outcome for your beautiful boy. Gouramis of all kinds are some of my favorite fish. When did you purchase him, by the way? Was it recently?

[Danabana]

On 2/6/2022 at 3:53 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said:

@laritheloud is one of our excellent Gourami keepers she may be able to help us too, if nothing else id'ing what kind of Gourami you have. 😉

😃 to get rid of tannis in a piece of wood? Nope, just what you are doing. Boiling, dumping, boiling dumping @Streetwise would be rolling over in pain to see that though. Tannins ARE good for your tanks, but I get not all of us are going for that look. If you have indoor or outdoor plants I hope you are using that water on them though- they'll appreciate it. 

I'm trying not to have that look in my tank but I'm doubting this piece of driftwood will ever stop bleeding tannins.  I'm in western PA ...I'm buried in ice and snow.  No outdoor plants to treat.  😂