Nutrient Deficiency (Java Ferns)

[Rewcolee1]

This is a 75g aquarium. I use Flourish, Trace and  occasionally Nitrogen. I dose per the instructions to adding a little more. I also use Easy Green root tabs per the instructions.

 

Typically 30% water changes ever week to every other week.

 

Nothing has changed in the tank. Light setting have remained the same. They have been thriving but now all look the same. I could have sworn there was a older post laying out what the causes could be, but I cannot find it.

 

Thoughts and help appreciated.😃

Edited January 10 by Rewcolee1

[JoeQ]

If the plants grew something changed in the tank (more plant matter that needed to be fed) . The recommended dose is an approximation, as plants grow you need to increase your dosage.

[nabokovfan87]

I think what you're dealing with is BBA on the plant causing it to not be able to grow properly.  BBA likes to thrive on dying plants.  So as the plant condition gets worse and worse, the bba can thrive easier.  It's a fickle situation because there's a lot of things at play... plant placement, filtration, circulation, nutrient density, light intensity, etc.

Let's take a look at the whole situation and try to dial in what could be causing the algae to thrive, then we can talk about treatment.  Following that, you'll be able to dive into other issues that might be going on with the tank.

Is the rhizome for the fern buried in the substrate?

[Rewcolee1]

On 1/10/2024 at 6:14 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I think what you're dealing with is BBA on the plant causing it to not be able to grow properly.  BBA likes to thrive on dying plants.  So as the plant condition gets worse and worse, the bba can thrive easier.  It's a fickle situation because there's a lot of things at play... plant placement, filtration, circulation, nutrient density, light intensity, etc.

Let's take a look at the whole situation and try to dial in what could be causing the algae to thrive, then we can talk about treatment.  Following that, you'll be able to dive into other issues that might be going on with the tank.

Is the rhizome for the fern buried in the substrate?

Other than the one in the 3rd picture down no they are not. Over time the 3rd one down does look like it’s gotten buried. 
 

I was going to attach my light schedule and settings, but I’m not home and will need to do that later.

[Rube_Goldfish]

My automatic response when I see "Java fern" and "nutrient deficiency" is to think potassium, since they're are potassium hogs. I admit u don't know the compositions of Flourish and Trace, so you may already be dosing enough potassium, but my ferns got a lot better when I started adding a little API Leaf Zone to my liquid Easy Green regimen.

[Rewcolee1]

On 1/10/2024 at 6:14 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I think what you're dealing with is BBA on the plant causing it to not be able to grow properly.  BBA likes to thrive on dying plants.  So as the plant condition gets worse and worse, the bba can thrive easier.  It's a fickle situation because there's a lot of things at play... plant placement, filtration, circulation, nutrient density, light intensity, etc.

Let's take a look at the whole situation and try to dial in what could be causing the algae to thrive, then we can talk about treatment.  Following that, you'll be able to dive into other issues that might be going on with the tank.

Is the rhizome for the fern buried in the substrate?

Here is my light schedule. I do not think it’s a lighting issue. I have this setting for 2+yrs now.

 

On 1/10/2024 at 8:37 PM, Rube_Goldfish said:

My automatic response when I see "Java fern" and "nutrient deficiency" is to think potassium, since they're are potassium hogs. I admit u don't know the compositions of Flourish and Trace, so you may already be dosing enough potassium, but my ferns got a lot better when I started adding a little API Leaf Zone to my liquid Easy Green regimen.

I at 1 point did dose extra potassium. I didn’t  notice a huge difference, and have not dosed it for 6 months or so.

Edited January 11 by Rewcolee1

[nabokovfan87]

On 1/10/2024 at 6:12 PM, Rewcolee1 said:

Here is my light schedule. I do not think it’s a lighting issue. I have this setting for 2+yrs now.

To give you an idea....

My light schedule for anubias, which grows extremely similar to Java fern, in a 29G aquarium is about 25-35% maximum.

I would also recommend capping the blue at a max of 5% to try and curb algae. When it comes to a night mode you'd want the light to be off to minimize algae as well.

Right now, your light window is 9.30-21.30 which puts you at about 12 hours. The general guideline is a max of about 8 hours. Anything longer almost always encourages algae.

Now....

Your tank is using the Aquasky light. Please be sure to check this out as a starting resource.

I have also used the aquasky in my tank for several years, but have moved on to the planted 3.0 lights.

 

On 1/10/2024 at 6:12 PM, Rewcolee1 said:

I at 1 point did dose extra potassium. I did notice a huge difference, and have not dosed it for 6 months or so.

Ferns have been known to be potassium hogs. All of that being said I think the place to start is algae removal and reduction and give the plants a fighting chance to outcompete it.

A hydrogen peroxide treatment on the plants wouldn't be a bad place to start. There's also the jurijs method where you soak the plants for 3 days in an algaecide solution like flourish excel (or easy carbon).

I am sure that's a lot to digest and may lead to further questions. Please feel free to tag me and ask for any further elaboration.

On 1/10/2024 at 4:28 PM, Rewcolee1 said:

Other than the one in the 3rd picture down no they are not. Over time the 3rd one down does look like it’s gotten buried. 

Yeah. You'd want to go ahead and make sure the rhizomes are good to go, not rotting, and that the leaves themselves aren't dying as a result.

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 1/10/2024 at 8:37 PM, Rube_Goldfish said:

My automatic response when I see "Java fern" and "nutrient deficiency" is to think potassium, since they're are potassium hogs

Same!

[Pepere]

On 1/10/2024 at 4:14 PM, Rewcolee1 said:

This is a 75g aquarium. I use Flourish, Trace and  occasionally Nitrogen. I dose per the instructions to adding a little more. I also use Easy Green root tabs per the instructions.

 

Is it only Java Fern that you have an issue with?  I am confused about the mention of the root tabs…Do you have your Java fern placed in the substrate as opposed to glued or wegdedi to a rock crack or driftwood?

[Rewcolee1]

On 1/11/2024 at 9:03 AM, Pepere said:

Is it only Java Fern that you have an issue with?  I am confused about the mention of the root tabs…Do you have your Java fern placed in the substrate as opposed to glued or wegdedi to a rock crack or driftwood?

I am just mentioning root tabs to cover all fertilizers that I am using in the tank. Yes, the Ferns are the only plant I’m having issues with as all others appear to be happy and healthy.

On 1/11/2024 at 3:27 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

To give you an idea....

My light schedule for anubias, which grows extremely similar to Java fern, in a 29G aquarium is about 25-35% maximum.

I would also recommend capping the blue at a max of 5% to try and curb algae. When it comes to a night mode you'd want the light to be off to minimize algae as well.

Right now, your light window is 9.30-21.30 which puts you at about 12 hours. The general guideline is a max of about 8 hours. Anything longer almost always encourages algae.

Now....

Your tank is using the Aquasky light. Please be sure to check this out as a starting resource.

I have also used the aquasky in my tank for several years, but have moved on to the planted 3.0 lights.

 

Ferns have been known to be potassium hogs. All of that being said I think the place to start is algae removal and reduction and give the plants a fighting chance to outcompete it.

A hydrogen peroxide treatment on the plants wouldn't be a bad place to start. There's also the jurijs method where you soak the plants for 3 days in an algaecide solution like flourish excel (or easy carbon).

I am sure that's a lot to digest and may lead to further questions. Please feel free to tag me and ask for any further elaboration.

Yeah. You'd want to go ahead and make sure the rhizomes are good to go, not rotting, and that the leaves themselves aren't dying as a result.

Yes, definitely a ton of great info here. I truly appreciate it. I’ll respond back with additional questions that may come up.

[Rewcolee1]

I’ve adjusted my blue levels in the light and did a massive cleaning today. I also ordered some potassium and will start trying to attack the areas that seem to be potential areas of concern for BBA.

[Rewcolee1]

Hi again. Something that has been sticking with me, but I’m not even sure what to think of it. The bottom picture I originally attached shows the whole aquarium. Java ferns aside, all the other plants, especially the Swords and Crypts are doing better than they ever have. so maybe in doing something right. 
 

I guess the question could be: Can dosing Potassium for the ferns negatively impact other types of plants?

[JoeQ]

Plants love Potassium and its not usually dosed enough of. Be ware tho,  massive over dose(s} of potassium (long term) will cause problems absorbing calcium.