Is this product shrimp/snail safe?

[Lennie]

Today I noticed one of the farlowellas in my quarantine tank showed synptoms of ich.

We dont have ich X in my country but this is the closes thing I can find based on the ingredients. It says not safe for them but I see many people saying the ingredients were fine to use online. What do you think?

I also have methylene blue and aquarium salt on hand as well as heater. 

@Colu @Odd Duck

product info (hope it is readable)

 

maybe u can see lil dots. There arent so many but def there

 

Edited December 24, 2023 by Lennie

[Colu]

On 12/24/2023 at 10:53 AM, Lennie said:

Today I noticed one of the farlowellas in my quarantine tank showed synptoms of ich.

We dont have ich X in my country but this is the closes thing I can find based on the ingredients. It says not safe for them but I see many people saying the ingredients were fine to use online. What do you think?

I also have methylene blue and aquarium salt on hand as well as heater. 

@Colu @Odd Duck

product info (hope it is readable)

 

maybe u can see lil dots. There arent so many but def there

 

Malachite green and formaldehyde solution should be fine to use just monitor your whiptails just in case they have a reaction to the medication and do a water change if you have  any issues 

Edited December 24, 2023 by Colu

[Lennie]

On 12/24/2023 at 2:22 PM, Colu said:

Malachite green and formaldehyde solution should be fine to use just monitor your whiptails just in case they have a reaction to the medication and do a water change if you have  any issues 

You mean fine for shrimp and snails too?

it is not exactly a “quarantine”. It is just a species only tank that has shrimp one mystery snail(easy to catch) and farlowellas and they need to use woof and leaflitter to graze on and feel safe

I can easily catch the mystery snail baby but shrimp is hard

[Colu]

On 12/24/2023 at 11:24 AM, Lennie said:

You mean fine for shrimp and snails too?

it is not exactly a “quarantine”. It is just a species only tank that has shrimp one mystery snail(easy to catch) and farlowellas and they need to use woof and leaflitter to graze on and feel safe

I can easily catch the mystery snail baby but shrimp is hard

At the appropriate dose it's not toxic to shrimp or snails 

[Lennie]

On 12/24/2023 at 2:25 PM, Colu said:

At the appropriate dose it's not toxic to shrimp or snails 

Thanks Colu. I see you suggesting adding salt too usually for electrolytes in other posts. Want me to add a lil salt too and increase the temp or skip it for farlowellas? The tank is set to 25C.

 

The last time I had to deal wkth ich was 15 years ago. 😭

[Colu]

On 12/24/2023 at 11:27 AM, Lennie said:

Thanks Colu. I see you suggesting adding salt too usually for electrolytes in other posts. Want me to add a lil salt too and increase the temp or skip it for farlowellas? The tank is set to 25C.

 

The last time I had to deal wkth ich was 15 years ago. 😭

Yes I would add a small amount of aquarium salt 1 table spoon for 10 gallons you could gradually raise the temperature 

[Lennie]

On 12/24/2023 at 2:32 PM, Colu said:

Yes I would add a small amount of aquarium salt 1 table spoon for 10 gallons you could gradually raise the temperature 

Noted!

Btw, I might be just making it up on my mind. The sand in very fine in this tank around 0.2-0.5mm and light colored. As farlowellas have a tough skin like plecos, I think it is possible that it is just very fine sand particles attached around on one while sifting around. I will observe more and see how it goes. I dont see many of those spots I saw this morning

These 4 have been living together for a while before I get them and since I got them last tuesday. How likely one would start having ich anyway?

I will apply medication if I am certain it is a start of ich but not sand. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Silly me. At least I did my daily sport by walking to my LFS to get the medicine

*smiles in pain*

[Colu]

On 12/24/2023 at 11:32 AM, Colu said:

Yes I would add a small amount of aquarium salt 1 table spoon for 10 gallons you could gradually raise the temperature 

There's some debate as to Whether ich is always in your tank and periods of stress cause outbreaks or it has to be introduced to your tank from an infected fish hopefully its just sand stuck to your fish 

[Lennie]

On 12/24/2023 at 3:52 PM, Colu said:

There's some debate as to Whether ich is always in your tank and periods of stress cause outbreaks or it has to be introduced to your tank from an infected fish hopefully its just sand stuck to your fish 

I no longer think it is sand. The thing is, it is still only on one fish. That being said, there were many dots today.

Anyway,

I added the recommended dose of the medicine and added the amount of salt you recommended. Put in an airstone for oxygen. Didn't increase the temperature, Idk if I should. So it is still 25C.

I keep reading conflictive stuff about the temperature, some even claiming if you use formalin, then the high temperature might even make it toxic. Also it seems to effect fish gills, so higher temperature would lead to even lower oxygen content, so might have a negative impact in this regard too I suppose? As far as I know we use heat to fasten the cycle of ich right? Am I fine at 25C or boost it to something like 28C?

 

Btw my friend said it looks more like Velvet than ich. What do you think? Malachite green and formaldehyde should work for both anyway right?

 

In terms of behavior it looks fine BUT it does not want to stay still. Always moving. I assume it is being itchy and try to rub itself to glass and surfaces maybe.

Edited December 25, 2023 by Lennie

[Colu]

On 12/25/2023 at 10:50 AM, Lennie said:

I no longer think it is sand. The thing is, it is still only on one fish. That being said, there were many dots today.

Anyway,

I added the recommended dose of the medicine and added the amount of salt you recommended. Put in an airstone for oxygen. Didn't increase the temperature, Idk if I should. So it is still 25C.

I keep reading conflictive stuff about the temperature, some even claiming if you use formalin, then the high temperature might even make it toxic. Also it seems to effect fish gills, so higher temperature would lead to even lower oxygen content, so might have a negative impact in this regard too I suppose? As far as I know we use heat to fasten the cycle of ich right? Am I fine at 25C or boost it to something like 28C?

 

Btw my friend said it looks more like Velvet than ich. What do you think? Malachite green and formaldehyde should work for both anyway right?

 

In terms of behavior it looks fine BUT it does not want to stay still. Always moving. I assume it is being itchy and try to rub itself to glass and surfaces maybe.

Doesn't look like velvet to me it might just be the picture quality the spots look raised are the spots raised or flat if they raise you could be dealing epistylis 

[Lennie]

On 12/25/2023 at 2:31 PM, Colu said:

Doesn't look like velvet to me it might just be the picture quality the spots look raised are the spots raised or flat if they raise you could be dealing epistylis 

I have kanaplex. Should I dose it together with the malachite green/formaldehyde medicine I have or wait?

I can dose the water column but I don't think these would eat any food I mix kanaplex in.

[Colu]

On 12/25/2023 at 11:38 AM, Lennie said:

I have kanaplex. Should I dose it together with the malachite green/formaldehyde medicine I have or wait?

I can dose the water column but I don't think these would eat any food I mix kanaplex in.

When you look at the spots are they completely flat  or are they are they raised that will let me no what medication to treat with 

Edited December 25, 2023 by Colu

[Lennie]

On 12/25/2023 at 2:43 PM, Colu said:

When you look at the spots are they completely flat  or are they are they raised that will let me no what medication to treat with 

I can't differentiate much 😭sorry. As these guys have a weird skin, it is hard to say if it is supposed to be flat on a normal fish or not. I tried to take better pics:

[Colu]

On 12/25/2023 at 12:01 PM, Lennie said:

I can't differentiate much 😭sorry. As these guys have a weird skin, it is hard to say if it is supposed to be flat on a normal fish or not. I tried to take better pics:

That looks like epistylis to me that feeds off of gram negative bacteria on the slime coat of your fish and spreads more quickly at higher temperatures most effective treatments are  broad antibiotic such as maracyn2 or kanaplex and malachite green which is the active ingredient in the medication your using so I would keep treating with malachite green and dose the tank with kanaplex 

Edited December 25, 2023 by Colu

[Odd Duck]

@Colu is exactly right on the treatments.  Those look like raised spots that are somewhat irregular in size like Epistylus instead of nearly identical and flat like Ich.  Don’t raise the temp as that favors the Epistylus.

[Lennie]

On 12/27/2023 at 7:58 PM, Odd Duck said:

@Colu is exactly right on the treatments.  Those look like raised spots that are somewhat irregular in size like Epistylus instead of nearly identical and flat like Ich.  Don’t raise the temp as that favors the Epistylus.

Thanks Duck. I didn't raise the temperature.

Its day 3 on the treatment. So far I used malachitegreen/formaldehyde medicine on Day1 and 3 as suggested. Same goes for Kanaplex. Day1 and 3, dosed in the water column.

I blacked out the tank as I saw something like malachite green being sensetive to light. Idk if it is true but I wanted to play safe. Also since I thought it might be velvet and I saw velvet being photosynthetic I wanted to keep it dark too.

I added the recommended amount of salt by Colu.

 

Approximately how long does it take Epistylus to heal? I don't see any visual improvement or it getting worse. Looking stable.

 

Malachite green/formaldehyde medicine says Use day 1 and 3. If needed, you can continue to apply on day 5 and 7. So far shrimp and snail shows no stress but extra day 5 and 7 applications may be concerning? Maybe I should do a water change, readd the removed salt ratio, and dose malachite green/formaldehyde medicine back on day 5 and 7?

[Odd Duck]

You should start to see a difference soon.  The spots will usually start disappearing in 5 to 7 days.  Make sure you are doing everything to reduce stress, too.  Since it’s primarily on one fish, that fish is stressed for some reason.  Stress causes reduced immune system function.  Try adding more hiding spots.  Dimming the light is an excellent choice - good thinking there.  I often forget to mention things like that.

And see what spots look like on day 5 and 7.  If still present, I would do exactly as planned, - water change, add back salt, and redose one or both of those days if spots are still there.

[Lennie]

On 12/27/2023 at 8:29 PM, Odd Duck said:

You should start to see a difference soon.  The spots will usually start disappearing in 5 to 7 days.  Make sure you are doing everything to reduce stress, too.  Since it’s primarily on one fish, that fish is stressed for some reason.  Stress causes reduced immune system function.  Try adding more hiding spots.  Dimming the light is an excellent choice - good thinking there.  I often forget to mention things like that.

And see what spots look like on day 5 and 7.  If still present, I would do exactly as planned, - water change, add back salt, and redose one or both of those days if spots are still there.

Thank you!🩵

[Lennie]

@Colu @Odd Duck Thank you so much for your help again guys. Today the fish seems perfectly fine snacking on leaf litter. I haven't noticed any dots on any. 🥳🥳🥳🤗

 

Shrimp and the mystery snail still show no stress behavior whatsoever. I will just use the third dose of kanaplex tomorrow just in case but not planning to add more malachite green/formaldehyde medicine as it is mainly recommended for day 1 and 3 and day 5 and 7 if really needed. Then the next day I will do a water change and add a small HOB filled with activated carbon.

I'm happy that everyone is great and doing well again🩵