Algae problems, questions about fertilization.

[Mmiller2001]

On 9/16/2023 at 6:52 AM, riioKen said:

Thanks but, the rotalas looked way better last week. The macrandra had nice reds but now seems melting, even new growth are melting...

 

Do you suspect a "burn" due to high Fe?

.5 is slightly high, even for EI these days. AR and rotala species can get like this if micros are being overdosed so it's a possibility. Macranda in general, likes a leaner dosing regiment and if the lower micros don't show improvement, I'd back Macro's down slightly. The soil should cover any problems. Dennis Wong (the 2HRaquarist) doses at .32 ppm Fe if I remember correctly.

[riioKen]

The new tank is almost done.

 

2 weeks in dark start, I see 0.25 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 100 nitrates. Should be almost ready.

 

Do you suggest to buy brand new plants or pick some from my other tank?

 

My tank is 60cm tall (50 considering 8-15cm front-back soil thickness), I think that my intake is a bit short, it's 28cm. The other filter will have an intake with skimmer which should be 30 or 35cm

 

 

[riioKen]

On 9/16/2023 at 2:43 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

Watch the new growth

It's been a few weeks since the last update. I went back to using APT3 (but created by myself with dry ferts).

 

The results are "amazing", I am currently dosing exactly the recommended dosage, but have been adding 1ppm more po4 per week. In this way, after almost 10 days, I see little new growth in GSA (should I increase po4 just a bit more?).

 

But moreover, I made a radical change, I switched to having the light on for 4 hours (+ 1 hour ramp up and dim), at 50%. After I did this change, I can clearly see algae fades away day after day. My bucephalandra are cleaning themselves from algae, same thing for Althernathera reickii. I still have some black stripes on the leaves of Rotala orange juice and rotala h'ra, but are growing (rotala orange juice need a trim every 2 weeks, h'ra is slower).

After almost 10 days, I noticed that some plants are bending towards the light, so I thought of increasing the light to 60% and see if I will have new algae growth.

 

[Mmiller2001]

On 9/30/2023 at 2:32 PM, riioKen said:

I see little new growth in GSA (should I increase po4 just a bit more?).

Just a bit more. Don’t want to overshoot by too much.

awesome to hear things are getting better. My tank has taken a nose dive 😆

[riioKen]

On 9/30/2023 at 10:44 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

My tank has taken a nose dive

Ahhahaha how? If you check 2 comment ago, i have installed the week aqua light, the tank is doing a Dark Start period (almost 3 week in).

Ammonia 0, nitrites 0, 100 nitrates, I need a WC for sure 

[JoeQ]

Cool! Have any pictures? What's your recipe??

[Mmiller2001]

On 9/30/2023 at 2:46 PM, riioKen said:

Ahhahaha how? If you check 2 comment ago, i have installed the week aqua light, the tank is doing a Dark Start period (almost 3 week in).

Ammonia 0, nitrites 0, 100 nitrates, I need a WC for sure 

Those lights rock. Absolutely love them 

I gutted the plants and algae and green water now.

Edited September 30, 2023 by Mmiller2001

[riioKen]

On 9/30/2023 at 11:32 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

I gutted the plants and algae and green water now.

 

Your tank looks stunning even with algae lol.

 

@JoeQ

The APT3 "Clone" Recipe is:

Macro 10ml x 100L daily, 500ml container

- 8,8g KNO3 
- 3g KH2PO4 
- 15,9g K2SO4 
- 12,2g MgSO4 

Micro 10ml x 100L daily, 500ml container

- 1,8g APFUK Chelated Trace Elements (the target is 0,21ppm FE, which is the only nutrient available in the "micro" mix for APT3)

This gives me weekly

- 7,56ppm NO3

- 2,94ppm PO4 (i add 1ppm more due GSA per week)

- 15,96ppm K

- 1,68ppm MG

- 0,21ppm Fe

 

I tried EI but my macrandra after only 1 week had brown/green shades in it, now its again red.

Edited September 30, 2023 by riioKen

[JoeQ]

Might have to mix up a batch to try it, but "container size" drives me nuts! Its the amount of liquid used that is the important part when making a solution!! Container size (I believe) has little impact.

Edited September 30, 2023 by JoeQ

[riioKen]

On 10/1/2023 at 12:14 AM, JoeQ said:

Container size (I believe) has little impact.

I wrote container size, because I used 500ml of water, you can use the same amount of water with a container of 2 litres, it doesn't matter. 

Edited September 30, 2023 by riioKen

[JoeQ]

On 9/30/2023 at 6:18 PM, riioKen said:

I wrote container size, because I used 500ml of water, you can use the same amount of water with a container of 2 litres, it doesn't matter. 

I know, its just a pet peeve with rotalabutterfly.com

[Mmiller2001]

On 9/30/2023 at 3:47 PM, riioKen said:

This gives me weekly

- 7,56ppm NO3

- 2,94ppm PO4 (i add 1ppm more due GSA per week)

- 15,96ppm K

- 1,68ppm MG

- 0,21ppm Fe

Is this the weekly total or accumulation total?

Also, I wonder why most liquid fertilizer adds Mg. I keep asking about it but don’t ever get a clear answer. Dennis obviously thinks it’s necessary and Mg is included in most liquid fertilizer but I often get the answer of my 8ppm Mg is enough when front loaded?

[JoeQ]

On 9/30/2023 at 7:55 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

Is this the weekly total or accumulation total?

Also, I wonder why most liquid fertilizer adds Mg. I keep asking about it but don’t ever get a clear answer. Dennis obviously thinks it’s necessary and Mg is included in most liquid fertilizer but I often get the answer of my 8ppm Mg is enough when front loaded?

This seems to be the weekly totals. Daily it breaks down to:

Kno3 ~ 1.08ppm

Kh2p04 ~ 0.42ppm

K2so4 ~ 1.43ppm

Mgso4 ~ 0.24ppm

Edited October 1, 2023 by JoeQ

[riioKen]

On 10/1/2023 at 2:21 AM, JoeQ said:

This seems to be the weekly totals. Daily it breaks down to:

Kno3 ~ 1.08ppm

Kh2p04 ~ 0.42ppm

K2so4 ~ 1.43ppm

Mgso4 ~ 0.24ppm

Exactly, should be 0.030ppm Fe daily too.

 

I have a question for both of you, as I said, seems that plants are fighting algae from their leaves (even bucephalandra is cleaning his roots and leaves) GSA isn't growing or at least not fast, but I'm growing some filamentous algae on the glass, which is strange for me. Some taller plants are bending to the middle, where the light is, should I increase intensity without touching the photoperiod time?

 

[JoeQ]

The light is usually way down on my list for algae prevention. So before I answer that I have a few questions for you.

What does your water change scheduled look like. Do you know your TDS range? How heavily planted are you? What critters are there? How long has this tank been running (is is the new one)? And can you provide pictures?

Also on your mix, the general rule is that you want a 10:1 ratio when it comes to nitrates/phosphate. Currently your daily dose is much higher at 1.08:0.42

Where as my moderately heavily planted EI dose is 1.07:0.19 every other day with a 50% water change on day 7 to keep nutrients in balance.

Keeping high quality consistent water might be your problem, light is always the quick fix (which never really helps much); rather the programmed knee jerk reaction.

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by JoeQ

[JoeQ]

Also, hows your flow? Usually filimentous algae is a flow issue

[riioKen]

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

What does your water change scheduled look like

50% every 7 days

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

Do you know your TDS range?

140 - 160ppm

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

How heavily planted are you?

Around 50%, I'll post photos after the WC and maintenance that I should do later this day.

 

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

What critters are there?

6 otos and 1 amano shrimp, sadly 1 amano died a week ago, idk why, but this one seems healthy and did a molt 2 days ago.

 

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

How long has this tank been running (is is the new one)?

Is running since May with tropica aqua soil.

 

On 10/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, JoeQ said:

Also on your mix, the general rule is that you want a 10:1 ratio when it comes to nitrates/phosphate. Currently your daily dose is much higher at 1.08:0.42

True, I heard about redfield ratio, but I noticed a bloom in GSA which it lessened when I increased my po4 1ppm more.

On 10/1/2023 at 2:43 PM, JoeQ said:

Also, hows your flow? Usually filimentous algae is a flow issue

I'm using a Biomaster Thermo 600, on a 20g tank, the flow should be fine.

[Mmiller2001]

Is it the short fuzzy kind?

[JoeQ]

Heres mine, compared to Mmiller2001 tank I think it looks like a pile of puke. But still a lot better than the average tank. 

 

[Mmiller2001]

On 10/1/2023 at 7:05 AM, JoeQ said:

Heres mine, compared to Mmiller2001 tank I think it looks like a pile of puke. But still a lot better than the average tank. 

 

Looks healthy to me. The only thing different is I group plants towards Dutch rules.

[riioKen]

The tank right now is a farm, because I need plants to use in my 300L.

 

Last thing that I didn't tried is to "clone" APT1, so 0 nitrates and 0 phosphate and see how it goes from there.

 

Considering I'm dosing 7ppm per week of no3, but after testing the nitrates, seems that it is around 20ppm which is way higher than expected. The tap water has 2ppm.

Edited October 1, 2023 by riioKen

[JoeQ]

Beautiful! Slowly backs away from conversation! 🤣

[JoeQ]

On 10/1/2023 at 9:10 AM, Mmiller2001 said:

Looks healthy to me. The only thing different is I group plants towards Dutch rules.

Healthy BUT..... I always feel out classed when tanks have artistic visual appeal. My design style is the jungle tank, with a touch of 'lets see if this grows here' and a pich of "For *&@%s sake, just jam that s@#& somewhere and call it a day!!!!" 😂😂😂😂

Edited October 1, 2023 by JoeQ

[JoeQ]

Just curious, did you bump your FE up to 0.32 and if so did you notice any difference? @riioKen

[riioKen]

On 10/7/2023 at 1:55 PM, JoeQ said:

Just curious, did you bump your FE up to 0.32 and if so did you notice any difference?

No, I didn't notice any difference, in fact I bumped Fe to 0.5, but I start to see some decoloration on new and old growth (and I lost 1 amano, but probably it was just a coincidence), now I'm at 0.3 weekly and seems fine. New growth are healthy but rotala h'ra and orange juice has horizontal black stirpes on old growth.