Struggling with high PH and ammonia

[Sultrysamurai]

Hello, I’m new at this and trying to do this right. I couldn’t locate resources on here about how to manage the PH levels and ammonia levels.
If anyone has advice for a newbie that would be great.

i have a 10gallon new tank that has been cycling ( not even sure if I’m doing this correctly) for 3 weeks.
No fish in the tank but I did put plants from Aquarium coOp.
I have a sponge filter and sand substrate, LED lights and 4 plants. Testing PH and ammonia and both are high. I added Catappa leaves with no help. 

I added the all in one fertilizer and a root cap fertilizer last Friday to help the plants. 
 

PH is  7.8 and ammonia is .50PP 

Temp stays between 68 and 75

The plants do not look well. 

This is becoming a bit more then I bargained for, so any guidance is appreciated. Thank you. 
 

I do want a betta fish and some shrimp if I ever get the water to safe levels.. that’s my end goal haha. 
 

 

Edited September 14, 2022 by Sultrysamurai
Spelling

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Starting with the ammonia question, this video is so good at breaking down what is happening with water chemistry in new tanks

 

Driftwood and leaves help lower pH.  Don't worry about the pH yet.  Focus on getting through the nitrogen cycle and then you can work on pH.  If you try to work on it now and end up doing water changes, the pH is going to go back up with the addition of tap water back to the tank.

Edited September 14, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Many plants are grown partially out of water, and when they are submerged they can go through a melting process.  That's normal for new plants.  You'll want to just trim off dead stuff but leave the healthier leaves and the roots and the plants should spring back.  Also plants LOVE ammonia!  They use it as a food source.

[JettsPapa]

I believe @Chick-In-Of-TheSeanailed it.  My pH is higher than yours (8.2), and most plants do just fine.  Also, plants use ammonia, so that's also unlikely to be the problem (unless it's extraordinarily high; you just said it's high and didn't give a value).

[Sultrysamurai]

Thank you! The ammonia came back as .50pp. Which everything online said was too high for fish. 
I may just be too eager for the cycling process to be complete. 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 9/14/2022 at 2:12 PM, Sultrysamurai said:

Thank you! The ammonia came back as .50pp. Which everything online said was too high for fish. 
I may just be too eager for the cycling process to be complete. 

Happens to all of us!  Some things you can do to speed it up are to use some filter media, decor, and/or substrate from an established tank.  Or you can use bacteria in a bottle.  I like Fritz Zyme 7.

Edited September 14, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[JettsPapa]

On 9/14/2022 at 1:12 PM, Sultrysamurai said:

Thank you! The ammonia came back as .50pp. Which everything online said was too high for fish. 
I may just be too eager for the cycling process to be complete. 

It's a little high for fish, especially in high pH water, but not really very bad.  Fish are generally okay as long as the combined ammonia and nitrites don't exceed 1.0 ppm (for short periods, of course; they should both be near zero long-term).

And that amount is definitely not a problem for plants.

[Janoš Bećar Pecaroš]

Everything has been said already. Very good advice here.

If you want to add fish asap you can use additives like api quick start, but you can just wait out the nitrogen cycle. Test frequently and as soon as ammonia and nitrites are at 0 you can add fish.

[James Hande]

@Sultrysamurai

I'm going to address this from the beginning step by step.

First start by testing your water source. The reading will/could have a bearing on the tank parameters.
We really want to know: Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates, pH, GH, KH and TDS could help knowing.

For the sake of the following I'm going to say your source water does not contain ammonia.

First don't worry about the pH, at 7.8 many farm raised fish would be fine.
Second will say your source water has 0 ammonia but your tank has 0.50ppm. That just means something is dying in the tank such as plant leaves. Having an ammonia reading is the start of the nitrogen cycle. Once the ammonia reading starts coming down watch the nitrites as they will rise and then fall. Once both return to zero you will have a nitrate reading which means you have a cycle going. Now it is safe to add 1 -3 fish to the tank. Slowly stock fish or your cycle could reset it self as the beneficial bacteria will have to reproduce to handle the higher level of ammonia.

If the fish you get are coming from water close to your 7.8 pH then no problem. But if they're coming from let's say 6.8 or 8.5 they will struggle and possibly die. Slow gradual changes in pH are best.

Water hardness is a concern regarding what fish species you want to keep. Soft water fish have an easier time adjusting to harder water. But hard water species can not adapt to soft water. Has to do with dissolved minerals and what the fish need through osmoregulation.

As for plant problems... as mentioned most plants have to adjust to under water growth. It will look like they are dying when the are just converting. The old leaves can not adjust to being under water so they will die and fall off the plant. Just be on the look out for new leaf growth. What most new to the hobby don't realize is that you are actually buying the plant roots.

So in closing... just keep watching the ammonia level every 3 or 4 days, then the nitrites until they both drop to zero. Watch the plants for new leaves.

[Sultrysamurai]

Thank you so much this and all the above advice have been very helpful!!

[CJhilljack]

I hope it's ok to hop onto this thread. I am having a similar issue with my jar tanks. Both are new, set up mid-September 1 gallon & 2 gallon size.

My well water base levels are: Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0, PH varies between 8.2 & 8.4. I have not yet purchased test kits for the KH, etc, but when we had the well tested professionally (something overdue to be done again), it tested as soft with a high PH. I wasn't using water conditioner at first, but have been for the past month, just in case there are heavy metals. 

For awhile the ammonia was at 1.0 in both jars for the past couple of weeks. In the 2 gallon jar, the ammonia has been decreasing and I've been seeing nitrite & nitrate rise & fall, but nothing has arrived at zero yet. In the 1 gallon jar, the ammonia is the only change I see, it finally started decreasing this past week or so, but after testing it on Wednesday at .25, it tested today at 5.0. I have been doing weekly water changes. The 1 gallon jar was also quite cloudy, but it has finally cleared up considerably.

The 2 gallon jar has a lot more plants in it than the 1 gallon. It has stem plants, crypts & anubis, with frogbit floaters which all seem to be growing well - especially the frogbit which went from about 4 or 5 plants to a completely covered surface. 

The 1 gallon jar is the one I'm really worried about. It has lucky bamboo, dwarf hairgrass & pearlweed (purchased from Aquarium Coop, thanks!). I did have Christmas Java moss in both, but I have since taken it all out - I didn't plant it correctly and I didn't like the brown color. This jar also has an odd, red something growing in the gravel at the front of the tank. Is this a type of algae? 

I have snails in both tanks 1 nerite each & 1 blue ramshorn each (plus pond snails that appeared on their own) which seem to be doing well. I am wondering if the smaller jar needs more plants? Are there not enough plants to process the ammonia? I had shrimp in both tanks too, 3 in each, but they all died when the ammonia spiked. 

I should add, both jars have organic potting soil substrate. The 2 gallon jar has a sand cap and the 1 gallon jar has gravel cap. I've had a tough time planting the 1 gallon, I've tried to add some other plants, but haven't been able to bury them properly & they ended up floating & rotting. 😞 

I included photos of both jars in my introduction today, but here's the small jar again, for visual on plant quantity.