Potassium Deficiency

[Mmiller2001]

On 1/14/2022 at 2:17 PM, Lauren A said:

So, my Gh is 89.5 and my Kh is 71.6.  I hope I did the test right.  I used the API kit to and it took 5 drops for the Gh to turn to the right color but it was very very light green and 4 drops for the Kh.  I think I did the conversion chart right - I compared total drops to the gh/Kh column for each one.  It falls in line with the test strips but just more accurate.

It's always better to report GH and KH in degrees. So your GH is 5dGH and KH is 4dKH; which is is different from your previous testing. Which is good! We won't need to adjust the GH to increase it. I believe the API tests over any test strip (if that's what you used previously). Hang on to the CaSo4 and MgSo4, it lasts forever and you might try fish that like high GH in the future, or if your source water ever changes you will have it ready to use if need be!

As I stated earlier, I think you just need to dose more easy green. I dose my non CO2 tanks to 30ppm K, and I would like to see yours a bit higher. Shoot for 20 to 25ppm K, you will just pump more Easy Green. Unfortunately, all in one ferts lock you in to their ratio, so you will just have to see what happens by increasing the dose as a whole.

If you change 4 gallons and add 4 gallons, dose a bit less than 3ml of Easy Green. That's 18ppmNo3, 1ppmPO4, 12ppmK and .2ppmFe(proxy). Watch the new growth and see if it improves(3 weeks or so). If it looks the same, go to 4ml. That's 24ppmNO3, 1.3ppmPO4, 16.1ppmK and .3ppmFe(proxy). So on, so forth.

Last question. What is your pH? the iron in EG is EDTA and a pH over 6.8 will lock out iron. The Easy Iron seems to be a mix of Ferrous, EDTA and DTPA. But I don't know in what percent each is.

Edited January 14, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Mmiller2001]

On 1/14/2022 at 2:31 PM, Lauren A said:

One more thing, is there anyway you could confirm I did the conversion chart correct only because 107.4 I think it’s hard water which the strips I always read soft.  Closer to 80,  thx

drop# x 17.9=ppm

I also calculated for a 4 gallon change, adjust accordingly for 3 gallons. I must have miss read.

[Lauren A]

On 1/14/2022 at 6:34 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

It's always better to report GH and KH in degrees. So your GH is 5dGH and KH is 4dKH; which is is different from your previous testing. Which is good! We won't need to adjust the GH to increase it. I believe the API tests over any test strip (if that's what you used previously). Hang on to the CaSo4 and MgSo4, it lasts forever and you might try fish that like high GH in the future, or if your source water ever changes you will have it ready to use if need be!

As I stated earlier, I think you just need to dose more easy green. I dose my non CO2 tanks to 30ppm K, and I would like to see yours a bit higher. Shoot for 20 to 25ppm K, you will just pump more Easy Green. Unfortunately, all in one ferts lock you in to their ratio, so you will just have to see what happens by increasing the dose as a whole.

If you change 4 gallons and add 4 gallons, dose a bit less than 3ml of Easy Green. That's 18ppmNo3, 1ppmPO4, 12ppmK and .2ppmFe(proxy). Watch the new growth and see if it improves(3 weeks or so). If it looks the same, go to 4ml. That's 24ppmNO3, 1.3ppmPO4, 16.1ppmK and .3ppmFe(proxy). So on, so forth.

Last question. What is your pH? the iron in EG is EDTA and a pH over 6.8 will lock out iron. The Easy Iron seems to be a mix of Ferrous, EDTA and DTPA. But I don't know in what percent each is.

Hi,

Thank you so much!  I will definitely hold onto the Mg and Ca.  All of this is such great help and advice.  I’m really excited to see how all of my plants do.  It’s been pretty sad taking care of them lately so it’s a relief to have a plan.  Thank you again very much. Take care and happy new year.  🙏😅

 

 

On 1/14/2022 at 7:31 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

drop# x 17.9=ppm

I also calculated for a 4 gallon change, adjust accordingly for 3 gallons. I must have miss read.

Sounds good!  Thx

[Lauren A]

On 1/14/2022 at 6:34 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

It's always better to report GH and KH in degrees. So your GH is 5dGH and KH is 4dKH; which is is different from your previous testing. Which is good! We won't need to adjust the GH to increase it. I believe the API tests over any test strip (if that's what you used previously). Hang on to the CaSo4 and MgSo4, it lasts forever and you might try fish that like high GH in the future, or if your source water ever changes you will have it ready to use if need be!

As I stated earlier, I think you just need to dose more easy green. I dose my non CO2 tanks to 30ppm K, and I would like to see yours a bit higher. Shoot for 20 to 25ppm K, you will just pump more Easy Green. Unfortunately, all in one ferts lock you in to their ratio, so you will just have to see what happens by increasing the dose as a whole.

If you change 4 gallons and add 4 gallons, dose a bit less than 3ml of Easy Green. That's 18ppmNo3, 1ppmPO4, 12ppmK and .2ppmFe(proxy). Watch the new growth and see if it improves(3 weeks or so). If it looks the same, go to 4ml. That's 24ppmNO3, 1.3ppmPO4, 16.1ppmK and .3ppmFe(proxy). So on, so forth.

Last question. What is your pH? the iron in EG is EDTA and a pH over 6.8 will lock out iron. The Easy Iron seems to be a mix of Ferrous, EDTA and DTPA. But I don't know in what percent each is.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 7:31 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

drop# x 17.9=ppm

I also calculated for a 4 gallon change, adjust accordingly for 3 gallons. I must have miss read.

Hi, I just did a Ph test and it is 7.4 I missed this question last night.  Could this be my problem if iron is being locked out?  Thanks!

(edited ph). I retested a couple times because that number seemed high.  It’s closer to 7.4 maybe a smidge lower.  Still over 6.8

Edited January 15, 2022 by Lauren A
Fixed amount

[Mmiller2001]

Yes, this could be a part of the problem.

My knowledge is weaker here. But I would try dosing the ferrous state of iron. I know Easy Iron has some but I don't know how much or percentage. You could try powder or Seachem Iron. 

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Lauren A]

On 1/15/2022 at 2:59 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

Yes, this could be a part of the problem.

My knowledge is weaker here. But I would try dosing the ferrous state of iron. I know Easy Iron has some but I don't know how much or percentage. You could try powder or Seachem Iron. 

 

I actually have Seachem Flourish Iron.  I also have a lot of floaters.  Maybe too much.  I’d say about 60-75% of the waters surface has them.  I

 

know a lack of CO2 can be an issue.  I have a bubbler that’s pretty strong with fine bubbles and a strong filter - the Fluval Aqua Clear 30.  I have a larger bubbler I could install instead if you recommend it?  Should I dose Easy Carb?  I also have Flourish Excel.  I know it can inhibit algae growth and I want to make sure my snails have food this is the only reason I don’t use it.

 

I am not sure how to get my Ph down.  I keep Indian almond leaves in the tank so I do get a lot of tannins.  A few weeks ago I really darkened my tank with them because my betta, Archie, had a small cut on his side.  It healed up so I’ve eased up on the leaves.  I’m not sure if this influenced anything.  

 

Thanks again for your help!  

On 1/15/2022 at 6:26 PM, Lauren A said:

I actually have Seachem Flourish Iron.  I also have a lot of floaters.  Maybe too much.  I’d say about 60-75% of the waters surface has them.  I

 

know a lack of CO2 can be an issue.  I have a bubbler that’s pretty strong with fine bubbles and a strong filter - the Fluval Aqua Clear 30.  I have a larger bubbler I could install instead if you recommend it?  Should I dose Easy Carb?  I also have Flourish Excel.  I know it can inhibit algae growth and I want to make sure my snails have food this is the only reason I don’t use it.

 

I am not sure how to get my Ph down.  I keep Indian almond leaves in the tank so I do get a lot of tannins.  A few weeks ago I really darkened my tank with them because my betta, Archie, had a small cut on his side.  It healed up so I’ve eased up on the leaves.  I’m not sure if this influenced anything.  

I trust you 100% but want to doubly make sure front loading the ferts will not be too much on Archie.  

Thanks again for your help!  

These are all after thoughts too after doing some research online today.  

Edited January 15, 2022 by Lauren A

[Lauren A]

@Mmiller2001one more thing, I trust you 100% but just need to double check for peace of mind that front loading ferts won’t affect Archie in any way.  Thank you!  

@Mmiller2001plesase don’t mind all my questions, but I have basically the entire Flourish line.  Do you recommend this over Easy Green?

[Mmiller2001]

Front loading is only a different delivery method, all the fertilizers are the same.

Okay, stop Easy Iron all together and do .5ml Seachem Iron 1 day after your water change. Or dose .25ml twice a week. That's .2ppm Fe a week pluse any you might get from Easy Green. See what all that does over the next 3 weeks.

[Lauren A]

 

On 1/15/2022 at 6:54 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

Front loading is only a different delivery method, all the fertilizers are the same.

Okay, stop Easy Iron all together and do .5ml Seachem Iron 1 day after your water change. Or dose .25ml twice a week. That's .2ppm Fe a week pluse any you might get from Easy Green. See what all that does over the next 3 weeks.

Excellent!  Thank you very much.  I really appreciate it.  As for the Easy Carb and Excel - should I hold off on this.  Thx!  

[Mmiller2001]

I would only use it as a last resort.

[Lauren A]

On 1/15/2022 at 8:04 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

I would only use it as a last resort.

Ok sounds good.  Thank you!

[Lauren A]

Hi @Mmiller2001, 

I hope you’re doing well.  I just wanted to touch base and ask you a question.  I’ve been doing the additional ferts along with the Seachem Iron.  I had to add a bunch of Hygro Pinnatifada that I really want to thrive - of course.  I just love them.  Anyway, my potassium is super low.  It took 13 drops with the Salifert test kit - so it is between 0-5.  
 

I had a feeling, especially after watching the stunted growth and yellow leaves with my frogbit.  It is reproducing, but even the older leaves are small.  Also, my dwarf water lettuce roots are growing in real thin.  They lost all their beautiful long roots and they are also reproducing but although improved probably from the additional ferts, they were paper thin without those tiny hairs.  They are slightly healthier looking but not how they used to be.

Kh is  3dkh and Gh is still 5dkh so the Kh is lower than last time.

So, these are some changes or issues that I’m guessing is low potassium.  Should I give it time or do you have any other thoughts on what I should do?

 

Thank you and no rush.  

Edited January 27, 2022 by Lauren A

[Mmiller2001]

Luckly, potassium is one of those nutrients we can push to the higher side with almost no negative effects. We don't want to go super high as that's just wasteful, but I would go ahead and raise it to 15 to 20ppm per week.

Edited January 27, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Lauren A]

Okay cool!  How do you recommend I do this product wise?  I don’t have any specific to potassium so whatever you use, I will buy.  Thank you!

One more thing @Mmiller2001I do have Flourish Advance.  Not sure if this would work?   

[Mmiller2001]

That's more trace elements, If you like Seachem, use their potassium.

 

[Lauren A]

Ok sounds good.  I am willing to buy the green leaf aquarium too.  Let me see what I can get my hands on quickest and I will reach out if i need you.  Thanks so much for your help!  Have a good night 

[dmurray407]

@Mmiller2001 or anyone, I've been suspecting a potassium deficiency and would like to test. The thing is that I live in MN where everything is frozen solid and I'm always leary about buying liquid supplies during the winter. Any idea if freezing would harm the chemicals in the FE+ test kit?

[Mmiller2001]

I personally would wait to buy it if freezing is the case. You don't have to test if you know exactly how much you're dosing. As long as you dose enough you should be good to go.

Edited January 29, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Lauren A]

Hi @Mmiller2001

I received my Seachem Potassium today.  I dosed it as recommended on the bottle for 8 gallons - 1.6ml.  Would you recommend I dose this 2 or 3 times a week for this week and given my potassium was so low, do you feel I should go heavier on the amount.  
 

When I do a water change on Sunday I can dose all ferts at once with the 50% wc as I have been and raise it to the 15-20ppm for the week.  But for now, I’d like to get things going so there is some potassium in there.  Thanks!  

[Mmiller2001]

On 2/1/2022 at 11:50 AM, Lauren A said:

Hi @Mmiller2001

I received my Seachem Potassium today.  I dosed it as recommended on the bottle for 8 gallons - 1.6ml.  Would you recommend I dose this 2 or 3 times a week for this week and given my potassium was so low, do you feel I should go heavier on the amount.  
 

When I do a water change on Sunday I can dose all ferts at once with the 50% wc as I have been and raise it to the 15-20ppm for the week.  But for now, I’d like to get things going so there is some potassium in there.  Thanks!  

How man gallons is the tank?

Nevermind, I found it:

.08ml of Easy Green 2xweek=

6ppm NO3

.324ppm PO4

6.03ppm K

Assuming 50% water changes, that's an accumulation total of (12ppmNO3, .65ppm PO4, 12.1ppmK).

If doing 25% water changes, add 1/4 to those numbers. That's (15ppmNO3, .81ppm PO4, 15ppm K)

I would add 5 to 10ppm of K, Start at 5ppm. So assuming an 8 gallon tank, add 1.6ml of Seachem Potassium. That is an additional 5ppm accumulated total at 50% water changes or 6.25ppm @25% changes.

Hopefully my math is correct! 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Mmiller2001

[Lauren A]

On 2/1/2022 at 2:21 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

How man gallons is the tank?

Nevermind, I found it:

.08ml of Easy Green 2xweek=

6ppm NO3

.324ppm PO4

6.03ppm K

Assuming 50% water changes, that's an accumulation total of (12ppmNO3, .65ppm PO4, 12.1ppmK).

If doing 25% water changes, add 1/4 to those numbers. That's (15ppmNO3, .81ppm PO4, 15ppm K)

I would add 5 to 10ppm of K, Start at 5ppm. So assuming an 8 gallon tank, add 1.6ml of Seachem Potassium. That is an additional 5ppm accumulated total at 50% water changes or 6.25ppm @25% changes.

Hopefully my math is correct! 

 

 

Hi @Mmiller2001

Thank you so so much!!  You are the best for doing all of this for me.  I’m already seeing a slight improvement on my S. Repens.  I’m assuming the Seachem iron is doing it’s job.  The new growth is much greener and now with the potassium - I know it can only get better!

 

Hopefully in a few weeks or sooner I can post some before and after pics to show improvements!  And hopefully a lusher tank!  
 

Thank you again!  Your help is so appreciated. Have a great night!  

 

 

Edited February 1, 2022 by Lauren A

[Lauren A]

On 1/14/2022 at 6:34 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

It's always better to report GH and KH in degrees. So your GH is 5dGH and KH is 4dKH; which is is different from your previous testing. Which is good! We won't need to adjust the GH to increase it. I believe the API tests over any test strip (if that's what you used previously). Hang on to the CaSo4 and MgSo4, it lasts forever and you might try fish that like high GH in the future, or if your source water ever changes you will have it ready to use if need be!

As I stated earlier, I think you just need to dose more easy green. I dose my non CO2 tanks to 30ppm K, and I would like to see yours a bit higher. Shoot for 20 to 25ppm K, you will just pump more Easy Green. Unfortunately, all in one ferts lock you in to their ratio, so you will just have to see what happens by increasing the dose as a whole.

If you change 4 gallons and add 4 gallons, dose a bit less than 3ml of Easy Green. That's 18ppmNo3, 1ppmPO4, 12ppmK and .2ppmFe(proxy). Watch the new growth and see if it improves(3 weeks or so). If it looks the same, go to 4ml. That's 24ppmNO3, 1.3ppmPO4, 16.1ppmK and .3ppmFe(proxy). So on, so forth.

Last question. What is your pH? the iron in EG is EDTA and a pH over 6.8 will lock out iron. The Easy Iron seems to be a mix of Ferrous, EDTA and DTPA. But I don't know in what percent each is.

Hi @Mmiller2001,

 

Sorry to bug you with more questions.  After testing my Kh and Gh today I noticed the Kh dropped pretty significantly.  It went from 4dkh to 2dkh over the past week or so.  Gh remains at 5dkh.

 

I have a feeling this is due to IAL’s in my tank.  I use about 4-5 medium sized at all times for my bettas health, but it might be a bit overkill.  I will be adding banana leaves soon to slow down the progression of my bettas blindness - he’s forming diamond eye and a large scale raised on his head.  He’s perfectly healthy but he is a Snow White dragon scale and I’m sure bad genetics.  I think it’s time I try to raise my Kh because although I’m not experiencing will swings in Ph, it’s not completely stable and I know it could be lower.  I know low Kh can cause these swings.

 

Anyway, we discussed using the GLA dry magnesium and calcium in the past.  What do you think?  Should I continue a couple more weeks with my newer dosing schedule, or introduce something to try to stabilize these numbers.

I also know crushed coral can help too but obviously even though my plant health is very very important, I also want to make sure I don’t harm Archie (my betta).  I trust you.  

Thank you and no rush at all.  I ask you so many questions.  I hope I’m not being a pain repeating myself.  I just want to make sure I do this correct and the internet is info overload.

 

 

 

@Mmiller2001Also, my ph is 7.8 at the moment.  

@Mmiller2001

 

Fairly soon and slowly, I’m going back to tap water that’s filtered by Hydroviv.  I tested the water - just a quickie strip test but will do a master test soon.  Luckily the Kh and Gh look real good but the water is very alkaline.  I’m working with a friend with a lot of bettas to come up for a plan, so this with the CA and Mg might just be temporary.  I don’t know.  I get so confused.  I want to get away from Poland spring though since the tap will have more minerals.  Etc.  plus less plastic waste.  

Edited February 2, 2022 by Lauren A

[Mmiller2001]

A 5dGH is fine and should be more than enough for plants and a Betta. I mentioned Ca and Mg before because the strips were testing it lower than the API test. You should be good to go. 

Your KH is fine at 2dKH or 4dKH. If you want to be a bit more steady, just do a small water change mid week to replenish the carbonates. Some other options are to dose carbonates or bicarbonates directly, or use crushed coral. If you go the crushed coral route, just know it will also add calcium. This can raise GH along with KH.

Before moving all my tanks to 0dKH, I used potassium carbonate to raise KH. It also added potassium for my plants. I guess the only negative when going this route is that it's one more component that has to be measured. That said, if I wanted to raise KH with near 100% accuracy, this is the option to choose.

I'm actually surprised the IAL are moving KH so quickly in your tank. I love IAL!

[Lauren A]

On 2/2/2022 at 3:48 PM, Mmiller2001 said:

A 5dGH is fine and should be more than enough for plants and a Betta. I mentioned Ca and Mg before because the strips were testing it lower than the API test. You should be good to go. 

Your KH is fine at 2dKH or 4dKH. If you want to be a bit more steady, just do a small water change mid week to replenish the carbonates. Some other options are to dose carbonates or bicarbonates directly, or use crushed coral. If you go the crushed coral route, just know it will also add calcium. This can raise GH along with KH.

Before moving all my tanks to 0dKH, I used potassium carbonate to raise KH. It also added potassium for my plants. I guess the only negative when going this route is that it's one more component that has to be measured. That said, if I wanted to raise KH with near 100% accuracy, this is the option to choose.

I'm actually surprised the IAL are moving KH so quickly in your tank. I love IAL!

Hi!  I just lost an entire reply I started writing earlier.  😠 

I absolutely LOVE IAL.  I love the way they look in tanks - it’s so natural.  And I’ve seen the amazing healing properties they’ve provided my bettas.  My snails even like hanging out on them 😆!  I’d never own a betta tank without them.  I also love the look of Blackwater tanks.  
 

Anyway, thank you again very much.  I feel better now knowing it’s not a big problem.  I worry too much sometimes.  I just want to get this right.  Soon, I will be using my filtered tap again, which will be great.  I’m hoping this restores minerals to the tank that I know are lacking.  First, I need a plan for the transition from the Poland Spring so Archie and my plants don’t go into shock.
 

For now, I’m going to plan a mini water change mid week like you recommended.  I never thought to do this.  I think getting too complicated adding this and that isn’t necessary now, so thank you!!  

I hope you have a nice night and again, thank you, you’re awesome!!!