Tiger Barbs on Strike! They demand a cave!

[madmark285]

My barbs got booted from a 75 gallon tank, now stuck in a 29 gallon until I get another tank up. They are now demand a cave for the rainbow shark who has nowhere to go. So I cave in and built them a cave. Tiger barbs can be such a pain...

So first I filled a couple balloons (24" and a punch bag balloon) with sand. I have some drywall fiberglass tape so I used it but not really necessary.

 

Next I took some moist sand and added ~1-2 oz of Gorilla polyurethane glue:

Now i pack it over the balloons and added some glue around the entrance.

Then cover it all with wet gravel:

 

Here is the results!

 

Bottom picture:

Close up

Comments: The sand is not required but I like how it came out. You could do a 2 step process, pack all sand around it, remove sand and apply another coat of glue, pack gravel. 

 

I plan on using the sand in balloon idea for my big project, Mbuna Condo's! For this project, I will use 2-part polyurethane foam to create condo cave. After cure, cut the balloons and vacuum the sand out. But first I must fix my leaky 75 gallon tank. 

And the barbs are still on strike, the Gorilla glue needs to cure for a few days. Next week, the shark gets a cave!

Mark

One more thing...

The Gorilla glue works on rocks. Take a ugly rock, cover it with glue and pack substrate around it. Now you got a cool looking rock!

[Milliardo Peacecraft]

That is awesome!  I'll have to give it a try to make a few well blending in bottom contours/caves.

[madmark285]

On 7/20/2023 at 11:41 AM, Milliardo Peacecraft said:

That is awesome!  I'll have to give it a try to make a few well blending in bottom contours/caves.

Hope it works out for ya. A warning, nitrile gloves is a must when using Gorilla polyurethane glue, nasty stuff.

The balloon with moist sands works great, you can shape it somewhat. 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Hey @madmark285!  Is this the glue you used?  This one (ingredient: cyanoacrylate) is tank safe!  Other gorilla glues are not.  Super cool caves and awesome concept!  Love it.

 

Safety sheet for gorilla glue original:

https://www.gorillatough.com/wp-content/uploads/SDS-Update_Original-Gorilla-Glue-v1.5.pdf
 

 

 

Safety sheet for gorilla super glue gel:

https://www.gorillatough.com/wp-content/uploads/Gorilla-Super-Glue-Gel-SDS.pdf

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[madmark285]

Nope, it is this glue:

I been told that once fully cured, it is safe for aquariums. It would be similar to people making backgrounds out of polyurethane foam. Once cured, the stuff is inert.

 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/20/2023 at 10:24 AM, madmark285 said:

I been told that once fully cured, it is safe for aquariums. It would be similar to people making backgrounds out of polyurethane foam. Once cured, the stuff is inert.

It's difficult to say.

I haven't heard that it's safe or unsafe. It's one of those situations where it might be ok in one situation, but if a very sensitive species comes along and it's leeching anything or a chunk breaks off then you have an issue.  I've seen something similar on aqua scaping videos, but I can't recall which source or which bottle was used. Searching online I see conflicting information.

[madmark285]

Same here, lots of different opinions. 

One key issue is, fully cured. I would wait at least a week before using it. Same as you, I seen massive backgrounds made with great stuff.

A slow setting epoxy mixed with sand could also work. But without the foaming action, not sure if epoxy would hold on to gravel. 

[madmark285]

On 7/20/2023 at 2:06 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

I haven't heard that it's safe or unsafe. 

This is what I read on the PlantedTank forum:

Aquarium Safe Glue

Quote

 

Thank you for contacting the Gorilla Glue Company.

Gorilla Glue will work on varied surfaces and it does provide a 100% waterproof bond which can be submerged after curing a full 7 days. Once cured, it is inert and it will not leach anything into your aquarium water.

Gorilla Glue will work on most plastics, such as ABS, polycarbonate and pvc for example, as long as the surfaces are scratched up first where the glue will be. This will get the plastic to be a bit fuzzy looking, gives a texture to the slick surface and it gives the glue something to hold on to. It will not stick to polyethylene and polypropylene plastics as noted on our packaging and containers. These specific plastics are manufactured with a high amount of petroleum so the surfaces are too slick and oily and the glue cannot get a secure or tight bond. The best example of these plastics are our containers and caps since we know the glue will not stick to it! If you do not know the type of plastic you are gluing together, it becomes a ‘trial and error’ approach. Gorilla Glue will not damage or dissolve the plastic, it may simply peel right off of it.

I hope this information is helpful. The Gorilla Glue Company is a family owned business that was built upon the belief in our products and our desire to respond to our customers’ needs. We appreciate you taking the time to contact us and if you have any additional questions or comments, please let me know.

Sincerely,

Mary-Ellen

Mary-Ellen McGrath
Gorilla Support Team

The Gorilla Glue Company
4550 Red Bank Expressway
Cincinnati, OH 45227
P: 1-800-966-3458
E: maryellenmcgrath@gorillaglue.com
F: 1-513-527-3742

 

 

 

 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/20/2023 at 11:26 AM, madmark285 said:

Same here, lots of different opinions. 

One key issue is, fully cured. I would wait at least a week before using it. Same as you, I seen massive backgrounds made with great stuff.

A slow setting epoxy mixed with sand could also work. But without the foaming action, not sure if epoxy would hold on to gravel. 

Epoxy would be even more risky than the glue. It's a complex material and a chemical reaction.

That being said, Gorilla has a lot of information on their website including the MSDS for all their products as well as the statement that you saw on the other forum. On saltwater forums I see thread reporting issues. It would take some investigation and full clarity on the situation before I'd personally risk it. I keep a lot of bottom feeding fish that would accidentally graze on a bottom surface and potentially damage themselves.

Leeching is one thing. Is it toxic? Maybe.

[madmark285]

 

On 7/20/2023 at 4:52 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

Epoxy would be even more risky than the glue. It's a complex material and a chemical reaction.

Epoxy is safe for aquariums because of the chemical reaction, the resin molecules bond with the hardener creating an insert material.  It is used extensively in public aquariums, I believe they also use the 2-part polyurethane expanding foam for the same reason. I find this conversation a bit ironic as todays project was resealing an old 20 gallon tank, uncured silicone sealant is nasty stuff.  I believe dichlorodimethyl is to blame.

If I can successfully reseal my 75 gallon tank, not sure if I should do a journal on my planned Mbuna tank, it will use alot of 3# density polyurethane foam and gorilla glue or epoxy. I will discuss issues with my consultant, our tenant is a PhD student in chemistry. 🙂 

 

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/20/2023 at 4:24 PM, madmark285 said:

If I can successfully reseal my 75 gallon tank, not sure if I should do a journal on my planned Mbuna tank, it will use alot of 3# density polyurethane foam and gorilla glue or epoxy. I will discuss issues with my consultant, our tenant is a PhD student in chemistry. 🙂 

Many thanks.  Yeah we "just got news" so to speak about PVC causing issues, so I am sure there is going to be more going on below the surface.  It may not be something you see long term or ever, but there may be something there that does find its way into the water.  The biggest concern is what the fish do.  Cory had his tank where he painted some pipes black and the fish grazed on the paint until it was gone.  I've had the above mentioned concern with "complex" adhesives just from my experience with them on the manufacturing side.  Having to write manuals, review MSDS sheets, and the general information.  There is a lot of times where "we don't know" and that is used on the sheets as well.  Forever chemicals, all of this is a highly debated topic and something we are just beginning to understand the impacts, longer term, on some products.  Filtration is key... and it might not just be something for the fish, but ourselves as well. 

Again, I am simply saying "I don't know", but the concern I would have for the above use is that it's very easy for fish to access that and possibly digest it.

[madmark285]

On 7/21/2023 at 12:54 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

 fish grazed on the paint until it was gone.  

LOL. I painted my overflow box with Fusion spray paint which is safe for aquariums. After a year I couldn't touch the box as large chunks of paint was ready to peeling off. Now you can stain PVC but it is a petroleum product with no MSDS sheet. Who knows what's in that.

I truly wish we had a definitive answer on Gorilla polyurethane glue fully cured. It is not needed as an adhesive, just use cyanoacrylate. But it is so useful and easy for making things. The only special tool use to make the above cave was a 24" balloon filled with sand, can't get any easier than that. The foaming nature of the glue is a pain in the a** for woodworking but perfect gravel. 

Oh well....