Help me build my fish room

[Ryan S.]

I have just moved and now that storage isn't an issue I have been granted permission to do a fish room in the basement storage room.  To do that, I'm requesting some thoughts from the nerm experts on a few things I'm struggling with.

First up is shelving.  I was originally going to buy a heavy duty storage rack but I now think I can use some existing built in wooden shelves that are already down here.  Here is a pic.

 

I believe I will need to reenforce it in the middle and on the ends.  Does anyone see issues with it working though assuming I reenforce well?  I will put a row of 20's on top and 10s on the bottom.  

Next is water.  I've got plumbing as seen in pic but no utility sink, which I need.  Question for you fish plumbers.  Can you run a utility sink that is only handling fish water into a floor drain or does it need to get tied into to sewer plumbing?

 

My final issue is heating. Luckily I like a lot of cool water fish but I see no way to heat the room given its size (1k sq ft) and enclosing the fish portion isn't an option yet (maybe down the road).  I've got two vents that are open but even with that, it doesn't stay warm enough to keep my tanks above the mid 60s. Don't know about summer temps yet. Is there any way to heat multiple tanks more efficiently than individual heaters as needed?

For water I will be doing a python system assuming I get the sink figured out. Eventually I will do a dechlorinated filter system maybe with RO with overflows into a sump bucket that I can tie my sewer system or take outside to a holding tub for watering the garden. 

Would love any thoughts on how best to handle things and thoughts on my issues.  Thanks all. 

[Jefft51]

I see no problem reinforcing the wood shelves and using them. I would put 2x4 posts in the corners and the middle so the post takes up the weight from top shelf to floor.

I am pretty sure the floor drain goes into your sewer system.  If your sewer system ever backs up, you'll know. To make sure talk to a plumber in the area, But that's usually the case. If so, then I don't think it's a problem. Another solution is to use a transfer pump to drain/fill your tanks. I just started doing that and it makes things easy. Mine cost about $50 and has been a very good flow through an old hose that has way too many kinks in it.

Heating. Cool water fish. White Clouds. Maybe even things like Bluegills and Crappies if you can find/fish them. Cory had a video about fish that can tolerate non heated tanks. Other solutions may be to cover/insulate the back and sides of your shelves. Pipe a vent right to the shelves?   Maybe some type of sump and heat that?  

Edited February 6, 2021 by Jefft51

[Jefft51]

Just to add, looks like the faucets were for a washer hookup. Is there a drain for that? Did it drain to the floor?

The hose I'm using with the transfer pump is a 1/2 inch 50ft hose. I'm going to get a better one soon so I don't have to unkink the hose everytime I use it. There is about 5ft of lift in my use. I'm pretty sure it would go a lot higher.

 

[Ryan S.]

14 minutes ago, Jefft51 said:

Just to add, looks like the faucets were for a washer hookup. Is there a drain for that? Did it drain to the floor?

The hose I'm using with the transfer pump is a 1/2 inch 50ft hose. I'm going to get a better one soon so I don't have to unkink the hose everytime I use it. There is about 5ft of lift in my use. I'm pretty sure it would go a lot higher.

 

Had the same thoughts on the water supply.  Asked the former owner but they never used it so it must be from an earlier owner.  I see no other way other than floor drain unless the main stack was completely redone at some point and the tie in removed at that point.  

 

Thanks for the thoughts and I agree on where you would reenforce.  I will def look into a transfer pump!

[Andy's Fish Den]

you could definitely put a sink down there and drain it into that floor drain. Do have a pit with a sump pump in it to pump water outside? If you do, would be another option of here to drain a sink into.

[Ryan S.]

12 minutes ago, Andy's Fish Den said:

you could definitely put a sink down there and drain it into that floor drain. Do have a pit with a sump pump in it to pump water outside? If you do, would be another option of here to drain a sink into.

Thank you for the feedback on the floor drain, that is good to hear!  I'm going to have to have a plumber come out regardless to assess some of this so I'll double check with him on if he thinks that is the right move.  Want to make sure I'm not overloading that drain, but its definitely the best option on the table.

Unfortunately no sump pump at the new house or I would be all over that idea!  I had one drilled and put in at my last house so I'm not against adding one if it makes sense but overall house seems to be bone dry (knock on wood)  I've looked into a sump bucket as an option for auto water change system where the overflow would collect, could potentially do that on the sink as well if I needed to, but would prefer another option if at all possible, such as floor drain or direct tie-in to my sewer line.  The sewer stack line is only about 10 feet away from where the sink would be. I'm just not sure how much tying into the stack would cost, might be my best option though.

Thank you for the thoughts, really appreciate it!  

[Andy's Fish Den]

I have seen where people drain their tanks for auto water change or even just doing water changes by hand, into one of those Rubbermaid totes that are usually used to store stuff. then, have a sump pump in it that pumps the water either outside or it is tied into the main drain of the house someplace. Cory has shown in videos that @Dean’s Fishroom drains his tanks into a five gallon bucket and has it pump into the drain someplace else. 

[StevesFishTanks]

You can heat the room with oil filled heaters or a mini split unit. You can also create cheap temporary walls/ceiling with plastic sheeting.

Probably want to look into dehumidifier or an air exchanger 

I like the racks. Can easily be modified or  reinforced to suit your needs. 

Edited February 10, 2021 by s1_

[tolstoy21]

On 2/6/2021 at 3:32 PM, Ryan S. said:

Is there any way to heat multiple tanks more efficiently than individual heaters as needed?

I'd love to know the answer to this as well, as I have the exact same setup . . .  a basement that doesn't get above 60 in the winter, and in the summer is maybe low 70s in the hottest days. For me running a single 20 gallon high at 78 F cost approximately $10 a month, in the coldest months, in electricity my market. This is my limiting factor for number of total tanks I'm willing to maintain in that space at the moment. 

I'm not sure if a central sump and heating just that with standard aquarium heaters will change this equation, but I have seen people use re-circulative heat exchangers hooked into their gas hot water heaters to heat large basement sumps and save some money. Haven't done this because walling in and insulating the space seems a more cost effective solution if I have to do any sort of labor to cut my heating costs.

As for water changes, I'm not sure if you saw my other post on the subject, but I use a standard sump pump in a plastic tote to move my change water across my basement and into my utility sink. pretty easy solution what require no super fancy plumbing skills to achieve.

I too have thought about tying into the sewer stack line, but you're going to have to include a trap in that between your sump and your sewer line to keep sewer gas from leaking back up into the space (not a big deal but something you'll need to think about). I found using my slop sink the easiest solution.

Edited February 10, 2021 by tolstoy21

[Ryan S.]

@tolstoy21 Man, did not know the stat on $10 a month, definitely something I'll have to keep looking into.  I have thought about a central sump or 3 or 4 central sumps so there are at least some different systems.  I love the thought of increased volume, but quarantine importance would go up 10-fold.  Lots of stuff to figure out, but it is kind of fun.  Thanks for the thoughts!

[tolstoy21]

1 hour ago, Ryan S. said:

Man, did not know the stat on $10 a month, definitely something I'll have to keep looking into.

I bought a cheap plug-in usage monitor to calculate my costs, as seen in pics.

This is my usage over 57 days running a 150w Eheim Jager in a 29 Gallon at 78 F, where the current average temp in my basement is about 60 F.  

After 1382 hours (about 57.5 days) I've consumed approx. 102 kwh.

I pay $0.14 per kwh, with an average delivery charge of $0.04 per kwh, roughly. 

So my usage comes out to about 1.8 kwh a day, and if round my electricity charges to $0.18 per kwh, that comes out to about $0.32 a day to run on 29 gallon mid winter, which is around $9.60 a month, so let's just round up and call it an even $10.

Summer will be cheaper because my average basement temp is 10 F higher, but I cant really say the average cost per month spread over 12 months as i haven't measured that (yet!).

Also, my math could be off, so someone help me out if I'm flunking math in this post!

Most of my tanks are 20 - 29g, with a single 40 breeder. So . . . .doesn't scale well in terms of cost.

Obviously your mileage may vary. But if you're in an unheated basement in the North East or Mid Atlantic, you're probably looking at something similar for a similar sized tank.

Building that wall to close in and insulate an area of the basement sounds good right about now, no?

Edited February 10, 2021 by tolstoy21

[Levi_Aquatics]

Maybe you could use a dehumidifier to heat the room up. I have used one in my bedroom (to get aquarium water out of the carpet of course lol) and it raised the temp by quite a bit.

[Hobbit]

@Ryan S. Congrats on the opportunity to have a fish room! I think the shelves look great as long as you put 2x4s against the legs and in the middle so they directly support the frame. Also how are the shelves framed underneath—are they just framed at the edge or is there cross bracing? If there’s no cross bracing you may consider adding some. Finally I’d consider some sort of paint or coating to prevent any spilled water from seeping into the wood. I haven’t always seen other fish tubers do that but it seems like a good idea.

In terms of heating, I also agree that putting up some sort of insulation will probably be the most cost effective option. Like what this person did, setting up a fish tent:

Even if you just tent three sides, it will probably help a lot.

[Ryan S.]

29 minutes ago, Hobbit said:

@Ryan S. Congrats on the opportunity to have a fish room! I think the shelves look great as long as you put 2x4s against the legs and in the middle so they directly support the frame. Also how are the shelves framed underneath—are they just framed at the edge or is there cross bracing? If there’s no cross bracing you may consider adding some. Finally I’d consider some sort of paint or coating to prevent any spilled water from seeping into the wood. I haven’t always seen other fish tubers do that but it seems like a good idea.

In terms of heating, I also agree that putting up some sort of insulation will probably be the most cost effective option. Like what this person did, setting up a fish tent:

Even if you just tent three sides, it will probably help a lot.

Some great thoughts.  I drew out a quick pic of what I'm thinking on the stand.  On the stand underneath, there is only one cross joint in the middle so I plan on adding several more (maybe every 12 inches) as a part of reinforcing it underneath the shelves for support, these are the blue.  I'm also going to put a 2x6 reinforcement up the middle on that center brace that will support the middle of the shelves so they aren't just braced on the edges.  Finally, I'm adding edge braces in red both along the back, one in the front, and one on each end.

Good thought on painting/sealing.  I agree, I am going to paint and seal it with something before putting anything on it.  It will slow me down a bit, but definitely the right move long-term.  

The tent idea or even just some simple fabric hanging might be enough, I think you are right.  I have a HVAC vent right next to the middle of that stand, plus I have a portable oil heater and a dehumidifier that might do the trick as well.  I think that is the route I will go, just got to figure out what kind of fabric to make the walls from.  

 

[Hobbit]

Looks good! I think the biggest thing you can do for strengthening the shelves is adding some two by fours directly under the frame of the shelves. I added what I mean in green:

I think this was what @Jefft51 was getting at as well. Putting supports under the frame so the wood itself is taking the weight rather than the weight all resting on screws. That’s going to add the most strength/stability.

Edited August 15, 2021 by Hobbit

[Beardedbillygoat1975]

I’ve been using Mylar survival blankets in my fish room. I wrap the tanks when not being viewed and they really hold the heat in and kind of get recharged by the lights and heaters as well as the evaporation. I only have 2 - 30 g totes and 3- 5 gs but it’s made a difference. My garage is 50 degrees and I’ve managed to cut my electric costs in half this winter. Lots of creative options. 
 

I’m using the standard gorilla shelving and am very satisfied. I put plastic placemats down under the tanks over the board.  Fishboy has some good build out videos on his YouTube along with all of Cory and Co videos you should be good. 

[Ryan S.]

@Hobbit I got you, that is a great note.  Glad you clarified, makes a ton of sense. 

[Ryan S.]

On 2/10/2021 at 6:40 AM, tolstoy21 said:

I'd love to know the answer to this as well, as I have the exact same setup . . .  a basement that doesn't get above 60 in the winter, and in the summer is maybe low 70s in the hottest days. For me running a single 20 gallon high at 78 F cost approximately $10 a month, in the coldest months, in electricity my market. This is my limiting factor for number of total tanks I'm willing to maintain in that space at the moment. 

I'm not sure if a central sump and heating just that with standard aquarium heaters will change this equation, but I have seen people use re-circulative heat exchangers hooked into their gas hot water heaters to heat large basement sumps and save some money. Haven't done this because walling in and insulating the space seems a more cost effective solution if I have to do any sort of labor to cut my heating costs.

As for water changes, I'm not sure if you saw my other post on the subject, but I use a standard sump pump in a plastic tote to move my change water across my basement and into my utility sink. pretty easy solution what require no super fancy plumbing skills to achieve.

I too have thought about tying into the sewer stack line, but you're going to have to include a trap in that between your sump and your sewer line to keep sewer gas from leaking back up into the space (not a big deal but something you'll need to think about). I found using my slop sink the easiest solution.

Ok, I may have found a solution to heating.  Was scouring the depths of youtube and came across a guy who uses reptile heat tape to heat his entire fish tank rack.  You get heat tape and plug it into a thermostat and he keeps his whole rack at 76 to 77 degrees no issue.  

You can get different width and lengths on a reptile website I found and it's cheap.  Think I could do the whole rack for about $75 with total wattage of around 300 watts.

Curious if anyone has any thoughts on this method. 

[tolstoy21]

@Ryan S. I'd love to hear how this works out, if you try it.

I also wonder how water resistant these things are, as I tend to splish and splash stuff all over.

Please start a tread or post back here if you give them a try, and let us know your experiences positive or negative.

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by tolstoy21

[Ryan S.]

Figured I'd do a quick update.  Stand is done, painted, and tanks are going.  I'm running the heat tape successfully so far.  Keeping the tanks at about 75. The stand once completed will run one 40 breeder, four 20 tall, eight 10 gal.  

I'm making a trip next weekend too my favorite local spot for father's day to see if they have some fish I've been looking far.  Pumped to get it going.

[Jimmy]

 Congrats on the set up, any changes since June? I just started my own build thread make sure to follow along 

[Ryan S.]

On 8/14/2021 at 9:02 PM, Jimmy said:

 Congrats on the set up, any changes since June? I just started my own build thread make sure to follow along 

Tanks are now filled with fish! System has been running great so far.  I will start phase 2 this fall to add the remaining tanks to the rack.  Right now my main project is trying to hatch rainbow eggs for the first time.  

I will def follow your thread!

[Jimmy]

Following you now also. That’s exciting. I won’t have any tanks big enough to do rainbows but pseudomugils are certainly holding tank space for me.

 

what is powering your sponges?

[Ryan S.]

On 8/16/2021 at 7:40 AM, Jimmy said:

Following you now also. That’s exciting. I won’t have any tanks big enough to do rainbows but pseudomugils are certainly holding tank space for me.

 

what is powering your sponges?

I didn't have enough total tanks to need a linear piston pump so I decided to get a pawfly 7 watt 254 GPH air pump from amazon.  It's easily running 8 drops with no problem and was a great low cost option. Hopefully they last but who knows, durability is where the linear reins supreme.  I'll add a 2nd pump to complete the rack.  So essentially two smaller air pumps.  

No big rainbows for me either.... Yet.  Just precox and pseudumogil as of now.