Newbie: Stocking question (36 Gallon Bowfront)

[Mark Lederman]

Hi, I am Mark in NJ.   First time fish keeper.    I have a planted tank that is in the cycling process now.    36 Gallon Bow front.   I want a calm community tank with variety of colorful fish and type of fish that don't get too big. I don't want breeding.  And I am in love with Angel fish - so that is my 1 centerpiece that I must have.   Other than that - colorful and peaceful and different shapes and colors is what I am looking for.  My daughter really likes glo fish tetras, so I want to work 6 of them into this tank as well.    

Would like to know if this stocking list would work (in terms of getting along - note: I've created sections with rocks and drift wood to block sight lines):

• 1 Angel
• 1 Honey gourami
• 6 Glofish Tetras
• 1 Apisto Cockatoo

 

 

Thanks,

Mark

 

PS: Here is a pic of my aquascaped tank with no fish yet.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Mark Lederman
added picture

[FrozenFins]

beutifal tank. Your stocking seems fine. 

[Mark Lederman]

Thanks.   

Two follow-up questions:

1) What if I went to 9 glo fish tetras?  Is that too many?

• 1 Angel
• 1 Honey gourami
• 9 Glofish Tetras
• 1 Apisto Cockatoo

2) And lastly, if you were to add a cleanup crew (btw: my daughter doesn't like the look of those things), what would work best here in this community tank?    And does the addition of the clean up crew take the glofish # back down to 6?   

[Mengo]

For your cleanup crew, I think corydoras will look great in your beautiful tank. I personally like bronze corydoras(only because they're the only ones I've kept)but other species will do. They're very peaceful and will never hurt a fly. I've heard the angelfish and corys get along amazingly and most fish keepers keep angelfish with them. Corydoras crave safety in numbers so I suggest at least 6 minimum 4 all same species. You can still keep those 9 glofish tetras if you decide to keep 6 corys. Just rmb to do regular water changes to keep the nitrates,nitrites and ammonia low. Good luck with your new tank!

[Colu]

You might consider some nerite snails or a bristles nose pleco for algae come

[FrozenFins]

3 hours ago, Mark Lederman said:

Thanks.   

Two follow-up questions:

1) What if I went to 9 glo fish tetras?  Is that too many?

• 1 Angel
• 1 Honey gourami
• 9 Glofish Tetras
• 1 Apisto Cockatoo

2) And lastly, if you were to add a cleanup crew (btw: my daughter doesn't like the look of those things), what would work best here in this community tank?    And does the addition of the clean up crew take the glofish # back down to 6?   

nope you could do 9 glofish and a clean up crew.

Coyrdoras will do well, they won't help with the algae control

Ottocinclous, great alage eater

Snails, they will breed and make baby snails unless you get nirite snails. Nirites only breed in brackish water (half freshwater half saltwater) all though they may still lay the eggs, the eggs just won't hatch. Snails will never stop working

Amano Shrimp/ Bamboo Shrimp, both will do fine. Stay away from the smaller shrimp species as they will get eaten.

Keep in mind all of the fish in this list you still need to feed. The corydoras will feed on catfish pellets and the others will feed on algae wafers and other veggies.

[Mark Lederman]

Ok, i have my first stocking issue in terms of retail/inventory.  The local fish store (only place that carries apistos) will not sell me just one appisto.  He is insisting i buy a pair.   

I dont want to deal with breeding.  I am worried these guys will get aggressive and kill the other fish if they start protecting fry.   How often does the breeding occur? 

Should i abandon this appisto idea?  

 

[JettsPapa]

13 hours ago, Mark Lederman said:

Ok, i have my first stocking issue in terms of retail/inventory.  The local fish store (only place that carries apistos) will not sell me just one appisto.  He is insisting i buy a pair.   

I dont want to deal with breeding.  I am worried these guys will get aggressive and kill the other fish if they start protecting fry.   How often does the breeding occur? 

Should i abandon this appisto idea?  

 

 

I haven't kept apistos, but I think they do better in pairs, so if you don't want two I would suggest you skip them.  Also, I don't think anyone else mentioned it, but most gouramis are social fish that do better in groups (dwarf gouramis being a notable exception).  I'd suggest getting at least 3 honey gouramis, with females outnumbering males.  In the unlikely event that they produce offspring they're unlikely to survive long enough for you to see them with an angelfish in the tank.

[H.K.Luterman]

For more variety, you could mix the glofish tetras with their non-glowfish variants (their natural colors). They're all the same fish and will school together. Just an idea. :3

[bKillion]

I know this is off topic, but based on the picture of the tank, I'm guessing you got the 36 gallon bowfront from Petsmart (which would be the same one I have), and you're using the original, included kit light. The tank also appears to have the lace leaf java fern(which will be fine), but also dwarf hairgrass and a sword maybe? Anyway, I would suggest getting a plant light for that tank to replace the low light kit light for the sword and hairgrass. I ordered some acrylic off of Amazon and made my own lid for the tank, however if you didn't want to do that, you could just cut a hole in the provided lid that was long enough for the light to fit through. I am using a Fluval 3.0 on mine and my dwarf hairgrass is very happy.

 

On the subject of fish however, I would recommend getting kuhli loaches as your bottom dweller/clean up because you don't need as many and they are nocturnal, so the angelfish is less likely to go on a killing spree, and the gourami might get into fights with the angelfish since angels and bettas tear each other apart and gouramis are closely related to bettas. If you start seeing aggression, I would advise you to immediately return the gourami or angel(though you seem to have your heart set on an angel so maybe the gourami).

Hope this helps

[Mark Lederman]

Thank you this is helpful.   I've upgraded my lighting.  I didn't go fluval 3.0.  I found a good deal on a fluval2.0.   I believe that is still a meaningful upgrade over the stock light.   Thank you.   

[Mark Lederman]

Update: Here is where I am w/ 36Gallon tank stocking. It's evolved differently than I planned.  Forgive my lack of discipline.  But at LFS I was talked into a different approach and made the game day decisions (gradually a few fish each week over the last month).

I'm currently at:

• 6 gold long fin danios  (Top Level)
• 6 glo fish tetras (Mid Level),
• 3 corydora sterbai (Bottom Level)
• Since I heard corys are best in a six pack, I probably will get 3 more corys at my next LFS visit (I'm enjoying watching them more than I thought I would). 

So...now I'm left with enough room for one signature centerpiece fish. (at least lets make that assumption):    

• Since I already have a lot of yellow in my tank (6 danios & 2 glofish), I'm abandoning the Honey Gourami.  note: I considered the red honey gourami - but w/ 2 pink glofish that are very bright, I have that pinkish/red color covered.  And my LFS said the red honeys weren't as hardy as the yellow honeys.
• And I've got a heavy flowing cannister filter (which is good for my plants), so I am now thinking this isn't ideal for an angel fish.  Plus I hear tetras nip at angels fins.  So I think Angels are out. 

I'm down to deciding on my centerpiece fish: it's between 1 apisto male or one powder blue dwarf gourami female.

Pros for the apisto:

• That flaming orange fin color
• I need more bottom tank action

 Cons against the apisto:

• risk of cichlid aggression 
• My fish store is not letting me get just one.  

Pros for the Gourami:

• Get the Blue color which i don't have
• I hear they are bottom/middle level fish  

 Cons against the Gourami:

• risk of the Gourami disease
• risk of gourami aggression - which is less in a female and is less than the apisto risk (correct me if you disagree)

Open to thoughts/feedback/alternatives.  Is this just about personal preference, or does someone have different lens to filter through worth sharing.  Thank you all.       

PS: as I write this, I'm leaning towards ordering an apisto online....but not sure I want to ship a fish in the winter with temps as low as they are right now in the northeast...might be worth waiting until spring.   

 

[CorydorasEthan]

1 hour ago, Mark Lederman said:

Update: Here is where I am w/ 36Gallon tank stocking. It's evolved differently than I planned.  Forgive my lack of discipline.  But at LFS I was talked into a different approach and made the game day decisions (gradually a few fish each week over the last month).

I'm currently at:

• 6 gold long fin danios  (Top Level)
• 6 glo fish tetras (Mid Level),
• 3 corydora sterbai (Bottom Level)
• Since I heard corys are best in a six pack, I probably will get 3 more corys at my next LFS visit (I'm enjoying watching them more than I thought I would). 

So...now I'm left with enough room for one signature centerpiece fish. (at least lets make that assumption):    

• Since I already have a lot of yellow in my tank (6 danios & 2 glofish), I'm abandoning the Honey Gourami.  note: I considered the red honey gourami - but w/ 2 pink glofish that are very bright, I have that pinkish/red color covered.  And my LFS said the red honeys weren't as hardy as the yellow honeys.
• And I've got a heavy flowing cannister filter (which is good for my plants), so I am now thinking this isn't ideal for an angel fish.  Plus I hear tetras nip at angels fins.  So I think Angels are out. 

I'm down to deciding on my centerpiece fish: it's between 1 apisto male or one powder blue dwarf gourami female.

Pros for the apisto:

• That flaming orange fin color
• I need more bottom tank action

 Cons against the apisto:

• risk of cichlid aggression 
• My fish store is not letting me get just one.  

Pros for the Gourami:

• Get the Blue color which i don't have
• I hear they are bottom/middle level fish  

 Cons against the Gourami:

• risk of the Gourami disease
• risk of gourami aggression - which is less in a female and is less than the apisto risk (correct me if you disagree)

Open to thoughts/feedback/alternatives.  Is this just about personal preference, or does someone have different lens to filter through worth sharing.  Thank you all.       

PS: as I write this, I'm leaning towards ordering an apisto online....but not sure I want to ship a fish in the winter with temps as low as they are right now in the northeast...might be worth waiting until spring.   

 

Tetra-Angelfish problem: Only some tetras will nip at long fins of fish. It really depends on what type you get. For example, I heard that silver-tip tetras and serpae tetras are fin-nippers. But things like neon tetras will just get eaten by a large angelfish. I don't think GloFish tetras (a variant of the Black Widow Tetra) will nip fins. They are very peaceful and should make great tank mates for angelfish. More tetras that you could also try are the glowlight tetra (not a GloFish, but a naturally occuring fish), rosy tetra, green fire tetra, blue columbian tetra, black neon tetra, lampeye tetra, pristella x-ray tetra, lemon tetra, diamond tetra, emperor tetra, and rummynose tetra. If you are looking for more schooling fish other than tetras, try zebra danios, white cloud mountain minnows, harlequin rasboras, guppies, Endler's livebearers, or cherry barbs (even though they are barbs, they do not nip fins like tiger barbs). Even Corydoras catfish are great schooling fish to add a lot of activity to your aquarium.

Apistogramma: since your fish store is not selling you one, and you want more bottom action, just get more Sterbai Corydoras. All corydoras species are schooling fish and need groups of at least 6 to start being pretty active. They will be very fun to watch, and will add all the activity you need to your bottom level. In addition, they have bright orange fins to add the color you wanted from the Apistogramma. And if you decide not to get your angelfish, try pygmy corydoras as well. They are tiny little catfish that are silver and black, and will school midwater like tetras and will also hang out down on the bottom like other corydoras. The trick with these guys is to get a large school, preferably around 10 or more. I have 5 in my 29 gallon right now, but I am planning on adding more, as they are a little shy without a big enough group. If you still wanted a cichlid fish, go for the Bolivian Ram cichlid, which is a dwarf cichlid as well. I think these would also be a great fit for your community.

"Clean Up Crew": Also, just a side note, but earlier you mentioned Corydoras as a clean up crew. Although they are scavengers, they also do need to be fed on a regular basis (not just Corydoras, but all fish, clean up crew or not). Provide catfish wafers for them (they are not algae eaters) and they will be happy. For fish that do eat algae, try a school of Otocinclus catfish (tiny pleco-like fish that school like Corydoras, so at least three of these in a group), Bristlenose pleco, rubber-lip pleco, hillstream loach, or siamese algae eater (this one does not have a suckermouth, but instead grabs algae off of surfaces, and is great at eradicating black beard algae and hair algae). Again, although these fish do eat algae, they also do need to be fed after the algae that they eat is cleaned up (they all eat different types of algae, and will not eat some types). Provide them with vegetable based food after they clean up all the algae (although most of them are omnivores and will eat pretty much anything you put in the tank).

Gourami: about the blue gourami you were talking about. Are you meaning the Two-Spot Blue Gourami (Trichopodus trichopterus) or the Powder Blue Dwarf Gourami (Colisa lalia)?

• If you are talking about the former, I would recommend against this, as they can be pretty aggressive (depends on the individual). Here is a picture of one.

• For a more peaceful gourami, try pearl gourami. They look just as pretty, and are much less aggressive (mine doesn't even eat guppy fry). But as with all gourami, they can be a bit food aggressive. Mine nips my corydoras only during feeding, so I would still watch out with these guys. Here is a picture of one.

• But if you are talking about the Powder Blue Dwarf Gourami, I think it would be fine in your tank.

While, those are my suggestions. Hope they help. Good luck!

[Mark Lederman]

Thank you so much for the advice.

One of my danios jumped out late last week (with the tank lid on).  So my first casualty.  I hope it wasn't because of water parameters. I hope it was just due to an active / curious jump which I have read danios tend to do.

Also i added an apisto last weekend -(somehow the lfs made just 1 male available without having to get both m & f). I took the unique opportunity and bought it.  However, the appisto didn't take well at all.  He didn't last 24 hours.  So I checked my water parameters. (Note my existing fish were looking fine).  

I noticed some ammonia .5ppm last weekend, probably as a result of adding fish a bit too fast(I know it is a rookie error).  So I have done a 75% water change, added more Searchem Stability, added chlorine remover, and ammolock and gone to feeding every other day and in smaller ammounts.  I also added biomax to my canister filter, added a pre filter to the intake valve (learned that from Corey's youtube videos) and added a few plants.  And I have done 50% water changes every other day this week.

I am measuring water parameters daily.   Saw some nitrite mid week with zero nitrate and then the next day some nitrate and zero nitrite.  But amonia has not gone down at all the entire week -  Remains at .5ppm.  Hoping the tank adjusts fully soon. I am stopping the ammolock as I hear that slows the entire cycling process.

Having lost this appisto has made me reflect....  For all the research I did,  I still tripped on a basic mistake of stocking too fast.   I feel kinda crappy about my over enthusiasm.   The remaining fish are doing fine but are obviously hardier.   But there are lessons learned for me here.  I won't be adding any other fish for at least 4-6 weeks after I get these parameters under control. So might be a few months before I provide any more updates.

Again thanks for all the advice.  

Mark

PS:  for other beginners out there...stock slowly.  A cycled tank isn't an on/off swith or a green/red which I thought it was.  It is on a spectrum.  Meaning my tank was cycled enough to handle my 6 tiny danios.   But then the next week, i went too fast and added tetras and the next week after that corydoras.   I went too fast.  I needed to give the tank time to adjust to the incremental bio load of each additional batch of fish..... probably 3 weeks to adjust to each addition of bio load or at least until the parameters showed the tank had fully processed / adjusted to the additional load. Lesson learned the hard way.

 

Updated pic

Edited February 12, 2021 by Mark Lederman

[Maggie]

Sorry to hear about your loss! If you're still considering a gourami for a centerpiece once your tank has stabilized, Cory has a "top 5 peaceful gouramis" video on the Coop's YouTube page. I believe the female powder blue dwarf is on that list. 

[Mark Lederman]

Thank you Maggie!   I love Corey's videos.  He's super straight forward and pragmatic.