Your experiences with German Blue Ram parenthood?

[Lennie]

So,

I had my black ram pair laid eggs 3 days ago after I moved them from the community tank to breeding project tank.

I was happy! They have been guarding eggs nonstop. Taking turns to protect the eggs all the time changing the guarding turn. It was so sweet to watch.

 

What I did for the tank was (Based on videos I watched and thanks to @Guppysnail as always, she shared her personal experience with me ♥♥):

- added wood pieces and attaches one java fern and one anubias to each wood piece.

- the tank is being kept at 29C (84F)

- covered all three sides of the tank and only left the front open (this one came from @nabokovfan87 and seemed to work well!).

- added a flat rock on one side, and a cattappa leaf on another. ( Added the leaf because my friend @beastie's bolivians preferred to lay on a flat leaf litter, so I wanted to give them options) They preferred flat rock tho.

- never turned the light fully off, only dimmed very much during night time.

-Fed them three times a day, to keep them full so they wouldnt go for the eggs;

• one meal New life spectrum
• one meal Tropical's Insect Menu
• one meal either frozen daphnia or live bbs

Replaced one of them with spirulina from time to time.

 

I have live bbs, sera micron, microworms and vinegar eels ready for the babies.

 

I woke up this morning seeing all eggs are eaten by the parents. 🫠😭

 

What is your experience like with GBR ram parents and their parenthood? If you ever let them raise their babies, how many tries did it take them to learn to take care of the babies?

I have been googling for a while and I saw many people saying they are the worst parents ever.

Now I consider if I should give them another chance or directly remove the eggs next time. What do you think? What do you do?

 

P.S: I watched Dean's and many others' videos and made lots of readings. I actually wanna hear personal experiences or anything to mention if I personally potentially caused them to eat eggs by skipping a necessary step.

Thank you

 

 

LOL I keep tagging you everywhere, but I know you bred these too. Any opinions dude? @Fish Folk

[Fish Folk]

We never have had the pleasure of seeing Rams guard their own fry. Ours always ate their eggs, wigglers, or fry. Other aquarists are successful. I cannot explain why.

We just pull eggs as soon as they lay on the flat stone. I use a DIY floating flow-through container, allowing eggs to hatch securely _in the same water_ they were laid in. I can explain in obsessive detail if you like.

Edited July 8 by Fish Folk

[Lennie]

On 7/8/2023 at 4:38 PM, Fish Folk said:

We never have had the pleasure of seeing Rams guard their own fry. Ours always rat their eggs, wigglers, or fry. Other aquarists are successful. I cannot explain why.

We just pull eggs as soon as they lay on the flat stone. I use a DIY floating flow-through container, allowing eggs to hatch securely _in the same water_ they were laid in. I can explain in obsessive detail if you like.

Just sad 😞 

 

Yea I would love to read in obsessive detail whenever you have time to write & explain. 

I have never needed to use a fish egg incubator in my life. So do I need one? Let's go...

 

I did some google research and the best looking ones I can seem to buy are;

-Ziss ZET-80 - Egg tumbler

-Ziss ZET-65 version

Do you mean these sort of incubators right? Would you suggest one over another?

The difference is: "The difference between the egg tumblers is in the internal diameter and the height. The ZET-80 is the largest with an internal diameter of 80 mm, then the ZET-65 with an internal diameter of 65 mm. ... 

The ZET-80 Egg Tumbler (Internal diameter 80mm) can be used for the eggs of most Cichlids, plecos, discus fish, angelfish, corydoras, etc."

 

When you help me understand the process, I will buy one of them.  Should I also buy methylene blue?

cheers,

 

[Fish Folk]

Here is a thread I made awhile ago. I have simplified this process, but the explanation is still decent…

I have also improved my process for breeding and raising GBRs, but here is a loooong journal if you want to read from the top…

Loads and loads of info, videos, errors, corrections, improvements, etc.

[Lennie]

On 7/8/2023 at 5:50 PM, Fish Folk said:

Here is a thread I made awhile ago. I have simplified this process, but the explanation is still decent…

I have also improved my process for breeding and raising GBRs, but here is a loooong journal if you want to read from the top…

Loads and loads of info, videos, errors, corrections, improvements, etc.

Thank you !

And yes I am willing to read ofcourse:) I will be checking them this evening

do you have any suggestions about the egg incubators I mentioned about? Should I get one of them or look for something else?

Edited July 8 by Lennie

[Fish Folk]

On 7/8/2023 at 1:30 PM, Lennie said:

do you have any suggestions about the egg incubators I mentioned about? Should I get one of them or look for something else?

I would not get those. All you need is:

(1) Airline + Adjustable AirStone. I prefer the Ziss airstone.

(2) Rubbermaid storage tray + Styrofoam collar + Matten sponge.

I will take photos or make a video when I get home. I’ll post here.

[Fish Folk]

Here is how I build mine…

This is a hillbilly version of Dean’s fry system.

[Lennie]

On 7/8/2023 at 11:42 PM, Fish Folk said:

Here is how I build mine…

This is a hillbilly version of Dean’s fry system.

Many thanks for the detailed explanation. Much appreciated!

Good news is I have all the required pieces at home! So that's nice.

As you let the boxes have the tank water flow coming and passing through, so no methylene blue then to not make it join the tank water column. Don't you  face eggs going bad issues? Does the airstone does the job of fish fanning fresh water over the eggs all the time to prevent them going bad all alone?

 

Looking forward for the second part ( :

 

Also I found this video on your journal

 

 

Same setup I see! I guess you added the snails there after fry started free swimming right?

Edited July 8 by Lennie

[Fish Folk]

On 7/8/2023 at 5:01 PM, Lennie said:

Many thanks for the detailed explanation. Much appreciated!

Good news is I have all the required pieces at home! So that's nice.

As you let the boxes have the tank water flow coming and passing through, so no methylene blue then to not make it join the tank water column. Don't you  face eggs going bad issues? Does the airstone does the job of fish fanning fresh water over the eggs all the time to prevent them going bad all alone?

 

Looking forward for the second part ( :

 

Also I found this video on your journal

 

 

Same setup I see! I guess you added the snails there after fry started free swimming right?

I add either hydrogen peroxide, or methylene blue along with the airstone. I dose 0.5 ml 3% H202 (over the counter) ever 12 hrs for just three doses, or 5 ml. methylene blue just 1x times.

[nabokovfan87]

On 7/8/2023 at 7:28 AM, Lennie said:

Yea I would love to read in obsessive detail whenever you have time to write & explain. 

I have never needed to use a fish egg incubator in my life. So do I need one? Let's go...

You can have a tank made for fry (in your case), but your setup is such a way that you don't need the parents to care for the fry.  You can pull the rock to a tank that's ready to go and then they will hatch.  You're the parents at that point.

There are hang-on breeder boxes and egg tumblers.  I would opt for just moving the rock as opposed to moving the eggs off the rock into the tumbler.  This is where having those tanks ready to go, barebottom with some wood or potted plants is going to be a successful tool that you have access to.

Give the parents another try, play with things like having a night light vs. leaving the lights on and see if there's anything that helps.  Each pair may have different needs and it's pretty common to need to give fish a few chances to raise the fry.  When they are guarding, give them time and give them low stress.  Avoid shadows across the tank that look like predators swimming across the tank.