Opinions on whether this is Ich or something else

[mikewxyz]

I have two Kerri Tetras (2/22) with round white cyst like bumps on them.  I had this same problem in April.  I just got back from a 13 day vacation and notice the white bump disease had returned.  Back in April, in another forum, some folks were not convinced that it was Ich and recommended against treating for Ich due to needless medicated stress to the fish.  I didn't like the idea of doing nothing so I used Ich-X per Aquarium Co-op method back in April.  It took five days for the white bumps to go away which made me think they were right, that it probably wasn't ich. 

I'm a new fish keeper and don't want to be in this loop of guessing what disease and treatment.  Any input from more experienced aquarist diagnosing this problem and how to treat it would be appreciated. 

Set-Up -

68 gallon tank with sand substrate, wood hardscape, CO2 injection, medium plant load, and 35 fish (all tetras).  Tank was set up in December.

 

 

[mikewxyz]

Here is another photo of the fish with a single white spot.

[Colu]

The spots look raised if that's the case your more than likely dealing with epistylis it feeds off of gram negative bacteria on the slime coat of your fish leading to secondary infections that's what usually kills your fish and it spreads more quickly at higher temperatures he's how you tell the difference between ich and epistylis if epistylis you want to do a course of maracyn2 in food feeding a small amount twice a day for 7 days and dose the tank with ick X or aquarium salt as you have a lot of live plants I would use ick X @mikewxyz

Edited June 11 by Colu

[mikewxyz]

@Colu thanks.  I was looking at that table on Aquarium Science but it seemed like the spots have some commonality in both columns - pure ceiling white, uniformly round size but sticking out which caused uncertainty in diagnosis for me.   You are suggesting treat for Epistylis first then evaluate?

[Colu]

On 6/11/2023 at 3:29 PM, mikewxyz said:

@Colu thanks.  I was looking at that table on Aquarium Science but it seemed like the spots have some commonality in both columns - pure ceiling white, uniformly round size but sticking out which caused uncertainty in diagnosis for me.   You are suggesting treat for Epistylis first then evaluate?

If the spots are raised I would treat for epistylis  if the spots are  flat I would treat for ich the treatment for epistylis a combination of maracyn2 in food and ick X will also treat ich going off your picture I would be leaning towards epistylis 

Edited June 11 by Colu

[mikewxyz]

Thanks.  Just ordered the medication.

[mikewxyz]

I did the Maracyn2/ Focus cocktail treatment assuming it was epistylis with no effect.  I am on my 4th day of Ich-X treatment with little effect.  I netted one of the fish with multiple cysts and the cysts easily wipe off with my finger.  I've checked the list of usual tropical fish diseases and nothing matches the description of protruding white spherical cysts.  Not sure what to do next.

What is interesting to me is that the Lemon Tetras have zero incidence of this disease and they are almost equal in population to the Kerri Tetras.

 

Mike

[Colu]

8 hours ago, mikewxyz said:

I did the Maracyn2/ Focus cocktail treatment assuming it was epistylis with no effect.  I am on my 4th day of Ich-X treatment with little effect.  I netted one of the fish with multiple cysts and the cysts easily wipe off with my finger.  I've checked the list of usual tropical fish diseases and nothing matches the description of protruding white spherical cysts.  Not sure what to do next.

What is interesting to me is that the Lemon Tetras have zero incidence of this disease and they are almost equal in population to the Kerri Tetras.

 

Mike

What I would do is quarantine the two fish with spots keep treating with ick X and add aquarium salt 1 table spoon for 2 gallons 

[mikewxyz]

@Colu, Thanks for your response.  The problem is I don't have another tank for quarantine and I would estimate that 10 fish have this symptom.  Nevertheless, I think I will add some salt. 

[mikewxyz]

I just wanted to close the loop on this problem/ discussion.  The medication that ultimately resolved this white cyst issue was Seachem Paraguard.  Using Ich-X and salt helped but not enough.  The slime coat on the kerri tetras looked to be disappearing even as the size and number of cysts shrank.  The result was that the fish continued to be susceptible to reinfection.  The powerful Ich-X medication is targeted at ich, not whatever this disease is, so was not appropriate treatment.

The fish have back their shiny coats and I don't see any white cysts.

Mike