What the flip ? they got to GO !

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/6/2023 at 12:09 PM, KittenFishMom said:

When I bought my yoyo loaches they were labeled as dwarf chain loaches. I had them in a 10 gallon tank. They loved eating all snails I offered. I didn't keep them very long at all because they quickly got too big for the tank.  They were very active, and fun to watch, but I was looking for quieter fish to put in the 55 tank after I did the build, so I rehomed them.

I have been doing some research on loaches on 
everything I could about them & have it down to 3
that I would go with depending on if my fish store 
has them or not (zebra loach-golden zebra loach-
rosy loach, if they don't have any oh well.

[Lennie]

On 4/6/2023 at 8:02 PM, Flying fox 6523 said:

I have been doing some research on loaches on 
everything I could about them & have it down to 3
that I would go with depending on if my fish store 
has them or not (zebra loach-golden zebra loach-
rosy loach, if they don't have any oh well.

Not every loach eats snails, or at least eats them that well. I would highly recommend reading about people's experience regarding that 

Like for example, a rosy loach maybe can eat very small ones, if it ever does.

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/6/2023 at 1:00 PM, Lennie said:

@Flying fox 6523

I've found this! 

 

Some can get stunted growth & some could take over the tank 
so that's the chance some take, I'll see what my fish store has 
after I get back from my trip in May when I have more time.

On 4/6/2023 at 1:04 PM, Lennie said:

Not every loach eats snails, or at least eats them that well. I would highly recommend reading about people's experience regarding that 

Like for example, a rosy loach maybe can eat very small ones, if it ever does.

I'll make more of a decision after I get back from my trip the last part of May

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/6/2023 at 12:44 PM, lefty o said:

over feeding a tank will definitely help to increase the snail population.

Your right, I guess some where I must have gotten 
a little carried away with it not realizing it.

[Comradovich]

Here's something you might not have been thinking about... what time do you feed the tank? Your danios and mollies are probably active in the day, they're also top and mid-water feeders. Your corys may be nocturnal. If you're giving them pellet around the same time as the others, the pellets/wafers might be sitting in the tank all day. That leaves plenty of food for the bladder snails. You've got the leftovers from the danio/molly feeding in your water, plus you might have uneaten pellets or wafers because those fish aren't active in the tank just yet. It's like leaving out a snail buffet. If you have an auto feeder set up, you may want to switch one of the food types to a second auto-feeder, or just do manual feedings of that. I sort-of cheat this system by setting my autofeeders for right before lights out. The food may sit on the substrate for a bit before the nocturnal fish become active, but it isn't for long enough to attract many snails.

I wouldn't go entirely nuts on the bladder snails, though. They do perform quite a bit of cleanup. I keep those, ramshorns and MTS in my 20G specifically to keep the plants clean and the sand turned over. They do a really good job, even if the BBA is getting out of control because no one seems to eat that. Some bladder snails is fine, tons of bladder snails is not.

If you're considering a predator, then dwarf chain loaches are probably ideal. Whenever I deep clean the tank, I find empty shells near all the loaches' favorite hangouts. They'll chow down on ramshorns, MTS, and bladder snails. They have a preference for smaller snails, though. Mine leave the adult MTS and Ramshorns alone. They also haven't bothered my Nerite snail once he got around dime-sized. They did however, eat my assassin snails. Assassin snails have a "food coma" state they go into right after a big meal, and my DCLs decided this was an opportune time for an easy meal. Good rule of thumb on "food coma" vs. death is the old sniff test. If you don't want to barf, the snail is fine to be put back in the tank.

[Lennie]

On 4/6/2023 at 8:58 PM, Comradovich said:

Here's something you might not have been thinking about... what time do you feed the tank? Your danios and mollies are probably active in the day, they're also top and mid-water feeders. Your corys may be nocturnal. If you're giving them pellet around the same time as the others, the pellets/wafers might be sitting in the tank all day. That leaves plenty of food for the bladder snails. You've got the leftovers from the danio/molly feeding in your water, plus you might have uneaten pellets or wafers because those fish aren't active in the tank just yet. It's like leaving out a snail buffet. If you have an auto feeder set up, you may want to switch one of the food types to a second auto-feeder, or just do manual feedings of that. I sort-of cheat this system by setting my autofeeders for right before lights out. The food may sit on the substrate for a bit before the nocturnal fish become active, but it isn't for long enough to attract many snails.

I wouldn't go entirely nuts on the bladder snails, though. They do perform quite a bit of cleanup. I keep those, ramshorns and MTS in my 20G specifically to keep the plants clean and the sand turned over. They do a really good job, even if the BBA is getting out of control because no one seems to eat that. Some bladder snails is fine, tons of bladder snails is not.

If you're considering a predator, then dwarf chain loaches are probably ideal. Whenever I deep clean the tank, I find empty shells near all the loaches' favorite hangouts. They'll chow down on ramshorns, MTS, and bladder snails. They have a preference for smaller snails, though. Mine leave the adult MTS and Ramshorns alone. They also haven't bothered my Nerite snail once he got around dime-sized. They did however, eat my assassin snails. Assassin snails have a "food coma" state they go into right after a big meal, and my DCLs decided this was an opportune time for an easy meal. Good rule of thumb on "food coma" vs. death is the old sniff test. If you don't want to barf, the snail is fine to be put back in the tank.

My experience is the opposite when it comes to nocturnal fish feeding time and snail population. In my experience corys eat well during the day. I used to feed my pleco after the lights go off, but the problem is, most food ends up having lots of particles joining the water column. During day time, when you feed bottom dwellers, they eat the pellet on the bottom, and other fish eat the small particles floating around. During nighttime, those floating particles end up on somewhere ready to be snacked on for snails. 

I think corys are also active at night as well as daytime but they are not nocturnal eaters by any means.

Dwarf chain loaches are small in size. Previously I've read comments of people experiencing them not touching to snails at all meanwhile some reports they eat snails. It is probably the size of the snail as you mentioned, or MTS having trapdoor might also be a problem. Due to their small size, even if they eat snails, as you mentioned, they are unlikely to eat bigger sized snails.

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/6/2023 at 1:58 PM, Comradovich said:

Here's something you might not have been thinking about... what time do you feed the tank? Your danios and mollies are probably active in the day, they're also top and mid-water feeders. Your corys may be nocturnal. If you're giving them pellet around the same time as the others, the pellets/wafers might be sitting in the tank all day. That leaves plenty of food for the bladder snails. You've got the leftovers from the danio/molly feeding in your water, plus you might have uneaten pellets or wafers because those fish aren't active in the tank just yet. It's like leaving out a snail buffet. If you have an auto feeder set up, you may want to switch one of the food types to a second auto-feeder, or just do manual feedings of that. I sort-of cheat this system by setting my autofeeders for right before lights out. The food may sit on the substrate for a bit before the nocturnal fish become active, but it isn't for long enough to attract many snails.

I wouldn't go entirely nuts on the bladder snails, though. They do perform quite a bit of cleanup. I keep those, ramshorns and MTS in my 20G specifically to keep the plants clean and the sand turned over. They do a really good job, even if the BBA is getting out of control because no one seems to eat that. Some bladder snails is fine, tons of bladder snails is not.

If you're considering a predator, then dwarf chain loaches are probably ideal. Whenever I deep clean the tank, I find empty shells near all the loaches' favorite hangouts. They'll chow down on ramshorns, MTS, and bladder snails. They have a preference for smaller snails, though. Mine leave the adult MTS and Ramshorns alone. They also haven't bothered my Nerite snail once he got around dime-sized. They did however, eat my assassin snails. Assassin snails have a "food coma" state they go into right after a big meal, and my DCLs decided this was an opportune time for an easy meal. Good rule of thumb on "food coma" vs. death is the old sniff test. If you don't want to barf, the snail is fine to be put back in the tank.

"what time do you feed the tank?" I feed in the day time & I have very active Cory's through out the day
they never hardly stay in 1 place if their not chasing each other around their laying eggs somewhere &
if they aren't doing that their just swimming all over the tank I have a very active tank. 

My feed is crushed into a powder & I mix it all up with shrimp pellets, tropical flakes F D blood worms 
freeze dried baby shrimp, tubifex worms, & algae wafers & I give them just a small pinch every other day.
 

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/6/2023 at 2:06 PM, Lennie said:

My experience is the opposite when it comes to nocturnal fish feeding time and snail population. In my experience corys eat well during the day. I used to feed my pleco after the lights go off, but the problem is, most food ends up having lots of particles joining the water column. During day time, when you feed bottom dwellers, they eat the pellet on the bottom, and other fish eat the small particles floating around. During nighttime, those floating particles end up on somewhere ready to be snacked on for snails. 

I think corys are also active at night as well as daytime but they are not nocturnal eaters by any means.

Dwarf chain loaches are small in size. Previously I've read comments of people experiencing them not touching to snails at all meanwhile some reports they eat snails. It is probably the size of the snail as you mentioned, or MTS having trapdoor might also be a problem. Due to their small size, even if they eat snails, as you mentioned, they are unlikely to eat bigger sized snails.

Thank You for the response on that, the more info people put out about things like this 
the more others can learn from by others sharing their experience.

[Lennie]

On 4/7/2023 at 8:13 AM, Flying fox 6523 said:

Thank You for the response on that, the more info people put out about things like this 
the more others can learn from by others sharing their experience.

I agree!

but the thing is, If i were you, I would use your food mixture for your mid column feeders and let cories clean up the extra food particles that fall down. And feed cories with bottom dweller pellets instead.

I think this is better because first, danios are super fast eaters. So in order to make sure the food falls down for cories, especially something crushed like you said, you need to overfeed the tank all the time. A bottom wafer makes its way down directly, overfed crushed pellets will go everywhere and very likely benefit the snail population.

So If I were you, I would use the food mixture I have for my top/mid column feeders and only the amount they would eat in a couple minutes, and feed bottom dweller pellets/repashy/frozen food etc to cories instead of expecting them to get their share from the crushed food mixture you have

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/7/2023 at 3:17 AM, Lennie said:

I agree!

but the thing is, If i were you, I would use your food mixture for your mid column feeders and let cories clean up the extra food particles that fall down. And feed cories with bottom dweller pellets instead.

I think this is better because first, danios are super fast eaters. So in order to make sure the food falls down for cories, especially something crushed like you said, you need to overfeed the tank all the time. A bottom wafer makes its way down directly, overfed crushed pellets will go everywhere and very likely benefit the snail population.

So If I were you, I would use the food mixture I have for my top/mid column feeders and only the amount they would eat in a couple minutes, and feed bottom dweller pellets/repashy/frozen food etc to cories instead of expecting them to get their share from the crushed food mixture you have

Yea I feed a pinch of powder mix like mid morning & around mid evening 
I drop a few pellets for the Cory'ys being there's only 4 + 2 baby Cory'ys.

[Phoenixfishroom]

Lots of loaches eat snails, yo-yo get like 6” but zebra botia only get 3”  and rosy loaches only like 1.5”. Dwarf chain loaches and any botia are options too.

while assassins may not be the most helpful I do want to clarify that I did some research and can’t find any instances of them eating adult nerite or mystery snails. They have been known to hunt in packs (pretty cool honestly) for adult ramshorn and very young mystery snails though. Also, while in theory it is possible for them to overpopulate a tank it isn’t really a concern under most circumstances if there are fish in the tank. The eggs take 1-2 MONTHS to hatch and then the young are very tiny (like 1mm) and translucent live under the sand for as much as 6 months after that. My point being very few of these things make it to adulthood without themselves being eaten, either as an egg or a young tiny snail, or being sucked up when you vacuum.also they require a male and female so when you see them doing the deed, which you will, you can move one of them to a different tank to prevent it if you care to.

Edited April 8, 2023 by Phoenixfishroom

[Schuyler]

On 4/6/2023 at 7:09 AM, Tanked said:

Doesn't an over abundance of snails usually go hand in hand with an over abundance of snail food?

Yep.

Target the cause not the symptom. If there are millions of snails it means there's millions of snails worth of food leftover in the tank.

[Tanked]

On 4/8/2023 at 2:04 AM, Schuyler said:

Yep.

Target the cause not the symptom. If there are millions of snails it means there's millions of snails worth of food leftover in the tank.

Precisely!  My plant only tank might have up to two dozen bladder snails. they survive on decaying plants and algae.  The planted community tank might have a few more, but they must compete with the lightly fed fish population.

[Flying fox 6523]

On 4/8/2023 at 2:04 AM, Schuyler said:

Yep.

Target the cause not the symptom. If there are millions of snails it means there's millions of snails worth of food leftover in the tank.

Yea well I'm working on it, all in all I don't mind having snails but 
when it comes to that's all you see then yea it's time to do some 
thinning down where I get MOST OF THEM & it's working for me.