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Multis fighting brutally out of nowhere after 1.5 years. Need help.


Gannon
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Hello. I've had my multies for a very long time. I keep them in a fluval 15 gallon flex. Started with 6, 4 of which were adults. They made babies immediately and now there are 6 adults and 2 juveniles. Out of nowhere I've noticed them roguhed up and found out at night theyve been locking mouths and trashing against the substrate and around the tank. Its more brutal than about any fish fight I've seen. There are 3 that look the roughest so I assume they are the fighters. Quarantine tank is occupied so I can't move them into there. So I put one in a breeder box I had and the other in the empty part of the all in one filter back of the tank. Hopefully the fighting ceases between the rest, but what do I do if it doesn't, what do I do? What can I do to get the others to get along if/when I can introduce them back to the main space? I added some driftwood and other clutter today and it didnt make any difference. Why are they suddenly fighting after getting along for so long? I've never even heard of these guys doing this so I'm quite lost. Thanks for any help you guys can offer me. If I'm leaving out any important details, I am more than happy to provide it!

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It seems like ther are 4 aggressors. None of which are the juveniles or the very largest one. And it seems that they all have specific individuals they target or they just hate each other equally and im reading too far into the few spats I have time to witness. 

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@Gannon I’m stumped as well. I’ve seen the usual bickering, but nothing to that degree. Are you able to get them out of the 15 and put them in something a bit bigger? Seems like you’re a bit male heavy and that possibly could be the cause. I’ve never witnessed it for myself so that’s just my hunch. 

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On 3/6/2023 at 11:21 PM, mynameisnobody said:

@Gannon I’m stumped as well. I’ve seen the usual bickering, but nothing to that degree. Are you able to get them out of the 15 and put them in something a bit bigger? Seems like you’re a bit male heavy and that possibly could be the cause. I’ve never witnessed it for myself so that’s just my hunch. 

Nope no such luck. Not any room or the budget. I assumed maybe male heavy too, but why cause problems all the sudden? Doesn’t make sense.

Edited by Gannon
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@Gannon again this is just speculation, since you said it isn’t the largest ones specifically. That tells me that some of your young ones have a bit of spunk in them. Some of your heirs to the throne may be squabbling a bit more than usual because of the numbers. Honestly, I have no idea why this would happen suddenly. Silly question, have you tested your water? Worst case scenario, you do a quick parameter check. 

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On 3/6/2023 at 11:25 PM, mynameisnobody said:

@Gannon again this is just speculation, since you said it isn’t the largest ones specifically. That tells me that some of your young ones have a bit of spunk in them. Some of your heirs to the throne may be squabbling a bit more than usual because of the numbers. Honestly, I have no idea why this would happen suddenly. Silly question, have you tested your water? Worst case scenario, you do a quick parameter check. 

I did test the water! Not much of note. Slightly lower gh and ph but that’s been on purpose and gradual with each water change. 
 

also I should be more specific it’s not the smallest 3, or the largest 1. It’s the 4 in the middle. Oddly since I’ve removed those two heavily beat up ones, I haven’t seen any fighting yet. But it hasn’t been very long and I haven’t been able to observe too often. And by removed I mean one is placed in the breeder box and the other in the empty compartment of the back of the tank. Maybe they can heal up a bit and I can try reintroduction with a new scape or something like that?

The smallest of the four aggressors is trying to get at the one in the breeder box. Oddly that one wasn’t and still isn’t picking a fight with any others. Same goes for the other multi that seemingly was going after a specific individual, the one in the back of the tank now.

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The 4 aggressors aren’t even small, some are comparable to the biggest even if not the biggest. And 3 are very similar in size while the one harassing the guy in the breeder box is not as large.

also the guy in the breeder box was getting harassed by a different one before.

this is very confusing and all I’m sorry, just trying to offer all the info I have

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On 3/6/2023 at 6:09 PM, Gannon said:

Started with 6, 4 of which were adults. They made babies immediately and now there are 6 adults and 2 juveniles.

I assume male-female ratio changed? 

The tank in question is generally square, not a lot of floor space.  I would opt for giving more room with sight breaks.  This is similar to what Irene had to do as well recently to help alleviate some issues with hers.
 

Flex 15. 16 L X 15 W X 15 H IN
20 Long 30¼ x 12½ x 12¾
40 Breeder 36 3⁄16 x 18¼ x 16 15⁄16

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Totally agreed, had similar issues when had more males grow to adulthood and the full adults didn't make any place for them. Their fights are brutal, fish hanging around the surface in the corners before they get beaten to death.

What i did was take out the obvious fighting males, each to his temp 3l jar or a bucket or what not,. Did a water change and rescaped the tank to have visual barrier between clean defined but created by me territories. Large limestones, plants in pots, that sort of things... Then it is important to release all the males at once and watch them pick a territory. Remember each one should have a clump of shells, 5 per female is best.

Hope it helps.  Before i noticed i had three alpha males, they killed all my juveniles in territory battles and the fish stoped spawning

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On 3/7/2023 at 12:40 AM, nabokovfan87 said:

I assume male-female ratio changed? 

The tank in question is generally square, not a lot of floor space.  I would opt for giving more room with sight breaks.  This is similar to what Irene had to do as well recently to help alleviate some issues with hers.
 

Flex 15. 16 L X 15 W X 15 H IN
20 Long 30¼ x 12½ x 12¾
40 Breeder 36 3⁄16 x 18¼ x 16 15⁄16

Unfortunately don’t have the option of getting a bigger tank. It sucks but it’s not in the cards. 
 

also no change in male female ratio. The ones fighting have always been there and the 2 young ones have been there almost the entire time as well. A year plus.

On 3/7/2023 at 1:44 AM, beastie said:

Totally agreed, had similar issues when had more males grow to adulthood and the full adults didn't make any place for them. Their fights are brutal, fish hanging around the surface in the corners before they get beaten to death.

What i did was take out the obvious fighting males, each to his temp 3l jar or a bucket or what not,. Did a water change and rescaped the tank to have visual barrier between clean defined but created by me territories. Large limestones, plants in pots, that sort of things... Then it is important to release all the males at once and watch them pick a territory. Remember each one should have a clump of shells, 5 per female is best.

Hope it helps.  Before i noticed i had three alpha males, they killed all my juveniles in territory battles and the fish stoped spawning

This is the plan, hope it works. These guys were so easy, fun, and stress free for so long this is a bit heartbreaking

Edited by Gannon
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