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Are dwarf cichlids happy alone?


Lennie
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On 1/28/2023 at 7:14 PM, jwcarlson said:

What about hongsloi?

Regarding previous reply wondering where I'd seen conflicting information, forums, I guess.  And I'm fully aware you've got to sort everything out and find good information.  In a lot of cases it seems pretty evenly split.  So at that point I just figure experiences might vary wildly depending on individual specimens, local water, tank setup, etc.  And I'm totally OK with that.

My understanding is that they are a bit closer to pair forming - not really strong pair but the female won't attack the male when she has frys and he'll help out a bit and won't eat them. I had them for a bit - actually 4 in a 29 - they are largish fish and you really don't want much more than a pair in a tank that size (i had purchased them when they were 1/4 an inch and didn't know their sexes until they were larger). You might have success with 2 females but it is not guaranteed. 2 males was definitely problematic in a tank that size. They are not harem breeders in the sense of male/female aggression cycle.

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On 1/29/2023 at 3:14 AM, anewbie said:

My understanding is that they are a bit closer to pair forming - not really strong pair but the female won't attack the male when she has frys and he'll help out a bit and won't eat them. I had them for a bit - actually 4 in a 29 - they are largish fish and you really don't want much more than a pair in a tank that size (i had purchased them when they were 1/4 an inch and didn't know their sexes until they were larger). You might have success with 2 females but it is not guaranteed. 2 males was definitely problematic in a tank that size. They are not harem breeders in the sense of male/female aggression cycle.

I bought three pairs, QT and wormed them in a 55 with good divisions lots of caves.  No issue.  Of course one pair spawned.  Male was helping defend, but all aggression was very minor.  He was still dancing for the other ladies.  Even the female was very nice keeping everyone away.  Honestly more aggressive towards us if we were standing there.  They're in my liquid rock tap water so no shot of hatching.  She spit them all out of the cave in a couple days.  

Got last levamisole treatment in and moved spawning pair to their 29 and divided the 55.  Which was the plan all along.  When I split the 55 I got the wrong females with their males quite obviously.  Figured that out in 24 hours and when I swapped them the females immediately started displaying for their males.  It was pretty interesting, actually.  

I have RO set up now and can start cutting it in. But want to see if the spawning was total luck or if they will at least spawn in my tap water. 

Edited by jwcarlson
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On 1/29/2023 at 8:28 AM, jwcarlson said:

I bought three pairs, QT and wormed them in a 55 with good divisions lots of caves.  No issue.  Of course one pair spawned.  Male was helping defend, but all aggression was very minor.  He was still dancing for the other ladies.  Even the female was very nice keeping everyone away.  Honestly more aggressive towards us if we were standing there.  They're in my liquid rock tap water so no shot of hatching.  She spit them all out of the cave in a couple days.  

Got last levamisole treatment in and moved spawning pair to their 29 and divided the 55.  Which was the plan all along.  When I split the 55 I got the wrong females with their males quite obviously.  Figured that out in 24 hours and when I swapped them the females immediately started displaying for their males.  It was pretty interesting, actually.  

I have RO set up now and can start cutting it in. But want to see if the spawning was total luck or if they will at least spawn in my tap water. 

In my 29 the smaller male was hounded  - but the other 3 got alone fine. If you see one of the males being pushed to the top then you know the tank is too small for him (with the other males) and best to remove him. The 'hounding' won't directly kill the fish but it can lead to bloat and eventual death over long periods. They are also generally speaking a very hearty species. You should expect them to live 2 to 5 years depending on a number of factors.

 

Btw with most dwarf cichild including most species (there are few exceptions) apistogramma the female always picks the mate whether it be a harem breeder or pair forming. I forget the name of the species but in another forum when we were talking about more interesting species it was mentioned that a specific species the male did the picking (I can try to find it if you care but it was not one readily available).

Edited by anewbie
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None of the males or females have any access to anyone but their partner now.  I have another 29 I could move one pair from the 55 and set up something a little more community like in the 55.  We'll see what happens.  I am enjoying watching them display, very entertaining. 

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On 1/29/2023 at 9:02 AM, jwcarlson said:

None of the males or females have any access to anyone but their partner now.  I have another 29 I could move one pair from the 55 and set up something a little more community like in the 55.  We'll see what happens.  I am enjoying watching them display, very entertaining. 

Can you post pictures of your males 🙂

 

Good luck and start hatching that bbs - it usually takes about a day for the free swimming frys to eat their egg sacks but then they will be hungry. Females usually do an excellent job of moving them around the entire aquarium looking for food.

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On 1/29/2023 at 9:06 AM, anewbie said:

Can you post pictures of your males 🙂

 

Good luck and start hatching that bbs - it usually takes about a day for the free swimming frys to eat their egg sacks but then they will be hungry. Females usually do an excellent job of moving them around the entire aquarium looking for food.

Here's best looking male.  One more similar, the other is starting to color up.  Don't have pics of them but can try later.  Next best in background of second pic.  And the female in last obviously. 20230127_165549.jpg.41957241d4e5d1c9b5fc8f612a95ffaf.jpg20230118_193508.jpg.52294f64700cb642fe58e79f49226aed.jpg20230122_170334.jpg.10c32ca6b838c9169eb40e6f6fbc1277.jpg

 

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On 1/29/2023 at 9:11 AM, jwcarlson said:

Here's best looking male.  One more similar, the other is starting to color up.  Don't have pics of them but can try later.  Next best in background of second pic.  And the female in last obviously. 20230127_165549.jpg.41957241d4e5d1c9b5fc8f612a95ffaf.jpg20230118_193508.jpg.52294f64700cb642fe58e79f49226aed.jpg20230122_170334.jpg.10c32ca6b838c9169eb40e6f6fbc1277.jpg

 

Nice pair - let me know how the ro water works out - also be sure to accliminate them to it.. and you need to either add a lot of mulim or some kh to make it stable.

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On 1/29/2023 at 2:53 PM, anewbie said:

Nice pair - let me know how the ro water works out - also be sure to accliminate them to it.. and you need to either add a lot of mulim or some kh to make it stable.

My tap water is hard as a rock, so I'm going to do some sort of mix.  Haven't done any reading regarding how to intro it.  Though Ted's Fish Room said he does 50% changes with RO once a week for his apistos, though not sure if that's indefinite or what.  

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On 1/29/2023 at 2:53 PM, anewbie said:

Nice pair - let me know how the ro water works out - also be sure to accliminate them to it.. and you need to either add a lot of mulim or some kh to make it stable.

I'm entering a world in which I have never operated and that's tank water that doesn't have absolute gobs of KH.

How does mulm help stabilize a tank?  I'm not really planning on cleaning out mulm unless it gets excessive, just wondering how that helps stabilize pH.

We're departing the original intent of the thread here, so I'll snip the rest of my reply.  I need to start a journal and gather my thoughts on this whole apisto project. 😄

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On 1/30/2023 at 1:30 PM, jwcarlson said:

I'm entering a world in which I have never operated and that's tank water that doesn't have absolute gobs of KH.

How does mulm help stabilize a tank?  I'm not really planning on cleaning out mulm unless it gets excessive, just wondering how that helps stabilize pH.

We're departing the original intent of the thread here, so I'll snip the rest of my reply.  I need to start a journal and gather my thoughts on this whole apisto project. 😄

I believe that mulm help stabilize and lower ph if kh is near 0 by absorbing ions but it has less of an effect in this regards if kh is higher (2 or 3); it also can provide hiding places for fishes (if leaves) and depending on leaf type can have other benefits. 

Hongsloi don't require super low values if tank raised - i'd shoot for a tds of around 80 and see if that works - if it doesn't then lower it a little. They will lay eggs but they won't fertilize if the water is too hard. I'd also try for a kh  of around 3 which is fairly stable but should be more than adequate for tank raised Hongsloi - wild caught can be a bit more delicate and require softer water depending on catch location.

 

Edited by anewbie
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